2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Shrieker
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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zibby43 wrote:
Sat Sep 25, 2021 7:04 pm
Merc may take PU penalties with both drivers.

https://twitter.com/adamcooperf1/status ... 49929?s=21
Of the remaining tracks, this is the one that makes the most sense, if you're going to change PU/components.

Downside is, they place themselves close to Verstappen. Upside, they'll have fresh components, which will allow them to go toe toe with Max in the coming rounds, which they more than likely will need.
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zibby43
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Big Tea wrote:
Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:15 pm
zibby43 wrote:
Sat Sep 25, 2021 7:04 pm
Merc may take PU penalties with both drivers.

https://twitter.com/adamcooperf1/status ... 49929?s=21
The only thing that matters is getting more points than Max, even if its not a win.
If they think it is going to need a replacement, and they also think they are quicker than Max, it is the sensible thing to do.

Waiting until to another track leaves the door open for Max to go +25, or even if Ham comes back into the points, its the first few places that the worthwhile points are
Shrieker wrote:
Sat Sep 25, 2021 8:21 pm
Of the remaining tracks, this is the one that makes the most sense, if you're going to change PU/components.

Downside is, they place themselves close to Verstappen. Upside, they'll have fresh components, which will allow them to go toe toe with Max in the coming rounds, which they more than likely will need.

Agree with both of you.

Hammerfist
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Sorry but i think its a stupid idea to start from the back. The win is there to be had. Take it ffs. Verstappen and hamilton at the back is just asking for trouble imo. I just dont trust maxs head in wheel to wheel combat with hamilton and with him leading the championship he can afford to be more agressive and cause another double dnf and his lead is left unscathed.
Mercedes must take what should be an open goal. I would be shocked if they dont do this, unless hamiltons engine is damaged or perhaps the gearbox took a hit when hitting the wall with that spin in q3.

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SiLo
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Yeah its pretty dumb of them to want to take one here. They should still easily win this race if they are sensible on strategy.

Really they want to take a penatly at a track they thing they would finish P2-P4 on anyway, because they have the pace to get back up there.
Felipe Baby!

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ringo
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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I dont think the hit on the wall was an issue.
It was very slow in both the pits and on the track.
They should go with what is sure and that is startin in P4. Try to take the win. They have the pace to bypass and win.
Sainz and russel are just place holders.
Max and Dani Ric are the threats to focus in.

I do not think Max's crashing days are over. Some how i feel he has more dnf's in him for the remaining races. Mercedes can build up as many points as they can right now and take the engine penalty in Usa or Brasil. Both those races merc can use strategy to end up on the podium from the back.
For Sure!!

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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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ringo wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 12:56 am
I dont think the hit on the wall was an issue.
It was very slow in both the pits and on the track.
They should go with what is sure and that is startin in P4. Try to take the win. They have the pace to bypass and win.
Sainz and russel are just place holders.
Max and Dani Ric are the threats to focus in.

I do not think Max's crashing days are over. Some how i feel he has more dnf's in him for the remaining races. Mercedes can build up as many points as they can right now and take the engine penalty in Usa or Brasil. Both those races merc can use strategy to end up on the podium from the back.
Correct me if I'm wrong but both Alonso AND Ric are directly behind Lewis. He's gonna have to get a hell of a start to deal with them.

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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Manoah2u
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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It's a double edged sword. If Max didnt have no penalty and qualified p1 or so, Mercedes guaranteed would have changed Lewis' engine.
However, there's a benefit to be had that Max is starting from the back, so it's likely they would benefit from staying in front an as such keep an 'old' engine.

But, qualification results were bad, so bad that Lewis starts P4 and the cars in front are not easy to pass, perhaps Russell is another story.
Cars behind him will likely stay behind no matter the strategy. He's also under no real pressure from Perez or so.

The issue is that Hamilton will likely not progress beyond P3, and if Max gets a bit well through the field he's going to likely finish no less than P9 in the race.

The big 'risk' is that it's not at all unlikely that there are going to be a (/more than one) neutralization(s), so SC, which will bring Max into play and could put Hamilton in harms way.

It would mean finishing the race perhaps even beaten or close to Max, and still needing to replace the engine.
Tactically, they're not gonna win this race anyway. If they replace more than one component, and adjust setup, have free tire choice, then it's very likely that Hamilton despite starting at the back, will finish somewhere between p4 and p8. this goes for Max just as much. in other words, damage control.

Another thing i cannot help but wonder is this: is Hamilton experiencing more aftermath from Max' car on his head than they're willing to claim, or is he 'suffering' a bit from lungcovid.
I'm personally finding Hamilton's lesser form a bit suspicious, and the wall contact in the pit AND then the spin during a lap a bit odd. He might just not be in top form right now perhaps due to a simple cold or such, who knows. But paired to the Merc also having hit the wall with the front left in the pits and the back tire wall in the spin, it's got to be something to consider. The car might have some more 'damage' than advertised.

anyway, time will tell. gonna be an interesting race.

I wouldnt be surprised to see Sainz take the win btw!
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zibby43
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Manoah2u wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:52 am
It's a double edged sword. If Max didnt have no penalty and qualified p1 or so, Mercedes guaranteed would have changed Lewis' engine.
However, there's a benefit to be had that Max is starting from the back, so it's likely they would benefit from staying in front an as such keep an 'old' engine.

But, qualification results were bad, so bad that Lewis starts P4 and the cars in front are not easy to pass, perhaps Russell is another story.
Cars behind him will likely stay behind no matter the strategy. He's also under no real pressure from Perez or so.

The issue is that Hamilton will likely not progress beyond P3, and if Max gets a bit well through the field he's going to likely finish no less than P9 in the race.

The big 'risk' is that it's not at all unlikely that there are going to be a (/more than one) neutralization(s), so SC, which will bring Max into play and could put Hamilton in harms way.

It would mean finishing the race perhaps even beaten or close to Max, and still needing to replace the engine.
Tactically, they're not gonna win this race anyway. If they replace more than one component, and adjust setup, have free tire choice, then it's very likely that Hamilton despite starting at the back, will finish somewhere between p4 and p8. this goes for Max just as much. in other words, damage control.

Another thing i cannot help but wonder is this: is Hamilton experiencing more aftermath from Max' car on his head than they're willing to claim, or is he 'suffering' a bit from lungcovid.
I'm personally finding Hamilton's lesser form a bit suspicious, and the wall contact in the pit AND then the spin during a lap a bit odd. He might just not be in top form right now perhaps due to a simple cold or such, who knows. But paired to the Merc also having hit the wall with the front left in the pits and the back tire wall in the spin, it's got to be something to consider. The car might have some more 'damage' than advertised.

anyway, time will tell. gonna be an interesting race.

I wouldnt be surprised to see Sainz take the win btw!
Hamilton is capped at P3?

I disagree strongly with that. He’s got every chance for the win.

Sainz doesn’t have the straight line speed to fend off Lewis.

The Merc was much quicker than all the cars in front of Hamilton in terms of race pace.

Pany
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Bottas, driver without pridonoyr at all, even now that has been given godd bye.

Pany
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Bottas, driver without honour at all, even now that has been given godd bye.

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ringo
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Manoah2u wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 8:52 am
It's a double edged sword. If Max didnt have no penalty and qualified p1 or so, Mercedes guaranteed would have changed Lewis' engine.
However, there's a benefit to be had that Max is starting from the back, so it's likely they would benefit from staying in front an as such keep an 'old' engine.

But, qualification results were bad, so bad that Lewis starts P4 and the cars in front are not easy to pass, perhaps Russell is another story.
Cars behind him will likely stay behind no matter the strategy. He's also under no real pressure from Perez or so.

The issue is that Hamilton will likely not progress beyond P3, and if Max gets a bit well through the field he's going to likely finish no less than P9 in the race.

The big 'risk' is that it's not at all unlikely that there are going to be a (/more than one) neutralization(s), so SC, which will bring Max into play and could put Hamilton in harms way.

It would mean finishing the race perhaps even beaten or close to Max, and still needing to replace the engine.
Tactically, they're not gonna win this race anyway. If they replace more than one component, and adjust setup, have free tire choice, then it's very likely that Hamilton despite starting at the back, will finish somewhere between p4 and p8. this goes for Max just as much. in other words, damage control.

Another thing i cannot help but wonder is this: is Hamilton experiencing more aftermath from Max' car on his head than they're willing to claim, or is he 'suffering' a bit from lungcovid.
I'm personally finding Hamilton's lesser form a bit suspicious, and the wall contact in the pit AND then the spin during a lap a bit odd. He might just not be in top form right now perhaps due to a simple cold or such, who knows. But paired to the Merc also having hit the wall with the front left in the pits and the back tire wall in the spin, it's got to be something to consider. The car might have some more 'damage' than advertised.

anyway, time will tell. gonna be an interesting race.

I wouldnt be surprised to see Sainz take the win btw!
I think this is a pessimistic view. If lap 1 is clean ie no funny stuff from Alonso or Ricciardo then Hamilton will be in P1 before the first stint is up. It is very rare that Hamilton is stuck behind another car on a track that has overtaking opportunities, worse a slower car.
For Sure!!

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atanatizante
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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What can we say about the top speeds from the qualy? Some drivers setup their car with the little chance of rain/changing conditions in the race? Maybe this could be said about who was faster on wet/changing conditions and who was fast on a dry track ... https://www.fia.com/events/fia-formula- ... nformation

Image

Just looking at the intermediate 2 top speeds (just after the second DRS zone), we could see VER and HAM at the top and down the list NOR, RIC and SAI ...
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NL_Fer
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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Isn’t it a little foul to fit a 5th engine, just to hinder Verstappen? Bit like intentionally breaking the seal on Massa’s gearbox with Ferrari.

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El Scorchio
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Re: 2021 AMG Mercedes F1 Team

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NL_Fer wrote:
Sun Sep 26, 2021 10:25 am
Isn’t it a little foul to fit a 5th engine, just to hinder Verstappen? Bit like intentionally breaking the seal on Massa’s gearbox with Ferrari.
Sensible tactics. But it’s only because Bottas qualified nowhere and can’t help Hamilton from the front but he can from there. With the speed on the straights, Verstappen may get stuck behind him down the field and score less/no points. And let’s be honest, Red Bull would 100% do the same in this situation. It also means Bottas will have plenty of engine power to try and take the win away from Verstappen in whatever race Hamilton starts from the back in.

It’s one of those double standards things where if RBR do it, it’s lauded as a tactical master stroke and if Mercedes do it it’s frowned upon as bad sportsmanship or throwing the other driver under the bus.