2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

[Big Tea]

Toto said on Sky that Bottas couldn't get the setup to work and didn't have confidence in the car

Am I the only one who thinks that below par performance from Bothas is one prime reason now that Redbulls leading the WCC by a good margin.
There is excuse every other race and very frustrating to see way below par performance by Bothas. When will Toto wake up to this harsh reality? after they lose the WCC?

Merc is behind RB because the whole team is underperforming. They were leading up to Monaco, but Bottas had a DNF due to no fault of his own from 2nd while Hamilton languished down the grid. This time around, Bottas did not have the car setup to his liking so he did not have the confidence required to go to the limit in a street circuit like Baku. Also, Lewis dropped the ball here.

They do seem to have switched positions with Red Bull for 'one car team with poor strat'

[El Scorchio]

Am I the only one who thinks that below par performance from Bothas is one prime reason now that Redbulls leading the WCC by a good margin.
There is excuse every other race and very frustrating to see way below par performance by Bothas. When will Toto wake up to this harsh reality? after they lose the WCC?

Merc is behind RB because the whole team is underperforming. They were leading up to Monaco, but Bottas had a DNF due to no fault of his own from 2nd while Hamilton languished down the grid. This time around, Bottas did not have the car setup to his liking so he did not have the confidence required to go to the limit in a street circuit like Baku. Also, Lewis dropped the ball here.

They do seem to have switched positions with Red Bull for 'one car team with poor strat'

It just feels like it's a very difficult car to dial in on some circuits, but is potentially is the fastest car if the setup is nailed and all the pace unlocked, whereas the Red Bull has a much higher baseline of performance but maybe not quite as much ultimate potential.

[Marble]

This thread about the brake magic :

[El Scorchio]

This thread about the brake magic :

Is it that side of the wheel where he puts his right hand over his left on starts? (or is it the other way round?) If it is, then it's quite easy to see how that button could unfortunately be accidentally pressed. Still, it's not happened in hundreds of previous times, so I suppose it's just a freakish occurence that it happened yesterday.

[Juzh]

This thread about the brake magic :

Is it that side of the wheel where he puts his right hand over his left on starts? (or is it the other way round?) If it is, then it's quite easy to see how that button could unfortunately be accidentally pressed. Still, it's not happened in hundreds of previous times, so I suppose it's just a freakish occurence that it happened yesterday.

I dont think it happened at the start as the brakes were already cooked by then, It also wouldn't be consistent with Bono telling him it was on the upshift of some sort. I think it was probably earlier in the lap.

[Just_a_fan]

This thread about the brake magic :

Is it that side of the wheel where he puts his right hand over his left on starts? (or is it the other way round?) If it is, then it's quite easy to see how that button could unfortunately be accidentally pressed. Still, it's not happened in hundreds of previous times, so I suppose it's just a freakish occurence that it happened yesterday.

I dont think it happened at the start as the brakes were already cooked by then, It also wouldn't be consistent with Bono telling him it was on the upshift of some sort. I think it was probably earlier in the lap.

It must have been just before his attack on Perez. If it had been a good period of time before then, Bono would have warned him about it.

[Juzh]

Is it that side of the wheel where he puts his right hand over his left on starts? (or is it the other way round?) If it is, then it's quite easy to see how that button could unfortunately be accidentally pressed. Still, it's not happened in hundreds of previous times, so I suppose it's just a freakish occurence that it happened yesterday.

I dont think it happened at the start as the brakes were already cooked by then, It also wouldn't be consistent with Bono telling him it was on the upshift of some sort. I think it was probably earlier in the lap.

It must have been just before his attack on Perez. If it had been a good period of time before then, Bono would have warned him about it.

It's illegal to talk to drivers on formation laps, probably why he wasn't given a warning. That's of course only If it the restart even was treated as a normal race start where that is the case. I'm not 100% certain it was because he was told strat 5 just before start and in that case he probably did bump brake magic button just after launch.

On the other hand It would make sense he turned brake warming up earlier as it's easier to cook the brakes when only fronts are doing all the stopping, but come to think about it, hamilton would probably spot it at first braking event to the grid after he turned it off that it's been turned on again, if that makes sense. Maybe they'll tell us at their race debrief on youtube.

[JPower]

This thread about the brake magic :

Is it that side of the wheel where he puts his right hand over his left on starts? (or is it the other way round?) If it is, then it's quite easy to see how that button could unfortunately be accidentally pressed. Still, it's not happened in hundreds of previous times, so I suppose it's just a freakish occurence that it happened yesterday.

I dont think it happened at the start as the brakes were already cooked by then, It also wouldn't be consistent with Bono telling him it was on the upshift of some sort. I think it was probably earlier in the lap.

Even if his brakes were smoking, they weren't cooked. He did the same at the restart at Mugello last year. His brakes looked like they were on fire that race. Smoke was pouring out of his wheels.

I think it was a definite accident.

[El Scorchio]

I dont think it happened at the start as the brakes were already cooked by then, It also wouldn't be consistent with Bono telling him it was on the upshift of some sort. I think it was probably earlier in the lap.

It must have been just before his attack on Perez. If it had been a good period of time before then, Bono would have warned him about it.

It's illegal to talk to drivers on formation laps, probably why he wasn't given a warning. That's of course only If it the restart even was treated as a normal race start where that is the case. I'm not 100% certain it was because he was told strat 5 just before start and in that case he probably did bump brake magic button just after launch.

On the other hand It would make sense he turned brake warming up earlier as it's easier to cook the brakes when only fronts are doing all the stopping, but come to think about it, hamilton would probably spot it at first braking event to the grid after he turned it off that it's been turned on again, if that makes sense. Maybe they'll tell us at their race debrief on youtube.

I remember he used the 'hot smoking brakes' tactic to get ahead of Bottas last year on a standing restart (Mugello?) and it worked perfectly. Clearly going for the same thing here but obviously because that button was accidentally pressed, it made everything academic.

Thinking about it, Bono probably also could have told him about the button on the warm up lap with no problem if he did accidentally have it on (and also he'd have felt it on that lap) as it clearly could have been a safety issue.

I think the same as you, that it was accidentally touched and activated at the start or on upshift. Just a freak event.

[Marty_Y]

I read or heard somewhere that it got pressed or hit accidentally as he passed Perez and was manoeuvring to defend a possible comeback, so he didn't have time to notice it happened before he got to the corner.

Whatever the circumstances it was a unfortunate accident, things happen it's not the end of the world but it's just so disappointing and could possibly be the points that make the difference in the long run.

In all it's a weekend I'd sooner forget (no points for Mercedes) and move onto the next one.

[Marty_Y]

I expect everyone already knows all about brake magic but here's a good explanation if anyone's interested.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/expl ... u/6544419/

"

Once in his grid slot, Hamilton will have deactivated the brake magic function via the controls on the wheel and then set about preparing for the restart.

However, during the start, as he steered away from Sergio Perez in the run to Turn 1 he accidentally hit the ‘magic’ button – engaging the brake bias override.

This moved the brake balance forward and caused him to snatch the brakes into Turn 1, before sailing past the apex into the run-off area and effectively ending his chances of scoring points.

Mercedes’ post-race investigation will look into how Hamilton was able to reactive the magic setting, and that will potentially prompt tweaks to its steering wheel controls or software settings to ensure it cannot happen again."

[NathanOlder]

On the token rule, some are saying that the tokens had to be spent in Bahrain. So could Mercedes have submitted what they spent their tokens on and just not put it on the car yet ?

[dans79]

On the token rule, some are saying that the tokens had to be spent in Bahrain. So could Mercedes have submitted what they spent their tokens on and just not put it on the car yet ?

I don't think so, because the entire point of the token system is to ensure teams are only running one revision all season.

[dans79]

I expect everyone already knows all about brake magic but here's a good explanation if anyone's interested.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/expl ... u/6544419/

"

Once in his grid slot, Hamilton will have deactivated the brake magic function via the controls on the wheel and then set about preparing for the restart.

However, during the start, as he steered away from Sergio Perez in the run to Turn 1 he accidentally hit the ‘magic’ button – engaging the brake bias override.

This moved the brake balance forward and caused him to snatch the brakes into Turn 1, before sailing past the apex into the run-off area and effectively ending his chances of scoring points.

Mercedes’ post-race investigation will look into how Hamilton was able to reactive the magic setting, and that will potentially prompt tweaks to its steering wheel controls or software settings to ensure it cannot happen again."

I'm actually shocked that it seems to be just a simple button.

I would expect anything that has such a profound impact on the car, would need a double positive to activate/deactivate it. One example is, is requiring the driver to push 2 buttons simultaneously. Ideally the 2 buttons are on opposite sides of the wheel, and are in non standard locations.

Another possibility would be the single button has to be depressed in a certain sequence to activate/deactivate the system. For example, depress the button for 2-4 seconds, then wait 2-4 seconds before you again have to depress the button for 2-4 seconds.

It takes longer to activate/deactivate the system, but it all but guarantees it can't be done accidentally.

[Marty_Y]

I expect everyone already knows all about brake magic but here's a good explanation if anyone's interested.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/expl ... u/6544419/

"

Once in his grid slot, Hamilton will have deactivated the brake magic function via the controls on the wheel and then set about preparing for the restart.

However, during the start, as he steered away from Sergio Perez in the run to Turn 1 he accidentally hit the ‘magic’ button – engaging the brake bias override.

This moved the brake balance forward and caused him to snatch the brakes into Turn 1, before sailing past the apex into the run-off area and effectively ending his chances of scoring points.

Mercedes’ post-race investigation will look into how Hamilton was able to reactive the magic setting, and that will potentially prompt tweaks to its steering wheel controls or software settings to ensure it cannot happen again."

I'm actually shocked that it seems to be just a simple button.

I would expect anything that has such a profound impact on the car, would need a double positive to activate/deactivate it. One example is, is requiring the driver to push 2 buttons simultaneously. Ideally the 2 buttons are on opposite sides of the wheel, and are in non standard locations.

Another possibility would be the single button has to be depressed in a certain sequence to activate/deactivate the system. For example, depress the button for 2-4 seconds, then wait 2-4 seconds before you again have to depress the button for 2-4 seconds.

It takes longer to activate/deactivate the system, but it all but guarantees it can't be done accidentally.




require 2 buttons to be pushed at the same time, or that the button has to be pushed in a sequence/pattern to engage or disengage it.

I knew that they had the system and understood the function of it but I was unaware of the procedure to activate it.

I agree that a sequence would eliminate the risk of accidental activation, the only thing I can think why they don't do that is maybe time, as soon as a vsc is called they want to activate it asap to get heat in the tyres?

However pressing two buttons simultaneously as you suggested would be ideal because it wouldn't take any longer than pressing one and would eliminate the possibility accidentally hitting one button.