Chinese GP 2010 - Shanghai

[Giblet]

A lesson from Segendum about how to attack the poster, and not the post:

"You're very deluded I'm afraid."

"It's utter brain damage, and you know it."

"You people are nuts. Seriously."

"As you well know, this is meaningless bullshit."

"You clearly have no idea what you're talking about."

These are from the last two pages, need I go further back?

Wind in your neck Seg, please. Your tone and attitude is not welcome or needed, and is completely against what you have been warned about. Please learn to discuss things like an adult, and relax a bit for the good of the forum.

This isn't a school yard, and if it was, recess is over.

[Paul Oz]

Guys, accusing others of "mental illness" just because they have a dissenting view is out of order. Its the sort of thing Hitler/Stalin/Mao did.

Aye.... some peeps get a little worked up on here eh.....

[PlatinumZealot]

How do you explain this segedunum? Look at all the wheel guns to the left... DANGEROUS Move by Vettel!

[komninosm]

Dear everyone,

Since this is a technical forum, how about looking at the regs and letting us know which clauses were infringed today?

You see I've read them a few times and I'm struggling to identify all those illegal activities that everyone is talking about. Here's a starter to get you going ....

F1 Sporting Regulations - 10 February 2010

http://www.fia.com/sport/Regulations/f1regs.html

16) INCIDENTS
16.1 "Incident" means any occurrence or series of occurrences involving one or more drivers, or any action by any driver, which is reported to the stewards by the race director (or noted by the stewards and referred to the race director for investigation) which :

- necessitated the suspension of a race under Article 41 ;
- constituted a breach of these Sporting Regulations or the Code ;
- caused a false start by one or more cars ;
- caused a collision ;
- forced a driver off the track ;
- illegitimately prevented a legitimate overtaking manoeuvre by a driver ;

Vettel did:
- forced a driver off the track ;

EDIT: I was talking about the pits, but he was the root cause for Webber's outing too.

[ringo]

Wrong.

It is the race track, you can pass there.

Wrong. There are rules about crossing the white lines on pit lane entry and exit, and we've seen drivers penalised certainly on the exit. No amount of mind bending or mental gymnastics is going to make what Hamilton or Alonso did right or legal. The white lines are there to denote the boundaries of what you're allowed to drive in.

As for why these rules aren't being enforced, well, that's another story.

Wrong.

All 4 wheels, yes. Not just two. That is only the pit exit white line you might be thinking about.

Please quote the rule so I don't have to, since you are the one in disagreement. then I will concede, no problem.

He will continue to dodge the regulations. One other thing i notice as well is that they say Vettel was infront and could do what he pleases, but there is no such rule as well.
Nothing in the rules about having the right to push a driver off becuase you are in front and want all 3 car widths of road to yourself.
The Vettel infront thing is false, pit lane limiter therefore no threat of being overtaken, no reason to bully any driver beside, or slightly behind.

Imagine if Hamliton did what Vettel did?

Oh lordy! =D> CHEATER!!! He tried to ram Vettel head on into the pits so anthony hamilton could pop out of the pits and cut his tyres when no one is looking!
cheating bastards!!!

[komninosm]

If they were released at the same time then there would not be any problem as the Red Bull pit is a couple garages before McLaren. If they were released at the same time the Vettel would not have been alongside Hamilton unless Vettel had a tele-porter. Can you confirm if they had this as I did not see one but maybe the camera angle on the BBC coverage didn't show it all that well.

Did you not see the slow motion analysis of the release? Both lollipops were raised a split second apart. Vet Wasnt actual in the pit lane, or actually moving, when hams lollipop was raised. He was alongside because of hams wheelspin iif you were watching the same race as me....??

No, Andrew is right. You got it all wrong. The towers clearly fell at free fall speed and it was an inside job.

[Richard]

he pushed Webbo off track, no?

No. Racing incident - the track was too crowded for all the cars in one place. Someone had to go offline or there would be a crash. We see that at every race at the start, and often when there are several cars abreast.

[komninosm]

That was just one moment, LH could have pulled out earlier or after. He did not do it until the last moment; he drove over the blue area all the way

Why should Lewis pull out earlier? He was side by side with V like it has happened in previous years and the cars were fine. Only the idiot Vettel has ever tried to crash another car in the pits for this. And I used to like him.

[andrew]

OMFG! You watch that clip and you don't see what happens?! Are you blind? Blinded by bias probably.
Thanks for providing evidence of Vettel swerving and putting his rear wheel between the Mclaren wheels [sec 8+]. Watch it carefully. I really liked Vettel, but this year he sucks and this isn't the only bad thing he's done.
How can they have been released at the same time?! Didn't we already answer that countless times? Vettel was released 0.2 seconds earlier (that still makes McLaren lollipop man's actions a safe release) and Ham accelerated slowly/poorly because he had wheel spin while Vettel made a very good start. Are you a conspiracy theorist or something? Free fall speed ring a bell for you?

PS: The FFS was because it was already answered.

Again with the insults. If that is going to be the basis of your arguement with everyone then there is clearly no point having any discussion on this with you. But in one last attempt, here goes...

Firstly, no one has denied Vettels moving over if you would take the time to READ what has already been writen.

Lets stick to the FACTS: Vettel was released FIRST. Vettel was ahead all along the pit. The driver behind should have given way.

Conspiracy theorist? No. But I know what you are.

[Richard]

No, Andrew is right. You got it all wrong. The towers clearly fell at free fall speed and it was an inside job.

It was Mossad, CIA & Prince Phillip. They had stooges in the pit crew who lowered the pressure in the tyres on Vettel's right so his car swerved into Hamilton.

They did it to Saint Diana in '97, and now they're doing to Saint Lewis.

[komninosm]

This video is thesort of thing I meant about seeing who's got the biggest balls, and spectators saying "OMFG how do they do that ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7oYjCBooeDI

I already linked that video to show people that Vettel was being an a$$, but it won't convince the Ham-haters...

How was Vettel being an a$$?? Hamilton (or any other driver in that position) should surely slow and let the other car go ahead and he was in a position to cause a fairly massive accident. Lucky there were not anyother pitstops on the go.

And kindly refrain from purile insults and snide remarks and keep what is quite a good discussion civil. If you care to read the posts rather than focus on the fact that it is your hero that is the centre of yet another hoo-haa, you'll see that this is not a "have a go at Hamilton session". If the cars were the other way round or if it involved two completely different drivers, then the discussion would likely be the same.

This is nothing to do with Hamilton hating or anything childish like that.

I'm not a Hamilton fan. I'm barely a McLaren fan that is true. Vettel was an a$$ because he nearly caused a crash in pits with swerving.
If the cars were the other way around you would surely be blaming Hamilton again for what we're blaming Vettel for, but then you'd be right and we'd not say otherwise and keep on trolling.

[Just_a_fan]

Good race by Button and a deserved win.

So now lets see what Hamilton did in this race:

He went the wrong way on the race track.
He overtook Vettel in the pitlane.
He raced Vetel in the pitlane.
Did I miss any thing?

So how the hell did he only get a slap on the wrists?! I suspect that the former long term McLaren test driver, Alex Wurz is not impartial. Alonso only got a slap on the wrists for his move on Massa in the pitlane. Vettel got a slap on the wrists also, which to be fair was correct as his actions can be put down to red mist. Hamilton and Alonsos antics were inexcusable.

This stupid scheme of former race drivers being race stewards is really not working which is exactly what I thought when I heard about it.

Do you want to be entertained or just watch them play follow my leader?

I think that depends on whether his favoured driver is in the lead or not...

[andartop]

And to think that we still haven't heard a very specific fellow forum member's opinion on this incident yet!!!

Let's summarize then: Seb and Hamster were side by side going into the pit entry, Hamster had the right of way as he was on the correct line for pitting in, which was the inside of the hairpin (!!!), so Seb had to lift off to avoid crashing into him, they pitted, were released together but as Hammy spinned his wheels ended up side by side, bad boy Seb forced him to cruise on the blue line leaving him no space, crossing other teams' pit areas, almost collecting several wires, mechanics and the laundry, and then Hammy as a very reasonable driver that he is decided to back out right before the exit to avoid close contact with the barrier or Seb. Correct?

Well, if that was the case, why was Lewis reprimanded by the stewards???

For spinning his wheels?

Keep up the debate and the insults guys, maybe after posting the same thing for a hundred times you will convince all the others you are right!

[Giblet]

Wurz et al. is not sitting on a throne with a scepter ruling the race. He is but one steward, who has an equal amount of input, and then they all discuss and come to an agreement.

If the other stewards thought he was favoring a Macca driver, he would be called out.

[komninosm]

Dear everyone,

Since this is a technical forum, how about looking at the regs and letting us know which clauses were infringed today?

You see I've read them a few times and I'm struggling to identify all those illegal activities that everyone is talking about. Here's a starter to get you going ....

F1 Sporting Regulations - 10 February 2010

http://www.fia.com/sport/Regulations/f1regs.html

16) INCIDENTS
16.1 "Incident" means any occurrence or series of occurrences involving one or more drivers, or any action by any driver, which is reported to the stewards by the race director (or noted by the stewards and referred to the race director for investigation) which :

- necessitated the suspension of a race under Article 41 ;
- constituted a breach of these Sporting Regulations or the Code ;
- caused a false start by one or more cars ;
- caused a collision ;
- forced a driver off the track ;
- illegitimately prevented a legitimate overtaking manoeuvre by a driver ;

to begin with, he pushed Webbo off track, no?

Vettel caused that too... :^o