2021 Russian Grand Prix - Sochi, Sep 24 - 26

[El Scorchio]

I thought it was assigned after qualifying? So a car that qualified fifth for example would start 19th and a car that qualified sixth would start 20th after penalties were applied, if both changed their engines.

[SiLo]

What about the grid penalty Max got from Monza? I don't like that if you get a penalty, you can basically circumvent the punishment by taking an engine swap that in the long run, is beneficial to you.

[MV8]

What about the grid penalty Max got from Monza? I don't like that if you get a penalty, you can basically circumvent the punishment by taking an engine swap that in the long run, is beneficial to you.

FIA should make the 20+3 if you do that, the penalty you "avoid" should be set at the next GP imo.

[SiLo]

Would be interesting to see what they did if you had to serve every single grid drop. So if you qualify 10th and get a 20 place grid drop, you drop 10, and then still have to serve 10 places of the 20 at the next race.

[bonjon1979]

What about the grid penalty Max got from Monza? I don't like that if you get a penalty, you can basically circumvent the punishment by taking an engine swap that in the long run, is beneficial to you.

It depends if anyone else is taking engine penalties. If there are others who take them, who would be behind Max on the grid. They'll now get put in front. I think he only avoids being penalised if he's the only one taking a new engine.

[El Scorchio]

I wonder if a couple more declare intentions to take a new engine, then Hamilton might also do the same if it can wind up in a situation where he can possibly start 16 or 17 with Verstappen likely at 20 due to the additional penalty. It becomes quite intriguing.

[RedNEO]

What about the grid penalty Max got from Monza? I don't like that if you get a penalty, you can basically circumvent the punishment by taking an engine swap that in the long run, is beneficial to you.

Is it really beneficial when he lost an engine and 25 points because someone crashed into him? I see this more as damage limitation.

[MV8]

Please, no more "Ver-Ham incident" discussion, forget that for real.

[RedNEO]

I wonder if a couple more declare intentions to take a new engine, then Hamilton might also do the same if it can wind up in a situation where he can possibly start 16 or 17 with Verstappen likely at 20 due to the additional penalty. It becomes quite intriguing.

If it’s as wet as some weather forecasts are saying I don’t think 2 or 3 places will matter too much but I also don’t think Merc will throw away a chance to start at the front in those conditions if it’s actually like that.

[Stu]

Would be interesting to see what they did if you had to serve every single grid drop. So if you qualify 10th and get a 20 place grid drop, you drop 10, and then still have to serve 10 places of the 20 at the next race.

If they did that, McLaren would still be serving their Honda-powered grid penalties!!

[RZS10]

2021 Sporting Regulations
23) SPARE CARS, ENGINES AND GEARBOXES
23.2 b)

Should a driver use more than the numbers set in a) above of any one of the elements during a Championship, a race grid place penalty will be imposed upon him at the first Event during which each additional element is used.
[...]
Any of the seven (7) elements will be deemed to have been used once the car’s timing transponder has shown that it has left the pit lane.
During any single Event, if a driver introduces more than one of the same power unit element which is subject to penalties, only the last element fitted may be used at subsequent Events without further penalty.

Sounds like it's not about who informs the FIA first but who leaves the pits first (?)

[basti313]

2021 Sporting Regulations
23) SPARE CARS, ENGINES AND GEARBOXES
23.2 b)

Should a driver use more than the numbers set in a) above of any one of the elements during a Championship, a race grid place penalty will be imposed upon him at the first Event during which each additional element is used.
[...]
Any of the seven (7) elements will be deemed to have been used once the car’s timing transponder has shown that it has left the pit lane.
During any single Event, if a driver introduces more than one of the same power unit element which is subject to penalties, only the last element fitted may be used at subsequent Events without further penalty.

Sounds like it's not about who informs the FIA first but who leaves the pits first.

Still the bigger question is if they replace all elements. If Max leaves one of the elements in the car like the MGU-K, then he is ahead of the ones that replace everything. This is the interesting thing if we really see more engine changes happen. Who exchanges how many elelments...
For example Leclerc has used only 2 K so far, so he will not get the same penaly if he replaces everything like most others.

[El Scorchio]

2021 Sporting Regulations
23) SPARE CARS, ENGINES AND GEARBOXES
23.2 b)

Should a driver use more than the numbers set in a) above of any one of the elements during a Championship, a race grid place penalty will be imposed upon him at the first Event during which each additional element is used.
[...]
Any of the seven (7) elements will be deemed to have been used once the car’s timing transponder has shown that it has left the pit lane.
During any single Event, if a driver introduces more than one of the same power unit element which is subject to penalties, only the last element fitted may be used at subsequent Events without further penalty.

Sounds like it's not about who informs the FIA first but who leaves the pits first.

Still the bigger question is if they replace all elements. If Max leaves one of the elements in the car like the MGU-K, then he is ahead of the ones that replace everything. This is the interesting thing if we really see more engine changes happen. Who exchanges how many elelments...
For example Leclerc has used only 2 K so far, so he will not get the same penaly if he replaces everything like most others.

I feel it makes sense for Verstappen to just change everything at once and done with it. Unless something bizarre happens in the race with safety cars red flags or weather, I'm not sure he's finishing higher (or much lower) than third, from either 13th-14th or 20th on the grid. Then it lessens the odds also of him having to take another penalty for another part later in the season.

[nzjrs]

2021 Sporting Regulations
23) SPARE CARS, ENGINES AND GEARBOXES
23.2 b)


Sounds like it's not about who informs the FIA first but who leaves the pits first.

Still the bigger question is if they replace all elements. If Max leaves one of the elements in the car like the MGU-K, then he is ahead of the ones that replace everything. This is the interesting thing if we really see more engine changes happen. Who exchanges how many elelments...
For example Leclerc has used only 2 K so far, so he will not get the same penaly if he replaces everything like most others.

I feel it makes sense for Verstappen to just change everything at once and done with it. Unless something bizarre happens in the race with safety cars red flags or weather, I'm not sure he's finishing higher (or much lower) than third, from either 13th-14th or 20th on the grid. Then it lessens the odds also of him having to take another penalty for another part later in the season.

The biggest risk is IMO getting t-boned by a midfielder and scoring zero points. Considering RB and Merc are so much faster than the rest of the field I think they would take a clean start at the back instead of starting 13th or so.

[El Scorchio]

Still the bigger question is if they replace all elements. If Max leaves one of the elements in the car like the MGU-K, then he is ahead of the ones that replace everything. This is the interesting thing if we really see more engine changes happen. Who exchanges how many elelments...
For example Leclerc has used only 2 K so far, so he will not get the same penaly if he replaces everything like most others.

I feel it makes sense for Verstappen to just change everything at once and done with it. Unless something bizarre happens in the race with safety cars red flags or weather, I'm not sure he's finishing higher (or much lower) than third, from either 13th-14th or 20th on the grid. Then it lessens the odds also of him having to take another penalty for another part later in the season.

The biggest risk is IMO getting t-boned by a midfielder and scoring zero points. Considering RB and Merc are so much faster than the rest of the field I think they would take a clean start at the back instead of starting 13th or so.

Definitely agree with that great point as well. They have such pace there's the luxury of hanging back slightly at the start and first couple of corners to stay out of trouble rather than starting in the spot where there's most likely to be contact or issues.