2017 Mclaren F1 Team - Honda

[etusch]

I’d argue its different enough to not assume they will be as optimized as RedBull. That engine is small and McLaren optimzed their chassis tightly around it. That same “recepy” wont work with a different engine IMO.

I wonder that with Honda PU how small would be a Redbull car.

[Phil]

I’d argue its different enough to not assume they will be as optimized as RedBull. That engine is small and McLaren optimzed their chassis tightly around it. That same “recepy” wont work with a different engine IMO.

The Red Bull hasn't exactly got a fat arse itself.

My point is that these engines are called power units for a reason. There is the ICE, the turbo, the MGU-H, the batteries, the cooling and a whole lot of other things. There are so many interconnected parts that going from a customized specialized to a customer supplied unit will result in a lot of aero compromizes. McLaren undoubtedly have a great chassis/package now, but i very much doubt they will be able to use the Renault unit and retain the same strengths. RedBull has had 4 years of evolution on that part and will be in my estimation quite a bit ahead for year 5 on that basis alone.

I get that many like to look at that McLaren now and simply add a few horses to estimate where they’d be using Renault engines, but that is not how it works. They might gain a better PU next year, but they will lose quite a bit on the aero/chassis side. They have zero experience with that Renault engine, so they’ll be starting a long way back with cooling and knowing the limits of that package.

[Restomaniac]

I’d argue its different enough to not assume they will be as optimized as RedBull. That engine is small and McLaren optimzed their chassis tightly around it. That same “recepy” wont work with a different engine IMO.

The Red Bull hasn't exactly got a fat arse itself.

My point is that these engines are called power units for a reason. There is the ICE, the turbo, the MGU-H, the batteries, the cooling and a whole lot of other things. There are so many interconnected parts that going from a customized specialized to a customer supplied unit will result in a lot of aero compromizes. McLaren undoubtedly have a great chassis/package now, but i very much doubt they will be able to use the Renault unit and retain the same strengths. RedBull has had 4 years of evolution on that part and will be in my estimation quite a bit ahead for year 5 on that basis alone.

I get that many like to look at that McLaren now and simply add a few horses to estimate where they’d be using Renault engines, but that is not how it works. They might gain a better PU next year, but they will lose quite a bit on the aero/chassis side. They have zero experience with that Renault engine, so they’ll be starting a long way back with cooling and knowing the limits of that package.

I think you are over-egging how different and hard it will be in intergrate the Renault PU.

It's not like 1 car is a sphere and the other is dough-nut shaped.

[NathanOlder]

Everyone knows a sphere fits perfectly into the doughnut

[Sieper]

We might see Alonso do Some celebrational donuts next year, who knows. I,m sure they'll be able to integrate the Renault just fine.

[RonDennis]

They will work it out sooner or later. This whole season has been a confirmation that McLaren is again capable of producing a great chassis with some innovative solutions.

[Restomaniac]

Everyone knows a sphere fits perfectly into the doughnut

[Xero]

RedBull has had 4 years of evolution on that part and will be in my estimation quite a bit ahead for year 5 on that basis alone.

Not on these new car regulations though. Yes, packaging at the rear isn't so significantly different from last year, but no less significant than fitting a different power unit. It's not like this is a last minute decision through the winter, this was decided just as work on next years chassis started. McLaren are clearly capable of working around it. Plus, there's loads of room for improvement around that area of the car under these new regulations.

[diffuser]

Not a Big Fan on Kicking someone when thy're down. Alonso could have taken the high road and left that out.

[DFX]

Not a Big Fan on Kicking someone when thy're down. Alonso could have taken the high road and left that out.

I think this was a response to the comments made by Gasly directed to Mclaren at Mexico or US, I dont remember. He said something in the lines that mclaren should be worried about getting the Renault PU for next year.

[max_speed]

With due respect honda supporters should stop worrying about mclaren anymore. Yesterday race was painful to watch. Safety car allowed massa to overtake him and then Alonso had to stay in drs range to avoid being overtaken by others. If you watchee the race then you know how poor honda engine is. Alonso did a smart race to bring some points in. Going with renault will may be an embaraasment but seeing them competing with honda engine is a shame. Save some excuses amd rays of hope for next year please.

[j.yank]

I am wondering why the supposed superior McLaren chassis were down from RedBull 0.1-02 sec per lap in the second sector, when Alonso was with fresh soft tires but Ricciardo was with 32 laps and more old soft tires? Verstappen were about 0.7 sec quicker there with new soft tires. At the very same time, Alonso was 0.4 sec per lap quicker than Masa (with new softs, too) in the same sector. How this holds with the theory that McLaren are missing only the power of mighty Renault engine?

[etusch]

I’d argue its different enough to not assume they will be as optimized as RedBull. That engine is small and McLaren optimzed their chassis tightly around it. That same “recepy” wont work with a different engine IMO.

The Red Bull hasn't exactly got a fat arse itself.

My point is that these engines are called power units for a reason. There is the ICE, the turbo, the MGU-H, the batteries, the cooling and a whole lot of other things. There are so many interconnected parts that going from a customized specialized to a customer supplied unit will result in a lot of aero compromizes. McLaren undoubtedly have a great chassis/package now, but i very much doubt they will be able to use the Renault unit and retain the same strengths. RedBull has had 4 years of evolution on that part and will be in my estimation quite a bit ahead for year 5 on that basis alone.

I get that many like to look at that McLaren now and simply add a few horses to estimate where they’d be using Renault engines, but that is not how it works. They might gain a better PU next year, but they will lose quite a bit on the aero/chassis side. They have zero experience with that Renault engine, so they’ll be starting a long way back with cooling and knowing the limits of that package.

Bullier said that they'll follow what Renault recommends because of that lack of knowledge and experience

[etusch]

With due respect honda supporters should stop worrying about mclaren anymore. Yesterday race was painful to watch. Safety car allowed massa to overtake him and then Alonso had to stay in drs range to avoid being overtaken by others. If you watchee the race then you know how poor honda engine is. Alonso did a smart race to bring some points in. Going with renault will may be an embaraasment but seeing them competing with honda engine is a shame. Save some excuses amd rays of hope for next year please.

You see that? Ok. But must see that a Force India couldn't pass him

[Restomaniac]

I am wondering why the supposed superior McLaren chassis were down from RedBull 0.1-02 sec per lap in the second sector, when Alonso was with fresh soft tires but Ricciardo was with 32 laps and more old soft tires? Verstappen were about 0.7 sec quicker there with new soft tires. At the very same time, Alonso was 0.4 sec per lap quicker than Masa (with new softs, too) in the same sector. How this holds with the theory that McLaren are missing only the power of mighty Renault engine?

It's rather easy.
In S2 when the power isn't a factor Alonso was able to catch Massa. But then obviously not able to pass and end up in Massa's wake hence why is was 0.4 up. However in S1&3 when the power is smportant he was being slightly left by the Mercedes Donkey even with DRS.

The McLaren in S2 was counteracting the power loss in S1&3 lap after lap. However the Red Bull with a Renault was able to catch in S2 and then actually have the power to pull off the overtake in S3. Once clear they left the Williams behind. McLaren with a Renault would have had the power to pull off the same trick.