USF1 -- F1's All-American Challenger

[modbaraban]

I love this forum. One can make an incredibly ridiculous remark about a fake keyboard, then some one else would photoshop the IKEA AD and people will end up arguing about Mac vs. PC processing power. =D>

[Pup]

I love this forum. One can make an incredibly ridiculous remark about a fake keyboard, then some one else would photoshop the IKEA AD and people will end up arguing about Mac vs. PC processing power. =D>

True.

Let's continue, shall we?

To reach that processing power, you'd need well in excess of 300 mac pros.

And to match BMW's new Albert 3 you'd need over 2,000 Mac Pros or Xserves.

So I doubt they have that, or we'd surely have gotten a picture. But, just to be pedantic about the whole deal, that's not necessarily a Mac Pro setup shown there (though likely it is) - they could be running a small, under-the-desk cluster like this.

[xpensive]

The article which triggered the computer debate was actually written by Windsor himself and didn't really show much more than an empty workshop with few signs of an F1 team scrambling to finish their 2010 car.

Of course I don't doubt their xistance or sincerity, but I can't figure out why they elect to present themselves in this fashion?
Interesting however, is the change from a US national team to a "melting-pot", including Europeans and even Welshmen.

[jddh1]

Look, we've said it before, I think they'll get the car ready, as will Campos, Manor and the lot.

My only concern is that we will have cars that are less than 2 seconds separated by each other(current teams) and new teams' cars that could possibly be as slower as 7 seconds per lap.

[tarzoon]

USF1 are entering the game at a point where resources are going to be restricted very soon. So having a top of the line wind tunnel in the area on a hired basis should be very much ok for them. They will not set the fastest times in 2010 anyway. So it doesn't matter that the top teams still enjoy much bigger resources in CFD and tunnel work for one year. By the time they are up to speed they have a pretty good chance to run as a middle of the grid team in 2011 if they do a good job.

Very true. It's less of a gamble spending money in some (relatively) expensive computer hardware than in plans to build a crazy wind tunnel when there are quite a few available.

How good that job will be is difficult to say at the moment.

So the other option is to bluff, get some sponsors in and see how it goes from there!

My only concern is that we will have cars that are less than 2 seconds separated by each other(current teams) and new teams' cars that could possibly be as slower as 7 seconds per lap.

7 seconds in a time when rules are frozen sounds like a lot!

So I doubt they have that, or we'd surely have gotten a picture. But, just to be pedantic about the whole deal, that's not necessarily a Mac Pro setup shown there (though likely it is) - they could be running a small, under-the-desk cluster like this.

No need, really. Maybe he's actually working in the crappiest computer and accessing the cluster in the other room. Big screen is essential for CAD, anyway.

With the $10m+ savings of a wind tunnel you could get a serious processing power. Potentiall a top10 supercomputer. About the models, they are as good as anything else: nothing can replace tests on track.

I understand their point, and banks are not the best example of simulation models - as someone said, they weren't necessarily developed by the most intelligent, but by the money-driven guy with a superior that doesn't have a clue about what's going on.

[Pup]

With the $10m+ savings of a wind tunnel you could get a serious processing power.

Ahh, but a wind tunnel doesn't become obsolete, at least not nearly so quickly. BMW replaced their Albert cluster every two years, at a cost of around $10M each time. You'd also have to consider the cost of running each, which in both cases is considerable.

I don't doubt that CFD will one day make wind tunnels obsolete, but I'm not convinced we're there yet. Maybe Manor will prove me wrong.

Of course, with CFD, there's not just the horsepower to consider, but also the expertise of those manipulating and interpreting the data. In that respect, I imagine the existing teams have a considerable advantage over the new kids.

At the end of the day, we're looking at young teams, on tight time constraints, using inferior equipment, designing and building something most have them have never done before. It's a recipe for disaster - but also for invention.

It will be interesting, to say the least.

[modbaraban]

...Europeans and even Welshmen.

Oh noes! A real Welshman! I was wondering if someone else would notice that It sounded almost as exotic as having a Martian in their staff.

[Professor]

How many of you have seen pics of the FI shop at Silverstone? And it is 20 years old. Or have you just seen pics of Macca's Technology park? Big difference guys.

But your Uni Student levels of arrogance is very interesting, in a sort of sociopathological way.

Thanks for the grins.

[Ray]

What's all this talk about not having a windtunnel? I thought they were in Charoltte for many reasons, the biggest being that they'll have access to the Windshear windtunnel. Or is that not true?

[Mr Alcatraz]

What's all this talk about not having a windtunnel? I thought they were in Charoltte for many reasons, the biggest being that they'll have access to the Windshear windtunnel. Or is that not true?

That was my understanding as well!

[xpensive]

What's all this talk about not having a windtunnel? I thought they were in Charoltte for many reasons, the biggest being that they'll have access to the Windshear windtunnel. Or is that not true?

That was my understanding as well!

Not only that, it was also said that Anderson had been Technical Director for the design and build of the Windshear tunnel, just as his web-CV claimed him to have been Technical Director for just about everyhing including the Ligier F1 team!

Until Jacobs Engineering, who built the tunnel, had a press release xplaining that he had only been a consultant.

[WhiteBlue]

I love this forum. One can make an incredibly ridiculous remark about a fake keyboard, then some one else would photoshop the IKEA AD and people will end up arguing about Mac vs. PC processing power. =D>

I bet you had your laugh about that. Only that nobody argues about Mac vs PC processing power. With the Mac being made from PC parts that would have been pretty silly anyway. The argument was about the usefullness of workstations vs huge clustered super computers in F1 day to day R&D. Given the name of their latest partner I would think that USF1 will not easily run out of raw computing power. This would be close to suggesting the NSA gave up reading our email for lack of floor space to put computers.

If one would argue based on machine appearance used in that machine shop I would understand that. The American sheet metal design always looks a bit like a product from an African blacksmith's shop of the sixties. European teams would probably have different machines in most cases given a choice.

[WhiteBlue]

What's all this talk about not having a windtunnel? I thought they were in Charoltte for many reasons, the biggest being that they'll have access to the Windshear windtunnel. Or is that not true?

That was my understanding as well!

Not only that, it was also said that Anderson had been Technical Director for the design and build of the Windshear tunnel, just as his web-CV claimed him to have been Technical Director for just about everyhing including the Ligier F1 team!

Until Jacobs Engineering, who built the tunnel, had a press release xplaining that he had only been a consultant.

Often crucial know how is brought to you by consultants. Just think about Stepney for McLaren in 2007.

[xpensive]

At the end of the day, we're looking at young teams, on tight time constraints, using inferior equipment, designing and building something most have them have never done before. It's a recipe for disaster - but also for invention.

It will be interesting, to say the least.

I was trying to recall the latest team entering F1 from scratch and I can only come up with Toyota, on a GUSD budget?

Before that we had the late 80s/early 90s kit-car teams coming and going, but that was another lifetime alltogether.

[WhiteBlue]

At the end of the day, we're looking at young teams, on tight time constraints, using inferior equipment, designing and building something most have them have never done before. It's a recipe for disaster - but also for invention.

It will be interesting, to say the least.

I was trying to recall the latest team entering F1 from scratch and I can only come up with Toyota, on a GUSD budget?

Before that we had the late 80s/early 90s kit-car teams coming and going, but that was another lifetime alltogether.

Jordan was doing a pretty good job in 1991 as a new entrant coming from F3000 until the gazillion dollar game by the automotive guys stopped him. He had just 3 or 4 years to establish himself before the Ronster found the Stuttgart gold mine and took it out of Peter Sauber's hands. When he reached his zenith in 1999 F1 had been changed forever by big business.