Are we seeing a Vettel era?

[Traction]

No you completely dis-regard the fact that almost anyone with a years training in a RBR would dominate like Vettel.

Vettel is a good driver but there are way faster guys out there. Di Resta spanked Vettel like the little boy he is in F3, in the SAME machinery.

My guess is he and a few other guys would do the same in a RBR.

Illogical to say the least.

[Traction]

For some reason this forum seems to be too biased towards some drivers,

vettel has been driving the hell out of the car for qualifying and initial part of the race to be where he is right now, meanwhile webber in similar equipment has scored only 58% of what vettel has scored, so please give that guy some credit for what he has achieved.

So its like saying Button is a champion only because of brawn gp and not his skills. One needs to acknowledge that first to out score his colleague in the same equipment before becoming a champion and colleagues are always not duds like Fisi, Kovi etc

P.S Button is outscoring Hamilton right now,

Exactly... +1
=D>

[Traction]

Voted no, like other said we are in a Red Bull era, not Vettel era. An Vettel era would mean that in the same car others would do a worse job, and that Vettel would do similair in another car. Nothing compared to Schumi or whoever. If alonso, Hamilton, Button or whoever was in Vettels seat I am sure they would have scored equal or better. I am confident that 1 third of the grid can beat Vettel in the same car. Imo he hasnt shown any race craft whatsoever, when he wasnt first into turn one he was or overtaken by an far slowerd driver which would be easy to get past to or if that wasnt the case he would start making mistakes and be nowhere. I mean, a guy with pure racecraft wouldnt make that stupid mistake he did in Canada, ruined his race in Germany or any other he had made. When he is under little pressure he is nowhere to be found, then I would say he is a midfielder, barely any quicker then Massa. I am sure that i nthe hands of an alonso or Hamilton They would already be WDC in that car. Thus it is an Red Bull era, not Vettel era.

With schumi that was his era, he was perfection, he topped a new level, he built a team from scratch. What did Vettel do? He just gets a car shoved in his hands and is asked to drive quick laps. Hamilton or Alonso would drive the crap out of him if in the same team.

So in other words Hamilton has no race craft because of the mistakes he has made in the past when he has been under pressure or because he was handed a Mclaren when he came into F1????? Vettel won in a Torro Rosso!! God...the idiocy brought on by the denial is stunning......

[Richard]

It's not denial or favouritism. We are simply saying the car is utterly dominant.

Put it this way, if you had the option to bring Newey or Vettel's to another team, then who would you pck? I'd go for Newey.

OK I admit there s favouritism. Look at the site title. People on here put the car as favourite.

[RB7ate9]

For some reason this forum seems to be too biased towards some drivers,

vettel has been driving the hell out of the car for qualifying and initial part of the race to be where he is right now, meanwhile webber in similar equipment has scored only 58% of what vettel has scored, so please give that guy some credit for what he has achieved.

So its like saying Button is a champion only because of brawn gp and not his skills. One needs to acknowledge that first to out score his colleague in the same equipment before becoming a champion and colleagues are always not duds like Fisi, Kovi etc

P.S Button is outscoring Hamilton right now,

And people appear to be biased against some drivers.

People need to stop battling over Hamilton tooth and nail, both sides.

People,I agree, need to offer some hardy respect to Vettel who, because he is in a fantastic car, has to push it to the limit every time to fend off the likes of Ferrari and Mclaren who have shown that if not raced 110% against, they will catch up and show you up (i.e. Button's remaining 10 races). The input he gives towards the engineers is valuable and vital. That is the mark of a good driver, and anyone that says he is anything less than a good driver hasn't been watching this season. Great driver? that's what multiple seasons are for.

People need to lighten up, though, on Webber: "But he is in the same machine, shouldn't he be as fast as Vettel!?!?!!?OMG!!?!?!?He should retire!!!!" He is in an RB7 and is not as fast as Vettel, granted. But he is still as fast and - as seen in qualifying - faster then his next opponents. When given nasty lemons, he can make some sweet lemonade points. If he was truly as bad as you all say he apparently is, then he wouldn't be there in 2nd/3rd place, taking points from vaunted Alonso and beloved Hamilton and smooth Button, then they would be nipping at Vettel's feet, a lot closer than anyone at RBR wants. It's not enough to have one car faster than the field, and let 3 former world champions duke it out, you need a second car that can mix it up as well. They didn't get all of the constructor's points from Vettel alone.

Frankly, my history with F1 is shorter than many here, but it is plain to see that the notion of a single era for a "driver" flies in the face of F1 as a sport. Schumacher was great in a great car with great chances for improvement with in-season testing, powerful engineering, and profound skill. Senna was skillful in the dominating MP4/4. Even Button swelled by on skill and the Brawn Double Diffuser. There are a thousand parts to the car, hundreds of personnel, and the driver. To simply gloss it all over with an era of a driver is disrespectful to the other people on the team that helped put him where he is (and that is a technical fact). There is an astounding synergy that has to be made to become such a dominant team that RBR has become, that is why it is the pinnacle of motorsport, and why the Tifosi follow the team, not the driver.

So no, we are not entering the "Vettel Era" because we haven't seen him be the determining factor in a team's overall success. Put him in a Lotus and see if he can push the team from the back to the midfield and beyond, consistently. We didn't see the "Alonso Era" because he kept jumping from team to team, not improving much from one to the other, and Ferrari is currently third in the constructors championship. Two WDCs does not make "an era".

I'm sorry if it appears I'm attacking you. I am using your quote because it makes good points. Although, as you can see, I do not agree with the Webber comment

[CHT]

It's not denial or favouritism. We are simply saying the car is utterly dominant.

Put it this way, if you had the option to bring Newey or Vettel's to another team, then who would you pck? I'd go for Newey.

OK I admit there s favouritism. Look at the site title. People on here put the car as favourite.

Any driver driving and winning in an utterly dominant car = lousy/average driver?

[Mandrake]

For some reason this forum seems to be too biased towards some drivers,

vettel has been driving the hell out of the car for qualifying and initial part of the race to be where he is right now, meanwhile webber in similar equipment has scored only 58% of what vettel has scored, so please give that guy some credit for what he has achieved.

So its like saying Button is a champion only because of brawn gp and not his skills. One needs to acknowledge that first to out score his colleague in the same equipment before becoming a champion and colleagues are always not duds like Fisi, Kovi etc

P.S Button is outscoring Hamilton right now,

Thanks for this post! Been waiting for it so long.

@ all the others: Why the hell is there so much jealousy against Vettel? Of course NOBODY! could win a race in an HRT nowadays, only if the other 18 good cars all fall apart. The gap between cars is way too large. And Vettel had his rookie races in a slow car...others were put into the best car of the grid as well and were praised for doing so well (hint hint). By the way, the same people that praised that certain driver are now taking away from Vettel.....strange coincidence...

MSC drove a brilliant race in Monza but still he was nowhere....due to his lack of skill? No, due to the car. But the way he managed to deal with the slow car and the faster cars around showed great skill from him.

The same counts for Vettel. Webber is regularly outpaced by the competition and he doesn't seem to be as dominant as Vettel. 2 conclusions from this: Either Webber is a rubbish driver, or the RedBull is a very good car, but what makes it dominating that much is Vettel at the wheel. This is what I think is the real reason behind the RedBull era, a very good car with an extremely quick driver at the wheel maximaizing the success!

[Mandrake]

So no, we are not entering the "Vettel Era" because we haven't seen him be the determining factor in a team's overall success. Put him in a Lotus and see if he can push the team from the back to the midfield and beyond, consistently. We didn't see the "Alonso Era" because he kept jumping from team to team, not improving much from one to the other, and Ferrari is currently third in the constructors championship. Two WDCs does not make "an era".

Unfortunately it doesn't work anymore today with putting a top driver into a lousy car and make it faster.

MSC went to Ferrari and brought Ferrari back to the top. This was achieved through endless testing and massive amounts of money spent.

Today money is limited, especially for smaller teams, testing is banned, so innovation and development is slowed down. It can be clearly seen with MGP, Michael would not have lost his ability to build a team, to bring it back to the top end of the grid, but due to the outer circumstances he cannot succeed!

Put MSC, Ham, Vettel, Button, Alonso or whoever you want into a Lotus today and I'm sure they will not cut the mustard!

[CHT]

For some reason this forum seems to be too biased towards some drivers,

vettel has been driving the hell out of the car for qualifying and initial part of the race to be where he is right now, meanwhile webber in similar equipment has scored only 58% of what vettel has scored, so please give that guy some credit for what he has achieved.

So its like saying Button is a champion only because of brawn gp and not his skills. One needs to acknowledge that first to out score his colleague in the same equipment before becoming a champion and colleagues are always not duds like Fisi, Kovi etc

P.S Button is outscoring Hamilton right now,

Thanks for this post! Been waiting for it so long.

@ all the others: Why the hell is there so much jealousy against Vettel? Of course NOBODY! could win a race in an HRT nowadays, only if the other 18 good cars all fall apart. The gap between cars is way too large. And Vettel had his rookie races in a slow car...others were put into the best car of the grid as well and were praised for doing so well (hint hint). By the way, the same people that praised that certain driver are now taking away from Vettel.....strange coincidence...

MSC drove a brilliant race in Monza but still he was nowhere....due to his lack of skill? No, due to the car. But the way he managed to deal with the slow car and the faster cars around showed great skill from him.

The same counts for Vettel. Webber is regularly outpaced by the competition and he doesn't seem to be as dominant as Vettel. 2 conclusions from this: Either Webber is a rubbish driver, or the RedBull is a very good car, but what makes it dominating that much is Vettel at the wheel. This is what I think is the real reason behind the RedBull era, a very good car with an extremely quick driver at the wheel maximaizing the success!

Vettel is not just quick, he hardly make mistake as well.

[RB7ate9]

The same counts for Vettel. Webber is regularly outpaced by the competition and he doesn't seem to be as dominant as Vettel. 2 conclusions from this: Either Webber is a rubbish driver, or the RedBull is a very good car, but what makes it dominating that much is Vettel at the wheel. This is what I think is the real reason behind the RedBull era, a very good car with an extremely quick driver at the wheel maximaizing the success!

Absolutely, the people that just simply expect Webber to be automatically dominant in the RB7 are the people who think Vettel's just in a good car. They can't have it both ways. Webber isn't as dominant in the RB7 because he just isn't on top of the RB7's potential. Vettel isn't just in a good car because if he was, Webber would be up there as well, sleeping behind the wheel into p1 and p2. Nope, I hope it is an era for Red Bull Racing. In their relatively short history, they have built a great team, from the Principles and the Drivers, to the engineers and pit crew (I saw a small video about using lasers to train pit crew to be EXACTLY where they needed to be, any sources?).

[sriraj1031]

I'm sorry if it appears I'm attacking you. I am using your quote because it makes good points. Although, as you can see, I do not agree with the Webber comment

No sir, i aint feeling you are attacking, firstly i am a fan of F1 and no fanboy( but due respect needs to be given to everyone's achievements) , just love the sport. I always believed any "era" even so called schumi era was the labor of love of many individuals (we all know who it consists). Schumi solely couldn't have achieved anything

[Giblet]

Voted no, like other said we are in a Red Bull era, not Vettel era. An Vettel era would mean that in the same car others would do a worse job, and that Vettel would do similair in another car. Nothing compared to Schumi or whoever. If alonso, Hamilton, Button or whoever was in Vettels seat I am sure they would have scored equal or better. I am confident that 1 third of the grid can beat Vettel in the same car. Imo he hasnt shown any race craft whatsoever, when he wasnt first into turn one he was or overtaken by an far slowerd driver which would be easy to get past to or if that wasnt the case he would start making mistakes and be nowhere. I mean, a guy with pure racecraft wouldnt make that stupid mistake he did in Canada, ruined his race in Germany or any other he had made. When he is under little pressure he is nowhere to be found, then I would say he is a midfielder, barely any quicker then Massa. I am sure that i nthe hands of an alonso or Hamilton They would already be WDC in that car. Thus it is an Red Bull era, not Vettel era.

With schumi that was his era, he was perfection, he topped a new level, he built a team from scratch. What did Vettel do? He just gets a car shoved in his hands and is asked to drive quick laps. Hamilton or Alonso would drive the crap out of him if in the same team.

So in other words Hamilton has no race craft because of the mistakes he has made in the past when he has been under pressure or because he was handed a Mclaren when he came into F1????? Vettel won in a Torro Rosso!! God...the idiocy brought on by the denial is stunning......

I explained why myself and many others feel the STR win was not a big deal, and even if I am wrong, nobody is an idiot for having a view with a reason.

[HampusA]

For some reason this forum seems to be too biased towards some drivers,

vettel has been driving the hell out of the car for qualifying and initial part of the race to be where he is right now, meanwhile webber in similar equipment has scored only 58% of what vettel has scored, so please give that guy some credit for what he has achieved.

So its like saying Button is a champion only because of brawn gp and not his skills. One needs to acknowledge that first to out score his colleague in the same equipment before becoming a champion and colleagues are always not duds like Fisi, Kovi etc

P.S Button is outscoring Hamilton right now,

Exactly... +1
=D>

Now that is funny.

[HampusA]

It's not denial or favouritism. We are simply saying the car is utterly dominant.

Put it this way, if you had the option to bring Newey or Vettel's to another team, then who would you pck? I'd go for Newey.

OK I admit there s favouritism. Look at the site title. People on here put the car as favourite.

Any driver driving and winning in an utterly dominant car = lousy/average driver?

well he isn´t automatically the best driver in the world like many thinks.

He does exactly what he should do with that car. win every race and take the title.
Right now he´s doing what´s expected of him because the car is so dominant.

A person that is not doing what is expected and is frankly wasting a seat in possibly the greatest F1 car ever built is Mark Webber.

[Mr Alcatraz]

For some reason this forum seems to be too biased towards some drivers,

Come on Scro! At least 70 % 0f the members are Brits. There are two varieties. You have your Brits that are very objective, and reasonable, although most of them would probably pull for a Britt if push comes to shove. They just don't make absurd assertions about their countrymen. Of course you have others that will knock any other pilot that isn't a Britt or to a lesser degree uber Britt’s that will defend their countrymen and rubbish pilots that are not Britt’s. This second group is mostly younger 13 -25 years old, and act like they are 10 to 16 years old Don't sweat it.