Maldonado sponsorship for Williams

[raymondu999]

Not really. That means that Pastor Maldonado's talent + 46M is worth a seat. It means that Pastor Maldonado's talent is 46M short of a seat.

I don't know much about Venezuelan business practices as I've never done anything with Venezuelan businessmen - but I'm quite sure they would have negotiated something cheaper if they thought it was possible. I don't even get why someone such as an oil company (I'm not sure what their product lineup is like; do they sell directly to consumers?) would actually bother with sponsoring, as most of the exposure would be to the end consumer rather than PDVSA's natural target market. Unless of course they own gas stations

And what's with all the Foxconn scaremongering? I've never had business dealings with them in the past as I use my own; but Foxconn is not the sweatshop people paint it to be, I don't think. Heck all mine (which isn't as big as Foxconn) still gets rolling ISO certifications, the buildings are well lit and air conditioned/heated. Ditto to the dormitories.

[ringo]

I agree, 46 MUSD for a well-connected wannabee to try his luck is pocketchange for a rich country such as Venezuela.

Luckily enough, I belong to the generation remembering Frank Williams letting go of an almost certain 1982 WDC,
Carlos Retutemann, over the Argentinian - Falkland politics, those were the days.

Are you sure that it was his decision, or just the "offer" from MT he couldn't refuse? That was the state of war, without space for free will business decisions.

I really don't get this Chavez obsession. He is no good, I mentioned that already, just like most politicians from other nations involved in F1. I'm not defending him, just saying is that if you're going to point out such injustices, than to avoid hypocrite label, be fair and mention all countries and their presidents, prime ministers or monarchs who are doing identical thing as Chavez. There's only a dozen teams in F1, it wouldn't take too much time.

To make it clear, I'm not writing this as personal provocation, I just think that if we're going to talk about money taken from citizens without their consent, to be "invested" in F1 and likely skimmed by those are taking it, than name all of those who are doing it.

I agree with you. Unlike France, the UK, etc. Chavez hasn't invaded any countries and stir up trouble.
I find it unfair for a Venezualan to be judged on his nationality.
Then there is this myth that the guy isn't any good, simply because he is a pay driver. If your mind is sharp, he may well be faster than Hulkenburg who could never over a whole season outpace rubens on easier to understand tyres.

[Pup]

He may be good, or he may suck. But he's still a pay driver, and you have to ask what exactly they're paying for. Judging by this conversation, you'd have to wonder if it's money we'll spent.

[FW17]

Did ANYONE have an issue with British American Tobacco's interest in motor racing? They are one of the few western corporations that circumvent economic sanctions on the Burmese Junta, but everyone simply accepted Lucky Strike and 555 liveries.

F1 is no stranger to dirty money : Chavez has nothing on the abuses of the Myanmar Generals.

As for my personal boycott list, it is too long to put in full but includes such notable companies as :
Nestle
Microsoft
Apple (or any company using Foxconn components)
Knorr
Sarah Lee
Caterpillar
Ben & Jerrys
Coca Cola
McDonalds
Starbucks
Vodafone
Marks & Spencer
Etc, etc, etc ...

YOU FORGOT DOW CHEMICALS AND THE 2012 LONDON OLYMPICS

[ringo]

He may be good, or he may suck. But he's still a pay driver, and you have to ask what exactly they're paying for. Judging by this conversation, you'd have to wonder if it's money we'll spent.

Well Venezuela is getting their publicity out of it definitely. It's their money they can do what they wish. We've seen even more money spent on useless space programs that don't help any one in need.
Or billions spent on useless missiles to bomb a desert country, where there a countries right beside it with starving people. Those billions could have been better spent.

I would be a pay driver. Couldn't care less what no one else says. I want an F1 seat i will scrape up the money to get that seat. There are only 24 cars on the grid, damn right i'm gonna pay if i don't have the right connections to get in.
The driver loves it, the team loves it, the sponsors love it, so why are we hating on it?

I'd say it's money well spent. I would love to see my country being advertised on a F1 rear wing in 20 different countries all over the world. It's amazing how powerful that is. Better if that country has a driver.

[raymondu999]

I find it unfair for a Venezualan to be judged on his nationality.
Then there is this myth that the guy isn't any good, simply because he is a pay driver.

Agreed on both counts. Absolutely. Stereotyping is the bane of human thought. Also, a pay driver doesn't mean a driver is necessarily bad. The driver; again; should be judged free of stereotypes. Personally, I still feel Maldonado is nothing special. He's not super rubbish, but nothing special.

[xpensive]

More evidence of the Iberians accountability for letting South America go on their own to soon, the result has been Tussaint L'Overture, Alfredo Stroessner and Hugo Chavez, could Formula One please be spared from this xtravaganza?

Little wonder Patrick Head walked off.

[bhall]

Wow. That's not prejudicial at all.

[xpensive]

Wow. That's not prejudicial at all.

Denmark ran Norway for 900 years, Sweden ran Finland for 700, the endresult is equaly depressing to xpress it politely, now the Iberians have to deal with this sh*t.

There's no way in the world Chavez could have spent that kind of money had he known the going rate for an F1 paydriver,
it must have been a calculated rip-off from Williams' side, which turns my animosity to outright hatred.

[bhall]

The only way I know how to respond to that without opening a MASSIVE can of worms in the process is say only that at least you now see why a team might pursue legal remedies in response to a disclosure of sponsorship terms. It's far more lucrative to keep those things confidential.

[xpensive]

Either way you go, the attorneys will always be the winners, I would have no problems shelling out for the brave who took the pic, though I guess moonchild's heart for freedom of speech was limited when it came to a favorite team of his own?

I find this crucially important, why I suggest we all back Tomba for his guts and nerve to let it ride for as long as it did,
got my copy safe and sound though.

[bhall]

What's so crucially important about this disclosure, save for the fact that Venezuelans just might want to know how their money is being spent? Otherwise, what does it matter in a sociopolitical sense?

And are we supposed to condemn Williams because PDVSA (the Venezuelan government) didn't exercise due diligence before it signed the deal? Or is it incumbent upon Williams to be magnanimous in its sponsorship negotiations?

[xpensive]

I find it crucially important in more than one sense, firstly you learn what F1 has become with MrMs money-guzzling reign. Other than rarely, only out of the western world dictatorships can afford a race, while soon only teams with monetary back-up can afford a driver of their own choice.

And yes, to my mind we should condemn Williams, going from being BMWs factory team to sucking up to Hugo Chavez and his clan, all within a decade, is a bullet-proof sign of complete and utter incompetence.

[bhall]

It would be the epitome of incompetence if Williams didn't seek to extract every dollar (pound, Euro, whatever) possible from its sponsors. And as much as I can understand someone taking umbrage with the source of their revenues, where on Earth can one find a "pure" company?

I rather agree with your other points, i.e. what F1 has become. None of that is breaking news, though.

"When it's a question of money, everybody is of the same religion." ~ Voltaire

[xpensive]

l'm glad you can see the writing on the wall, but I come from a generation of pride and honesty, where I have asked more employers than I can count to take a peek where the moon don't shine, this degeneration of Wiliams' is heartbreaking.

I can still recall Patrick Head doing riveting himself on Alan's FW07. Just to make sure it was properly done.