Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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ell66
ell66
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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marcush. wrote:Vettel really is driving immaculate at this time and luck comes to those who work hard.
I feel for Button because the SC came really at the wrong time for him ...No way sVettel would have stood the pressure till the end on those tyres and in the Battle with alonso those two would have ruined their tyres no question and he would have come home first.
Still an entertaining race.
nooo alonso would have won the race. no way wld jenson get past him.
espeically because jenson could never get that close when drivin behind for the whole race.

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Shrieker
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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Apart from all the controversy...

I think this was one of the most complete motorsport races I've seen in recent times. There was lots of action, aggression, crashes, drama, strategy and what not. Not a sleepfest by any means, as some had anticipated.


I want to add something for Lewis. The onboard shots of him following other cars through the streets of monaco as if he was glued to the gearbox of the guy in front, lap in, lap out. It was a sight to behold. It really shows why he is one of the best. I think the best drivers are Alonso, Vettel, Rosberg and Hamilton (in no particular order) and all have different qualities that make each driver one of the best. I'm not sure the others possess this ability to drive in such close proximity for such a long period. It was as if he was on a rampage. ıt (for me) really made this race even more special.

Not to even mention the crazy overtake attempts.
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Gaara
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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Hamilton's Incidents from an Onboard Camera :

http://www.f1arab.com/2011/05/29/hamilt ... e-penalty/

Formula None
Formula None
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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Shrieker wrote: I want to add something for Lewis. The onboard shots of him following other cars through the streets of monaco as if he was glued to the gearbox of the guy in front, lap in, lap out. It was a sight to behold. It really shows why he is one of the best.
Inability to pass is not a sign of greatness. By that logic, how would you measure Alonso's performance at Monaco last year? P-24 to P-6.

People, including Lewis, need to admit he had a bad race & quali and get over it. There's the whole rest of the season & many more attempts at a Monaco win left in his career.

andartop
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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HAM vs SCHU was different, as in the first overtake SCHU really caught HAM asleep, and HAM (wisely) conceded, and in the second SCHU was lapping 3 seconds slower than the leaders, had a "Trulli train" behind him, and had just let the world know his rear tires were cooked. He then went on to get overtaken by a Williams (!), and dived straight into the pits (to prove the point).

HAM vs MAS and HAM vs MAL were both in my eyes (and the race stewards') clearly cases of the "art of Sato", aka "go for a space that really isn't there" followed by the (un)avoidable drama.

I guess we have to accept that either all the race stewards in the world really dislike Lewis, or that Lewis is prone to mistakes when he gets frustrated.

Given:
a) The number of times he got away with it with just a "reprimand" (which I really have a hard time remembering when it was last used in F1 before Lewis started racing),
b) The number of times he simply ended up in the grass or the barriers when there was no competitors' car to bounce off,
c) The fact he is a truly dedicated racer never prepared to give up and just accept a low point scoring position,

I tend to believe he is kinda prone to mistakes when he gets frustrated.

Surely, if one is racing at that level and pushing as hard as Lewis does, mistakes come easier.

And I'd have a driver like him in my team any day over someone like, say, Massa, who is still very prone to mistakes even when he's cruising at the back..!

But when you're a kamikaze you have to accept the kamikaze fate. The art of Sato a good Gran Turismo driver makes, but in real life may bring a lot of tears..
The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. H.P.Lovecraft

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Shrieker
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sO9aDoTRs0[/youtube]


Look at Webber's and the Torro Rosso's lines into Loews. That's the line which every driver normally takes.

Then look at Massa. He clearly changes his line and turns in early with no other intention than squeezing. He is entitled to defend yes, but not in a manner in which it's sure to cause contact.

Hamilton has put his front wheel past Massa's rear and is giving Massa three options.

1- Defend properly
2- Yield
3- Defend in a dirty manner which will cause collision

After putting his front wheel ahead of Massa's rear, there is no turning back for Hamilton and he has placed his trust in Massa that he'll compete in a fair manner. So the blame for collision is not Hamilton's. Yet he was penalized for "causing an avoidable collision".

The Stewards were WRONG.

------------------
andrew get out. You, YOURSELF claimed that the stewards were wrong for penalising Di Resta, but after Hamilton's incident with Massa you claimed just the opposite by saying "if Di Resta is penalised, then surely Lewis should be too".

If we go by that LOGIC of YOURS, if Di Resta's penalty is wrong, then surely the penalty handed to Lewis is wrong too.

You contradict with yourself and will go to any lengts to derogate one certain driver to serve your ego.
Last edited by Shrieker on 29 May 2011, 21:34, edited 5 times in total.
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andrew
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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andrew
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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Shrieker wrote:Look at Webber's and the Torro Rosso's lines into Loews. That's the line which every driver normally takes.

Then look at Massa. He clearly changes his line and turns in early with no other intention than squeezing. He is entitled to defend yes, but not in a manner in which it's sure to cause contact.
Try comparing Massas line with the Renault and Torro Rosso ahead. If anything, Webbers line was a bit odd compared to Massa, the renault and the Torro Rosso. In fact there is absolutely nothing wrong in what Massa did. He did not change line and took a normal line only to be smacked by hamilton making a desperate lunge. Looking at that footage, Hamilton looked like he would have run wide without using Massa as a brake.

hardingfv32
hardingfv32
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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I missed the race. What was the logic for everyone being allowed to change tires during the red flag?

Brian

i70q7m7ghw
i70q7m7ghw
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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Looking at the footage, there wasn't alot Lewis could do once he was commited to the move in to Loews. That one was clearly his mistake. However, I don't think the damage to Massa's car was the reason he crashed out in the tunnel, it was quite clear he just got out on the marbles. Massa was most likely just bleating as he understandably wasn't happy with Hamilton's move in to the hairpin.

The Maldonado incident was marginal. I think an experienced driver probably would have given Lewis more room, he was alongside all the way in to the braking zone, it's not like he out braked Maldonado here, the door was clearly left open. The error on Lewis's part may have been not giving an error prone rookie clearance, but from behind he might have thought it was Rubens? or perhaps it just expected Maldonado would have more sense.

Also, anyone pick up on the double move to defend by Maldonado there?

andrew
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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Diesel wrote:Also, anyone pick up on the double move to defend by Maldonado there?
Nope, can't say that I did.

i70q7m7ghw
i70q7m7ghw
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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andrew wrote:
Diesel wrote:Also, anyone pick up on the double move to defend by Maldonado there?
Nope, can't say that I did.
Watch the replay, he goes left out to the wall, then as Lewis comes to cut back to the right, Maldonado starts to move to the right again positioning in the middle of the track.

andrew
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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Diesel wrote:Watch the replay, he goes left out to the wall, then as Lewis comes to cut back to the right, Maldonado starts to move to the right again positioning in the middle of the track.
Just watched it and I don't see anything wrong. Maldonado takes the regular line into turn 1 and Hamilton makes a desperate lunge up the inside.

i70q7m7ghw
i70q7m7ghw
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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andrew wrote:
Diesel wrote:Watch the replay, he goes left out to the wall, then as Lewis comes to cut back to the right, Maldonado starts to move to the right again positioning in the middle of the track.
Just watched it and I don't see anything wrong. Maldonado takes the regular line into turn 1 and Hamilton makes a desperate lunge up the inside.
*shrugs* I guess you see what you want to see. It didn't look like a lunge to me, the move was made before the braking zone, but as you say Maldonado took the regular line ignoring the fact Hamilton was there.

Of course, if you are a Maldonado fan you will think this is bashing as no one like to hear the truth when it goes against their own beliefs.

andartop
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Re: Monaco GP 2011 - Monte Carlo

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Massa's take on this:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/91860

From the video, just follow Lewis's line all the way to the exit of the corner, which was also "assisted" by bouncing off Massa. Given they go in the hairpin and apply full lock, it is apparent that Lewis would have crashed into Massa no matter what Massa did, as there would be no space left for him, unless Massa came to a full stop.

The only way this crash could have been avoided would have been if Lewis had not dived in a non existing space...
The most merciful thing in the world, I think, is the inability of the human mind to correlate all its contents. H.P.Lovecraft