STR01

Here are our CFD links and discussions about aerodynamics, suspension, driver safety and tyres. Please stick to F1 on this forum.
wowf1
wowf1
0
Joined: 05 Jan 2004, 13:53
Location: Brunel University, England

Post

I'm sure I remember a Toyota a few years back (possibly Panis?) and during the Friday practice at a grand prix, his cockpit extinguisher kept going off inside his cockpit and covering him with foam!

I realise that this does not guarantee automatic systems are in place though. It could just be a fault with the circuitry controlling the manually-operated fire extinguisher. But either way, pretty dangerous having foam sprayed at you while you're hammering at 200mph!

zac510
zac510
22
Joined: 24 Jan 2006, 12:58

Post

bernard wrote: If a car catches fire after a crash and the driver is unconcious, then the extinguishers would go off immediately, rather than when a track marshal gets there with the aforementioned pole. Especially if the car is flipped over the switch at the side of the airbox can be pretty hard to get to, not even mentioning the possible flames. This area of the FIA regulations could use a little modernization, the rules are way over ten years old on this.
bernard, I believe it is at this exact point that reality intervenes and it must be accepted that no sport can ever be 100% safe. how can you possibly decide when a driver is unconscious or not?
if you douse him with CO2 you risk suffocating him through lack of oxygen!

User avatar
m3_lover
0
Joined: 26 Jan 2006, 07:29
Location: St.Catharines, Ontario, Canada

Post

Here is the pic of that mclaren and my god you were right on being ugly

http://www.cressinghamscalemodels.co.uk ... 4-10-7.JPG

and I thought during the Chinese Grand Prix this year, when Narain crashed his Jordan, that the commentators on speed t.v mentioned that there is a device in the car that will shoot foam inside the cockpit for acouple of seconds??
Simon: Nils? You can close in now. Nils?
John McClane: [on the guard's phone] Attention! Attention! Nils is dead! I repeat, Nils is dead, ----head. So's his pal, and those four guys from the East German All-Stars, your boys at the bank? They're gonna be a little late.
Simon: [on the phone] John... in the back of the truck you're driving, there's $13 billon dollars worth in gold bullion. I wonder would a deal be out of the question?
John McClane: [on the phone] Yeah, I got a deal for you. Come out from that rock you're hiding under, and I'll drive this truck up your ass.

scarbs
scarbs
393
Joined: 08 Oct 2003, 09:47
Location: Hertfordshire, UK

Post

the commentators on speed t.v

well thats never going to be accurate then is it...!

User avatar
m3_lover
0
Joined: 26 Jan 2006, 07:29
Location: St.Catharines, Ontario, Canada

Post

so true
Simon: Nils? You can close in now. Nils?
John McClane: [on the guard's phone] Attention! Attention! Nils is dead! I repeat, Nils is dead, ----head. So's his pal, and those four guys from the East German All-Stars, your boys at the bank? They're gonna be a little late.
Simon: [on the phone] John... in the back of the truck you're driving, there's $13 billon dollars worth in gold bullion. I wonder would a deal be out of the question?
John McClane: [on the phone] Yeah, I got a deal for you. Come out from that rock you're hiding under, and I'll drive this truck up your ass.

bernard
bernard
0
Joined: 06 Jun 2004, 21:10
Location: France/Finland

Post

zac510 wrote:
bernard wrote: If a car catches fire after a crash and the driver is unconcious, then the extinguishers would go off immediately, rather than when a track marshal gets there with the aforementioned pole. Especially if the car is flipped over the switch at the side of the airbox can be pretty hard to get to, not even mentioning the possible flames. This area of the FIA regulations could use a little modernization, the rules are way over ten years old on this.
bernard, I believe it is at this exact point that reality intervenes and it must be accepted that no sport can ever be 100% safe. how can you possibly decide when a driver is unconscious or not?
if you douse him with CO2 you risk suffocating him through lack of oxygen!
The cockpit rarely sets on fire. I meant putting out the root of the fire, the engine area.
But I realise this is pretty hard to achieve, because of the nature of the environment.
A heat sensor under the airbox intake behind the driver's head, plus a few other strategical spots would give a pretty decent picture of whether the car is on fire or not. The price wouldn't be too big considering that it could very likely save some lives.

But before that, I think the most urgent safety measure to be taken is to secure the driver in case of the car flipping over.
I remember a few years back in monaco, when Fisichella's car flipped over and hit the railing. When the car flips over, the safety arch doesn't help if you hit an object with the cockpit first, like another car or a fence. That's a near certain death, or full paralyzation in the least case. And it's not even that unimaginable an event.

zac510
zac510
22
Joined: 24 Jan 2006, 12:58

Post

Well maybe we should have closed cockpit cars. Or maybe the drivers should just sit inside on the couch all day instead as driving is too dangerous!

manchild
manchild
12
Joined: 03 Jun 2005, 10:54

Post

All FIA homologated extiguishers for use in cabin or cocpit are filled with foam (AFFF) and it was done mostly because Halon that was used before sucks out the oxygen and can cause suffocation.

However, if foam is sprayed on burning wheel where Magnesium has already caught fire it will only make it burn more intense. That is why marshals carry powder filled CO2 extiguishers.

...
Ugly Mclaren 1995

Image

bernard
bernard
0
Joined: 06 Jun 2004, 21:10
Location: France/Finland

Post

zac510 wrote:Well maybe we should have closed cockpit cars. Or maybe the drivers should just sit inside on the couch all day instead as driving is too dangerous!
No reason to be childish over such a serious matter. You know very well that wasn't my point.
Danger is a part of motor racing, but death doesn't heighten the experience for me in any way. Do you have this same attitude when FIA tightens the crash tests nearly every year?

zac510
zac510
22
Joined: 24 Jan 2006, 12:58

Post

Yeah sorry about that, I spend so much time reading childish attitudes on F1 forums it must be rubbing off onto me :(

I just believe we have to draw a line otherwise it could really be taken to that kind of extreme. The conservatism and huge emphasis on safety in modern society could become counter productive one day.

ginsu
ginsu
0
Joined: 17 Jan 2006, 02:23

Post

Image
The STR1's apparent similarities to the Red Bull RB1 have been subject of much discussion, but there are some clear differences. The lower parts of the sidepods (1) have shrunk and become more rounded, following the fashion for a reduced cross section. This helps improve the quality of airflow directed towards the rear of the car. On the engine cover, the vertical tail fin (2) is much shorter than the full-length version seen on the RB1. And on the rear wing the endplates feature a deeply-sculpted profile (3) at the back. This helps airflow to detach more quickly from the endplate, hence reducing drag.
I love to love Senna.