That's great to see - 100k people just to cheer on Checo. Well done Mexico.Wouter wrote: ↑03 Nov 2021, 23:32There were 100 000 visitors today to catch a glimpse of Checo, who gave a number of demonstrations in Mexico City.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FDTBPTGXoAA ... name=small
“If I was going to go for car, I would go for the Red Bull,” said Smedley. “I think it’s a slightly better car and it has been a better car all season.
I think that they’ve had the best car. I think they had a significantly better car at the start of the season, and they’ve probably, it’s fair to say, failed to capitalise on that.
But then, as the season’s gone on, they’ve still kept that that small advantage. It’s swung Mercedes’ way on occasions but, overall, they’ve still had the best car.”
Like I said above, I don't have an opinion and I'm not giving one here. So no, I didn't miss anything. You asked for a source, there it is. The tongue in cheek/joke etc are all opinions. Fact is he did say those words like Sieper said.Just_a_fan wrote: ↑03 Nov 2021, 23:43Yeah, but crashing in to someone to try to get a DNF for them and not you is a totally idiotic thing to do. It's more likely to end up with both cars out of the race. So, no, Hamilton didn't do it on purpose to Max.Gillian wrote: ↑03 Nov 2021, 21:22I don't have an opinion in this silly discussion but it's not that hard to verify what Sieper is saying. You can easily find it, but here you go... This is what he said right before Silverstone:
Verstappen sure did get blown away.“But this is so far from over. I don’t know what is he, 32 points behind Max? that’s a DNF away. And he’s in the hunt again.
.....
I think we’re going to Silverstone, blow everyone away, finish one and two and 30 seconds away from everybody else,” he added with his tongue-in-cheek.
https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/arti ... aqPuD.html
And did you miss the "tongue in cheek" bit? It means he wasn't being serious. It was a joke.
Let's clear it up a bit.zibby43 wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 05:35Below is an excerpt from an interview with one of the best engineers in the sport in recent years, Rob Smedley. He comments on which car he’d take for the remaining 5 races (and why).
“If I was going to go for car, I would go for the Red Bull,” said Smedley. “I think it’s a slightly better car and it has been a better car all season.
I think that they’ve had the best car. I think they had a significantly better car at the start of the season, and they’ve probably, it’s fair to say, failed to capitalise on that.
But then, as the season’s gone on, they’ve still kept that that small advantage. It’s swung Mercedes’ way on occasions but, overall, they’ve still had the best car.”
What has Smedley's nationality got to do with anything? If he's a top engineer then he's a top engineer. Or is this one of those "he's British and therefore hates Max and RedBull" things?Dee wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 09:28Let's clear it up a bit.zibby43 wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 05:35Below is an excerpt from an interview with one of the best engineers in the sport in recent years, Rob Smedley. He comments on which car he’d take for the remaining 5 races (and why).
“If I was going to go for car, I would go for the Red Bull,” said Smedley. “I think it’s a slightly better car and it has been a better car all season.
I think that they’ve had the best car. I think they had a significantly better car at the start of the season, and they’ve probably, it’s fair to say, failed to capitalise on that.
But then, as the season’s gone on, they’ve still kept that that small advantage. It’s swung Mercedes’ way on occasions but, overall, they’ve still had the best car.”
"Below is an excerpt from an interview with one of the best BRITISH engineers in the sport in recent years, Rob Smedley"
Biased because he says that RB failed to capitalise on their car this year and saying "If you take the races where he (Max) hasn’t finished, it might not be a net 50 points compared to Lewis, but it’s certainly quite a few points that he’s given away"
Completely wrong. Max has not given away anything, points have been taken away from him in Baku, Hungary through no fault of his own and what have RB failed to capitalise on this year? They have been brilliant strategically.
If you are going to quote Rob, I will link this article https://the-race.com/formula-1/gary-and ... tle-fight/ as my evidence for RB being the slight underdog so far.
If he is so good, why didn't he join a top team after he was at Williams when they went from great to back of the grid?zibby43 wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 05:35Below is an excerpt from an interview with one of the best engineers in the sport in recent years, Rob Smedley. He comments on which car he’d take for the remaining 5 races (and why).
“If I was going to go for car, I would go for the Red Bull,” said Smedley. “I think it’s a slightly better car and it has been a better car all season.
I think that they’ve had the best car. I think they had a significantly better car at the start of the season, and they’ve probably, it’s fair to say, failed to capitalise on that.
But then, as the season’s gone on, they’ve still kept that that small advantage. It’s swung Mercedes’ way on occasions but, overall, they’ve still had the best car.”
I am accusing him of bias because he has "seen and heard" Max being crashed out and still stated that RB and Max have failed to capitalise on their car and have "given away" points which is completely false. And I can accuse him of national bias because he has stated that falsehood on a podcast where every single person is British (even though it's an official F1 media outlet which should have balanced analysis) and who for the last few months have been completely biased in their analysis with one even saying that Max has had more luck this year than Hamilton...Just_a_fan wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 10:48What has Smedley's nationality got to do with anything? If he's a top engineer then he's a top engineer. Or is this one of those "he's British and therefore hates Max and RedBull" things?Dee wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 09:28Let's clear it up a bit.
"Below is an excerpt from an interview with one of the best BRITISH engineers in the sport in recent years, Rob Smedley"
Biased because he says that RB failed to capitalise on their car this year and saying "If you take the races where he (Max) hasn’t finished, it might not be a net 50 points compared to Lewis, but it’s certainly quite a few points that he’s given away"
Completely wrong. Max has not given away anything, points have been taken away from him in Baku, Hungary through no fault of his own and what have RB failed to capitalise on this year? They have been brilliant strategically.
If you are going to quote Rob, I will link this article https://the-race.com/formula-1/gary-and ... tle-fight/ as my evidence for RB being the slight underdog so far.
And you think he's biased because you don't agree with his opinion. You like Anderson's opinion because it agrees with yours. It's not Smedley that's showing bias here.
Smedley has given his opinion based on what he has seen / heard. He's got a lot of experience in recent/current F1 and is involved in the data analysis for the Formula One Group so he's certainly got access to way more real data than any of us. But he was just giving his opinion on which car he would rather have at this point because he thinks it's the best car. Anderson thinks RedBull are underdogs and that suits your preference for Max being the great underdog champion taking his car to wins and titles it couldn't achieve otherwise because he's the best driver on the grid. That's cool, but don't accuse Smedley of being biased just because you don't like his opinion. That's not cool. And neither is accusing him of nationalist bias, either.
"Crashed out". That old emotive phrase again. Max chose to defend the line. He had the car advantage and still looked only at that corner and not the race as a whole. That's on him. When you have the best car and you're fighting for a championship, you pick when to play hardball. That's an error by Max. He could have given way - just as Hamilton had done two corners before to avoid Max coming up the inside - but he chose not to. His decision in that split second cost him a lot of points. I don't blame him for that as he may have believed he could make it work, but that's not to say that he had to do that when the alternative was to give up the place at that moment and then work to either get it back later, or take the points for second place and move on. You see, it's not all black and white. There are nuances - that's what makes sport fun to watch in the first place.Dee wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 11:09I am accusing him of bias because he has "seen and heard" Max being crashed out and still stated that RB and Max have failed to capitalise on their car and have "given away" points which is completely false. And I can accuse him of national bias because he has stated that falsehood on a podcast where every single person is British (even though it's an official F1 media outlet which should have balanced analysis) and who for the last few months have been completely biased in their analysis with one even saying that Max has had more luck this year than Hamilton...Just_a_fan wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 10:48What has Smedley's nationality got to do with anything? If he's a top engineer then he's a top engineer. Or is this one of those "he's British and therefore hates Max and RedBull" things?Dee wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 09:28
Let's clear it up a bit.
"Below is an excerpt from an interview with one of the best BRITISH engineers in the sport in recent years, Rob Smedley"
Biased because he says that RB failed to capitalise on their car this year and saying "If you take the races where he (Max) hasn’t finished, it might not be a net 50 points compared to Lewis, but it’s certainly quite a few points that he’s given away"
Completely wrong. Max has not given away anything, points have been taken away from him in Baku, Hungary through no fault of his own and what have RB failed to capitalise on this year? They have been brilliant strategically.
If you are going to quote Rob, I will link this article https://the-race.com/formula-1/gary-and ... tle-fight/ as my evidence for RB being the slight underdog so far.
And you think he's biased because you don't agree with his opinion. You like Anderson's opinion because it agrees with yours. It's not Smedley that's showing bias here.
Smedley has given his opinion based on what he has seen / heard. He's got a lot of experience in recent/current F1 and is involved in the data analysis for the Formula One Group so he's certainly got access to way more real data than any of us. But he was just giving his opinion on which car he would rather have at this point because he thinks it's the best car. Anderson thinks RedBull are underdogs and that suits your preference for Max being the great underdog champion taking his car to wins and titles it couldn't achieve otherwise because he's the best driver on the grid. That's cool, but don't accuse Smedley of being biased just because you don't like his opinion. That's not cool. And neither is accusing him of nationalist bias, either.
At least what I have submitted about the car advantage is based on data and linked to an article, not from "one of the best" engineers who also can't seem to "see and hear" whats actually been happening this year
I never mentioned Silverstone, I specifically mentioned Baku and Hungary but you took 8 sentences and over 100 words to hijack this discussion and twist it to something you feel is a negative against Max.Just_a_fan wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 11:21"Crashed out". That old emotive phrase again. Max chose to defend the line. He had the car advantage and still looked only at that corner and not the race as a whole. That's on him. When you have the best car and you're fighting for a championship, you pick when to play hardball. That's an error by Max. He could have given way - just as Hamilton had done two corners before to avoid Max coming up the inside - but he chose not to. His decision in that split second cost him a lot of points. I don't blame him for that as he may have believed he could make it work, but that's not to say that he had to do that when the alternative was to give up the place at that moment and then work to either get it back later, or take the points for second place and move on. You see, it's not all black and white. There are nuances - that's what makes sport fun to watch in the first place.Dee wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 11:09I am accusing him of bias because he has "seen and heard" Max being crashed out and still stated that RB and Max have failed to capitalise on their car and have "given away" points which is completely false. And I can accuse him of national bias because he has stated that falsehood on a podcast where every single person is British (even though it's an official F1 media outlet which should have balanced analysis) and who for the last few months have been completely biased in their analysis with one even saying that Max has had more luck this year than Hamilton...Just_a_fan wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 10:48
What has Smedley's nationality got to do with anything? If he's a top engineer then he's a top engineer. Or is this one of those "he's British and therefore hates Max and RedBull" things?
And you think he's biased because you don't agree with his opinion. You like Anderson's opinion because it agrees with yours. It's not Smedley that's showing bias here.
Smedley has given his opinion based on what he has seen / heard. He's got a lot of experience in recent/current F1 and is involved in the data analysis for the Formula One Group so he's certainly got access to way more real data than any of us. But he was just giving his opinion on which car he would rather have at this point because he thinks it's the best car. Anderson thinks RedBull are underdogs and that suits your preference for Max being the great underdog champion taking his car to wins and titles it couldn't achieve otherwise because he's the best driver on the grid. That's cool, but don't accuse Smedley of being biased just because you don't like his opinion. That's not cool. And neither is accusing him of nationalist bias, either.
At least what I have submitted about the car advantage is based on data and linked to an article, not from "one of the best" engineers who also can't seem to "see and hear" whats actually been happening this year
And Smedley was talking about the car being the best. Which it has been for much of the season. Have points been dropped? Yes, because no team is perfect. Could Max and the team have done things better and had more points now? Yes. Likewise Mercedes and Hamilton. And every other team and driver on the grid. That's not bias, it's life. Humans aren't perfect.
.Just_a_fan wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 11:21And Smedley was talking about the car being the best. Which it has been for much of the season.
Have points been dropped? Yes, because no team is perfect. Could Max and the team have done things better and had more points now? Yes. Likewise Mercedes and Hamilton. And every other team and driver on the grid. That's not bias, it's life. Humans aren't perfect.
It’s on him. Yeah right. That is why a penalty was applied.Just_a_fan wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 11:21"Crashed out". That old emotive phrase again. Max chose to defend the line. He had the car advantage and still looked only at that corner and not the race as a whole. That's on him. When you have the best car and you're fighting for a championship, you pick when to play hardball. That's an error by Max. He could have given way - just as Hamilton had done two corners before to avoid Max coming up the inside - but he chose not to. His decision in that split second cost him a lot of points. I don't blame him for that as he may have believed he could make it work, but that's not to say that he had to do that when the alternative was to give up the place at that moment and then work to either get it back later, or take the points for second place and move on. You see, it's not all black and white. There are nuances - that's what makes sport fun to watch in the first place.Dee wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 11:09I am accusing him of bias because he has "seen and heard" Max being crashed out and still stated that RB and Max have failed to capitalise on their car and have "given away" points which is completely false. And I can accuse him of national bias because he has stated that falsehood on a podcast where every single person is British (even though it's an official F1 media outlet which should have balanced analysis) and who for the last few months have been completely biased in their analysis with one even saying that Max has had more luck this year than Hamilton...Just_a_fan wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 10:48
What has Smedley's nationality got to do with anything? If he's a top engineer then he's a top engineer. Or is this one of those "he's British and therefore hates Max and RedBull" things?
And you think he's biased because you don't agree with his opinion. You like Anderson's opinion because it agrees with yours. It's not Smedley that's showing bias here.
Smedley has given his opinion based on what he has seen / heard. He's got a lot of experience in recent/current F1 and is involved in the data analysis for the Formula One Group so he's certainly got access to way more real data than any of us. But he was just giving his opinion on which car he would rather have at this point because he thinks it's the best car. Anderson thinks RedBull are underdogs and that suits your preference for Max being the great underdog champion taking his car to wins and titles it couldn't achieve otherwise because he's the best driver on the grid. That's cool, but don't accuse Smedley of being biased just because you don't like his opinion. That's not cool. And neither is accusing him of nationalist bias, either.
At least what I have submitted about the car advantage is based on data and linked to an article, not from "one of the best" engineers who also can't seem to "see and hear" whats actually been happening this year
And Smedley was talking about the car being the best. Which it has been for much of the season. Have points been dropped? Yes, because no team is perfect. Could Max and the team have done things better and had more points now? Yes. Likewise Mercedes and Hamilton. And every other team and driver on the grid. That's not bias, it's life. Humans aren't perfect.
It’s just spite. Hamilton has been winning for 6 seasons often times indeed with a 1,5 second advantage in qualifying for both Mercedesses over the rest of the field. So we got the “the car is very good” argument (rightfully so) and people think that takes away from Hamilton’s driving. Now we have RBR in the mix (when have both RBR cars been 1,5 second up on the rest of the field?) and now we immediately get the “it’s the car”. The season isn’t even decided yet. The Mercedes still holds the edge like you correctly clarified Wouter.Wouter wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 11:44.Just_a_fan wrote: ↑04 Nov 2021, 11:21And Smedley was talking about the car being the best. Which it has been for much of the season.
Have points been dropped? Yes, because no team is perfect. Could Max and the team have done things better and had more points now? Yes. Likewise Mercedes and Hamilton. And every other team and driver on the grid. That's not bias, it's life. Humans aren't perfect.
And just to add something about this statement by Smedley.
"If I had to choose a car, I would choose the Red Bull. I think it's just the better car and it has been all season."
Based on what?
Imola, Portugal, Spain, France, Hungary, Monza, Russia, Turkey and America, Mercedes was convincingly faster.
Red Bull was only convincingly faster in Austria. Even at a race like Zandvoort where Max won, the data shows that Mercedes was faster.
The only races Max really won by force majeure were Monaco (after a very bad weekend at Mercedes) and Austria.
But if Hamilton loses, it must of course be the car. It doesn't matter how many strategic blunders Mercedes makes, or how often Hamilton himself makes a mistake. He is behind in the championship so the car is not that good.
“It has been a better car all season" is absolute nonsens.
https://www.auto-motor-und-sport.de/for ... oren-2026/Red Bull had to take a risk in Austin. Is that the right approach? Risk instead of waiting in such a tight world championship?
Marko: Because we lost the start - which was due to the clutch pressure point, which was not Max's fault -
and we lost the superiority of the medium band, we had to intervene.
The development of the current car will be stopped?
Marko: The only thing we still do is fine-tune it. The technical team is working on 2022.
Hamilton could use a fifth engine. Maybe in Brazil. Will Verstappen get away with his contingent?
Marko: In normal races and without accidents we can get away with our PUs. According to our information, our hope is that Hamilton will have to change again.
Are you afraid of falling out?
Marko: So far we have been absolutely reliable with the Honda engine. One is never immune to a defect.
But the engine situation is certainly more reassuring on the Honda side than on the Mercedes side.
