Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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raymondu999
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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Whitmarsh said last race though that "if it's a part that WE didn't make, then there's not much we can do about it." But have the issues really been all the purchased products? I don't remember much else, but I remember that Singapore 2012 for Lewis was the gearbox, which should be a McLaren made part. Ditto with suspension for Lewis in Japan and Korea. What issue did Button have in Korea again?
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McMrocks
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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raymondu999 wrote:Whitmarsh said last race though that "if it's a part that WE didn't make, then there's not much we can do about it." But have the issues really been all the purchased products? I don't remember much else, but I remember that Singapore 2012 for Lewis was the gearbox, which should be a McLaren made part. Ditto with suspension for Lewis in Japan and Korea. What issue did Button have in Korea again?
it is called Kobayashi and is a import from japan. And in Q it was the gearbox of another driver.

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raymondu999
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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Ack. I meant to say Monza, rather than Korea.
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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raymondu999 wrote:Ack. I meant to say Monza, rather than Korea.
Fuel pump I guess.

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Forza
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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Martin Whitmarsh wrote:“It is going to be McLaren Mercedes for quite a few years to come. It is a good partnership and it works well. We've been together for 18 years and it is going to continue for quite a few years to come.I think we have got a very good deal with them, but I think more importantly than that is we have got a good partnership.Obviously I've been involved with Mercedes personally. I ran the engine side so we know the people, and we are proud to be part of the Mercedes-Benz family."

mx_tifoso
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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Despite all of their troubles, at least they haven't had any shunts like this one;

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VwB8XybW558[/youtube]

Back then dnf's weren't just stopping calmly out on track, the drivers really felt the consequences!
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Nando
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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he just doesn´t get it Martin... he´s just walking around in his own little mist.
McLaren's Martin Whitmarsh believes Lewis Hamilton has regretted his decision to leave the Woking team for Mercedes next season, but says the 27-year-old must live with his choice.
Hamilton himself has denied such claims but Whitmarsh believes otherwise and says the 2008 champion isn't going to admit he's made a error of judgement.
"I think he has [regretted the choice] on occasions, yes," the team principal told the official F1 website. "You have to justify your decision. He's not going to say 'hey, they offered me more money'. He's also not going to say that he's made an awful mistake.
"I hope he thinks today that he's made an awful mistake and I hope he thinks that next year.
"He's made that decision and he has to live with that decision."
Whitmarsh also revealed that he is still unsure of the exact reasons behind Hamilton's departure but speculated that in the wake of his disappointing Singapore retirement, he may have reacted without thinking.
"The simple answer is that I don't know," he added.
"If I were speculating there are a number of factors and the prime one, I think, is that there comes a time when a man feels he has to flee the nest.
"I am pretty sure he hadn't made his mind up until the Monday or Tuesday after Singapore. It is always bad to make a decision in the aftermath of a bad race.
"I respect his decision, but I believe that he would be better off with us - we are the stronger team - and we intend to beat him next year."
I doubt it. You could have a car that´s 15 seconds a lap quicker then anyone elses and you still would not win a single title.

Judging by the three races he´s been comfortably leading then having the car breaking down just cements that he indeed did the right decision.
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GrizzleBoy
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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I hope he thinks today that he's made an awful mistake and I hope he thinks that next year.
This seems like an insight into the "real" Whitmarsh.

So much for a friendly goodbye eh? Where did the dignity go lol what an asshole thing to say.

elf341
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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Next year will be fascinating to see how McLaren cope without Lewis. It's often been bandied around that in Schumacher's first career having him as a driver was worth 2 tenths - I wouldn't be surprised if Lewis is worth the same. Having that kind of buffer can let off a lot of the slack from a team. This may not be a completely similar scenario, but I'm wondering if McLaren might experience a bit of a Benetton 1996 type scenario after Schumacher left, with zero wins.
That said, McLaren clearly know how to make a fast car and to get a race win all you need is a fairly fast car and a bit of luck.

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turbof1
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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That said, McLaren clearly know how to make a fast car and to get a race win all you need is a fairly fast car and a bit of luck.
Mclaren does not really have bad luck you know. That would have been the case if they only had once and a while a technical problem, but this is systematic: from monza till yas marina they were having technical problems. Furthermore, whitmarsh is happy to tell all those breakdowns were unrelated and only one-off. That is a man in deny for you right there. The problems might not be technically related, but when you are having these problems over and over again, each race, then you cant beat around the bush anymore. Then there is either something very wrong with the production of the parts, or with checking up the parts. Either way they should stop fool themselves that these problems will go away. If this was Ron Dennis these issues would be long solved already.
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elf341
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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Slightly off-topic.
But does anybody know how instrumental Pat Fry was in saving the MP4-24 (2009 car that started as a dog)?

It just occurred to me that the Ferrari was in a similar scenario early this year and have managed to pull out of it.

I wonder if Lewis had bad memories about 2009 and with the talent which has left McLaren in recent years I wonder if he has his doubts regarding the 2014 rule change.

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banibhusan
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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AFAIK, Ron Dennis is still the head of the McLaren group, right? Why would he let Whitmarsh screw up the team and their "find of the century"?

Anyways, moving on to Nando's post, I think it's Whitmarsh who should be regretting. They have let a star driver leave the team and they are stuck with a young kid and an old chap, who can easily flunk if the car doesn't behave according to his liking.

Now the 3 best drivers on the grid are with 3 different teams and McLaren seems to have none. If Mercedes somehow manages to produce a strong car then that would be a bit embarrassing for McLaren and Whitmarsh.

elf341
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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banibhusan wrote:they are stuck with a young kid and an old chap, who can easily flunk if the car doesn't behave according to his liking.
Good point. Button is extremely sensitive to the handling characteristics of the car, when he gets it right then he can be very strong (e.g. australia), but you only have to look at races like Canada this year where Lewis pulled out a win and Button was languishing down out of the points. Perez is an unknown quantity really, and I fear that his style is "just right" for this year's tyres which has made him look immense - I think McLaren overreacted, and should've pinched someone like Rosberg who has shown clear speed in a realm of different conditions. Hulkenberg even is a better candidate imo.

Nando
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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AUS - Bad strategy for Hamilton.
MAL - Bad strategy for both i think but definitely for Hamilton, pit stop problems for Hamilton.
CHI - Pit stop problem for Button.
BAH - Pit stop problem for Hamilton, Exhaust/Differential for Button.
ESP - Underfuelled Hamilton.
MON - Bad strategy for Hamilton. Fuel problem for Button.
CAN - Brilliant.
VAL - Just a really bad day i guess and probably a bit of everything here.
GBR - Bad strategy for Hamilton, should have kept him out longer.
GER - Pit stops now start to become world class with Button´s record pit stop.
HUN - Brilliant
BEL - Brilliant
ITA - Brilliant
SIN - Gearbox problem for Hamilton.
JAP - Suspension problem for Hamilton.
KOR - Suspension problem for Hamilton.
IND - Downshift problem causing them to change the steering wheel in pits.
ABU - Fuel problem for Hamilton.

I think that if you were to compare this with HRT´s season it would not look that much more different.
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simieski
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Re: Vodafone McLaren Team 2012

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turbof1 wrote:
That said, McLaren clearly know how to make a fast car and to get a race win all you need is a fairly fast car and a bit of luck.
Mclaren does not really have bad luck you know. That would have been the case if they only had once and a while a technical problem, but this is systematic: from monza till yas marina they were having technical problems. Furthermore, whitmarsh is happy to tell all those breakdowns were unrelated and only one-off. That is a man in deny for you right there. The problems might not be technically related, but when you are having these problems over and over again, each race, then you cant beat around the bush anymore. Then there is either something very wrong with the production of the parts, or with checking up the parts. Either way they should stop fool themselves that these problems will go away. If this was Ron Dennis these issues would be long solved already.
Just to add some perspective, they are completely reliant on sponsorship to fund their team, he really doesn't have a whole lot of choice but to play down the failures in the media. Difficult to retain and attract sponsors when you openly admit your incompetence. None of us are privvy to know about, what one would hope is, a --- storm behind the scenes over their errors.
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