2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
mendis
mendis
19
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:12 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

Big Tea wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 12:33 pm
chrisc90 wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 11:56 am
Mosin123 wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:14 am


4 million pound a year / 5 mill USD
That's actually quite surprising given everything really. Especially given the next highest earner is Perez on £8.2m/year. However I guess that will go up in the negotiations next time round.
It does however put food for thought on the table for Mercedes bosses given how the 2022 standings played out and the whopping salary difference between the 2 drivers; A massive £29m a year. ( I guess the team knows exactly how much time in the season was sacrificed by drivers to car development rather than going out winning races)
Its not just about on track value, Hamilton has a huge value to the team, sponsors (who pay more) and Merc/ineos/Woolf for work out of the car. Russell's day will come but he is not well enough known outside F1 yet
I don't know which sponsors have followed Lewis to Mercedes, other than him influencing Tommy Hilfiger to join Mercedes. It's a 4 million pounds per year sponsorship and they supply the team apprarels. It was Hugo Boss who was their official apparels sponsors and suppliers before TH replaced them.

2022 Sponsors List.
Image

User avatar
hollus
Moderator
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2009 12:21 am
Location: Copenhagen, Denmark

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

If the topic is 2023 and not 2022, there is a 2023 thread over here (now stickied):
viewtopic.php?t=30863
Rivals, not enemies.

User avatar
Stu
Moderator
Joined: Sat Nov 02, 2019 9:05 am
Location: Norfolk, UK

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

mendis wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 2:28 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 12:33 pm
chrisc90 wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 11:56 am


That's actually quite surprising given everything really. Especially given the next highest earner is Perez on £8.2m/year. However I guess that will go up in the negotiations next time round.
It does however put food for thought on the table for Mercedes bosses given how the 2022 standings played out and the whopping salary difference between the 2 drivers; A massive £29m a year. ( I guess the team knows exactly how much time in the season was sacrificed by drivers to car development rather than going out winning races)
Its not just about on track value, Hamilton has a huge value to the team, sponsors (who pay more) and Merc/ineos/Woolf for work out of the car. Russell's day will come but he is not well enough known outside F1 yet
I don't know which sponsors have followed Lewis to Mercedes, other than him influencing Tommy Hilfiger to join Mercedes. It's a 4 million pounds per year sponsorship and they supply the team apprarels. It was Hugo Boss who was their official apparels sponsors and suppliers before TH replaced them.

2022 Sponsors List.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FIMXGufXsAI ... =4096x4096
Interesting, Tommy Hilfiger is a Lawrence Stroll brand (his first sponsor deal in the F1 world back in ‘92-‘93 with Lotus).
Perspective - Understanding that sometimes the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view.

mendis
mendis
19
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:12 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

Stu wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 3:39 pm
mendis wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 2:28 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 12:33 pm


Its not just about on track value, Hamilton has a huge value to the team, sponsors (who pay more) and Merc/ineos/Woolf for work out of the car. Russell's day will come but he is not well enough known outside F1 yet
I don't know which sponsors have followed Lewis to Mercedes, other than him influencing Tommy Hilfiger to join Mercedes. It's a 4 million pounds per year sponsorship and they supply the team apprarels. It was Hugo Boss who was their official apparels sponsors and suppliers before TH replaced them.

2022 Sponsors List.
https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FIMXGufXsAI ... =4096x4096
Interesting, Tommy Hilfiger is a Lawrence Stroll brand (his first sponsor deal in the F1 world back in ‘92-‘93 with Lotus).
If I understand correctly, Lawrence acquired TH in 1989 and then sold it off in 2006.

harty71
harty71
-2
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:03 am

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

Hamilton is no longer worth the wages tbh, that's of course, if they cost more than he brings in.

Mercedes have a driver that can lead the team, the question is do they find him a teammate who can seriously challenge him or do they bring in another Bottas, for me, I'd get the best driver on the market, I'd be looking at grabbing Norris.

User avatar
ringo
225
Joined: Sun Mar 29, 2009 9:57 am

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

harty71 wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 6:30 pm
Hamilton is no longer worth the wages tbh, that's of course, if they cost more than he brings in.

Mercedes have a driver that can lead the team, the question is do they find him a teammate who can seriously challenge him or do they bring in another Bottas, for me, I'd get the best driver on the market, I'd be looking at grabbing Norris.
You are not seeing that LH is more than just a driver to the team and also to the sport of F1. That's why we are dicussing his contract, what he is thinking etc. and not much of GR.

GR is good but he cannot walk in LH shoes yet.
Ferrari made the mistake of undervaluing Kimi, their last champion. Mercedes wont fall for that.
For Sure!!

User avatar
PlatinumZealot
542
Joined: Thu Jun 12, 2008 2:45 am

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

GR is just another "fast driver" but he's no icon, or even close to being a Legend yet. Button, Nico are also fast drivers that managed to beat Lewis so Let's stop this foolish talk. George's job is to focus on getting a few more wins and learning form Lewis (perhaps trying to survive a motivated Lewis?) until Lewis retires.
🖐️✌️☝️👀👌

RonMexico
RonMexico
0
Joined: Wed Jul 08, 2020 1:11 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

PlatinumZealot wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 9:16 pm
GR is just another "fast driver" but he's no icon, or even close to being a Legend yet. Button, Nico are also fast drivers that managed to beat Lewis so Let's stop this foolish talk. George's job is to focus on getting a few more wins and learning form Lewis (perhaps trying to survive a motivated Lewis?) until Lewis retires.
Do you think Mercedes might be keeping him around based on his past rather than his future competitiveness?

The contract talks have certainly come at an inconvenient time for both the team and #44

harty71
harty71
-2
Joined: Mon Nov 14, 2022 9:03 am

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

ringo wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 8:20 pm
harty71 wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 6:30 pm
Hamilton is no longer worth the wages tbh, that's of course, if they cost more than he brings in.

Mercedes have a driver that can lead the team, the question is do they find him a teammate who can seriously challenge him or do they bring in another Bottas, for me, I'd get the best driver on the market, I'd be looking at grabbing Norris.
You are not seeing that LH is more than just a driver to the team and also to the sport of F1. That's why we are dicussing his contract, what he is thinking etc. and not much of GR.

GR is good but he cannot walk in LH shoes yet.
Ferrari made the mistake of undervaluing Kimi, their last champion. Mercedes wont fall for that.
Which was my point, if Hamilton still brings in more money than he costs in wages then of course, keep him on. If though, he is costing the company money then they should be looking to replace him. Russell has shown he's more than capable of filling his boots, give him the right car and he will win championships.

aMessageToCharlie
aMessageToCharlie
0
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2020 1:28 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 9:17 am
harty71 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 8:30 am
RonMexico wrote:
Sun Jan 22, 2023 11:12 pm

Do you think Mercedes might be keeping him around based on his past rather than his future competitiveness?

The contract talks have certainly come at an inconvenient time for both the team and #44
That's it for me, you're only as good as your last race. At the end of the day, all that counts is your championship results, Russell was the lead driver, how can anyone dare to claim he's not in the same league as Hamilton, that is absurd.
Doesn’t it get tiring looking for every marginally pro Hamilton post and responding with your most vociferous obvious anti-Hamilton BS? I assume school isn’t keeping you occupied?
<mod edit: personal stuff on deleted posts removed>

From my perspective MERC overpaid, simply on the basis of what their negotiation position was relative to LH. The economy is completely screwed, Mercedes is not in a great position economically going forward. They have a capable, cheap driver secured who can bring in the championship and one of the best cars. LH on the other hand is at the dawn of his career and desperate for that 8th title. And Merc is pretty much his only chance at competitive materiell right now. They could have gotten his services for much cheaper.

But good for LH for cutting out a great deal for himself.

User avatar
SiLo
128
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 6:09 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

Of course you do, because he will make the difference in the most crucial moments. That’s why he’s a seven time world champion.
Verstappen on Hamilton is absolutely relevant to this discussion, and I believe he would still make make the difference. People are putting far too much weight onto last year.
Felipe Baby!

Tiny73
Tiny73
0
Joined: Mon Dec 05, 2016 10:48 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

...
aMessageToCharlie wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 10:12 am
From my perspective MERC overpaid, simply on the basis of what their negotiation position was relative to LH. The economy is completely screwed, Mercedes is not in a great position economically going forward. They have a capable, cheap driver secured who can bring in the championship and one of the best cars. LH on the other hand is at the dawn of his career and desperate for that 8th title. And Merc is pretty much his only chance at competitive materiell right now. They could have gotten his services for much cheaper.

But good for LH for cutting out a great deal for himself.
I think you’re underestimating the power of the LH brand, that’s why they pay top dollar, same as Tom Brady, Ronald, Messi amongst others.

<personal stuff removed>

mendis
mendis
19
Joined: Sun Jul 03, 2022 3:12 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 11:58 am
I think you’re underestimating the power of the LH brand, that’s why they pay top dollar, same as Tom Brady, Ronald, Messi amongst others.
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.

f1jcw
f1jcw
17
Joined: Thu Feb 21, 2019 8:15 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

I believe the wage is largely coming from INEOS, who are interested in buying Manchester United, Lewis is also rumoured want to expand into sporting ownership, so you never know whats going in the background.

User avatar
SiLo
128
Joined: Sun Jul 25, 2010 6:09 pm

Re: 2022 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

Post

mendis wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 12:28 pm
Tiny73 wrote:
Mon Jan 23, 2023 11:58 am
I think you’re underestimating the power of the LH brand, that’s why they pay top dollar, same as Tom Brady, Ronald, Messi amongst others.
From a business standpoint, I don't understand how Mercedes is going to benefit out of Lewis' marketability or his brand. Mercedes is a massive brand and caters to a certain elite segment in the automobile market. I don't know if some of Mercedes' customers want Lewis to deliver their newly purchased car as he is 7 time WDC. Most brands chase successful F1 team for sponsoring. If Mercedes doesn't win for another couple of years, sponsors disappear even if Lewis is there in the team. That's how it works.

A driver's commercial viability for an F1 team is purely performance oriented. Brands did not throng at Mercedes in 2010-12, despite having a 7 time WDC driving for them. When they started winning, they started making fortune from sponsor deals that not just covered the F1 expenses, but gave profitability, despite their annual F1 spending in the range of 500 million a year.

Red Bull is back to winning ways and they started attracting mega millions sponsor deals.

I have no doubt if Mercedes creates another car with 3 to 5 tenths advantage, even Russell can win championships and the sponsors would flow in thick and fast even if Lewis disappears from the scene.

Marketability works for individual athletes. The more success they get, more marketable they become. Marketability of the driver is no reason for an F1 team to offer fortune deals. It's the speed and how long that speed is going to persist. The younger and faster, the more valuable.
I'll hazard a guess that having him with the team generates a huge amount of merchandise sales, as well as massive amounts of exposure simply by association. Mercedes won't pay him if they don't think hes worth it.
Felipe Baby!