2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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Just_a_fan
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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chrisc90 wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 9:59 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 9:53 pm
chrisc90 wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 9:34 pm


They'd then be a extra lap down then?
They are lapped, they are not going to be on the podium so why run a non competitive (no overtaking) lap just for the numbers? The race finishes when the leader crosses the line even if they are 4 laps down.
So what if car position 11 was lapped, but the lead car was between car position 10 and 11? It could only be a few seconds for car position 11 behind 10 with a big pace advantage. So why should position 11 lose out on potential points just because they are lapped?
Any system will have winners and losers, sadly, short of having everyone stop where they are and then restart when the issue is cleared up. And that's not really possible with these cars.
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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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Lapped cars may unlap, or remain in place depending on the situation on track. However in Abu Dhabi only some cars were allowed to unlap to create a "race." A really fabricated one!

Speaking of fabricated, did anyone understand how Leclec was 16 seconds behind Max before the SC then 22 seconds behind afterward? where did six seconds come from?!
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Senna108
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:06 am
Lapped cars may unlap, or remain in place depending on the situation on track. However in Abu Dhabi only some cars were allowed to unlap to create a "race." A really fabricated one!

Speaking of fabricated, did anyone understand how Leclec was 16 seconds behind Max before the SC then 22 seconds behind afterward? where did six seconds come from?!
Do you mean the VCS?

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bluechris
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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For me? whatever huppens in the last 10 laps must be RED Flagged without the ability to change tyres. Either way noone had count to pit in the last 10 laps so the only thing huppening really is all the field to come together and we get also a standing start again which is great.
Liberty want the races to finish under green flag, we also as fans of F1 want that even if its bad for someone who had disapear in the distance before the Red Flag. Its the best scenario in my mind to keep everyone happy and have racing till the end.

dxpetrov
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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Yes, red flagged but with a start behind safety car! Standing start is not fair for a driver who might have been leading whole race to be ruined by a bad start at the end.

Cs98
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:06 am
Lapped cars may unlap, or remain in place depending on the situation on track. However in Abu Dhabi only some cars were allowed to unlap to create a "race." A really fabricated one!

Speaking of fabricated, did anyone understand how Leclec was 16 seconds behind Max before the SC then 22 seconds behind afterward? where did six seconds come from?!
It came from the fact when you drive slower due to the SC and the distance stays the same between cars, the time delta increases. The laws of motion are in cahoots with Verstappen. Fabricated!!!

Cs98
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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Just_a_fan wrote:
Mon Sep 12, 2022 9:11 pm
AR3-GP wrote:
Mon Sep 12, 2022 8:19 pm
Just_a_fan wrote:
Mon Sep 12, 2022 8:04 pm
De Vries needed help getting out of the car as he was not at all F1-fit and the race took it out of him physically.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F9MxZqVMfro
It's surprising since Monza is actually quite a relaxing track. Very long straights to rest.
He's not race fit. Even Monza is hell for the muscles if they aren't race fit.
I still imagine he might be in better shape than a returning Albon, who probably will have lost a lot of fitness. For next race that is.

Cs98
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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cliffgamerz wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 11:10 am
I re-watched the last part of the race again to see what went wrong, on lap 47 Ricardo came to halt on entry to second Lesmo corner where there was no escape route to clear the car by marshals, so it should have been a double waved yellows and or virtual safety car should have been put up immediately, but instead a yellow on the second sector was put up for full 1 lap or to be precise around a full minute to change status to FULL SAFETY CAR on OSD only and not VIRTUAL SAFETY CAR which was on lap 48, but safety car wasn't out on track till lap 51 started and it caught Russell and not Max!? Now to my surprise what happened between lap 48 till 51 where was safety car and no media or people are discussing this matter, on sky commentary on Karun questioned on lap 50 where is safety car on track but it was still not on track but on pit-lane. FIA seriously needs to answer this procedure as it was not according to normal standard procedure, last year Abu Dhabi is a different thing and its not related to what happened here, the system is flawed and i was surprised no teams nor media or fans as discussing this topic. Also it wasn't a crash and no debris or damage to barrier was there to halt the safe restart to race which was bizarre, at least one lap racing was possible because car was cleared off track at end of lap 51. All these careful observations were made by pausing the broadcast and taking notes, so anyone else can do the same to confirm my findings.

I can also understand the anger of Tifosi's shown at end of the race, but honestly it was so wrong of anyone to Boo at drivers for something they didn't have control at or even do anything wrong from their end, it is pathetic if the crowd threw foul language and hatred towards Max's family or team members, those people should be banned from entry to any F1 events or any events. To be just mad or angry at FIA for what happened is fair, but that doesn't mean doing death threats or calling names, instead it needs proper investigation and review like last years last race. Also i see people on this forum just show a hate towards other fans, so i never comment always,i just want to share my unbiased opinion and if anyone is offended by anything i say i will say sorry in advance as i don't intend to hurt anyone's feelings, we are just fans, let the drivers and teams do the fighting on track, lets just enjoy the races as they are as long as they are fair and fun to watch.
The safety car came out much earlier than lap 51. It’s just they didn’t film it. The timing was very poor because the SC came out right after Verstappen/Leclerc passed. And then they pitted on the next lap. Leading to a very long chase after the SC. So they caught the SC several laps after it came out.
Last edited by Cs98 on Wed Sep 14, 2022 8:33 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Wouter
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:06 am
Lapped cars may unlap, or remain in place depending on the situation on track. However in Abu Dhabi only some cars were allowed to unlap to create a "race." A really fabricated one!

Speaking of fabricated, did anyone understand how Leclec was 16 seconds behind Max before the SC then 22 seconds behind afterward? where did six seconds come from?!
.
Here you can see that.

https://en.mclarenf-1.com/2022/gp/s9048 ... s/821-833/
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Wouter
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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Wouter wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 8:31 am
PlatinumZealot wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 3:06 am
Lapped cars may unlap, or remain in place depending on the situation on track. However in Abu Dhabi only some cars were allowed to unlap to create a "race." A really fabricated one!

Speaking of fabricated, did anyone understand how Leclec was 16 seconds behind Max before the SC then 22 seconds behind afterward? where did six seconds come from?!
.
Here you can see that. BTW, it wasn't 22 sec behind but 2.446 sec behind.

https://en.mclarenf-1.com/2022/gp/s9048 ... s/821-833/
The Power of Dreams!

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rscsr
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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bluechris wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 7:00 am
For me? whatever huppens in the last 10 laps must be RED Flagged without the ability to change tyres. Either way noone had count to pit in the last 10 laps so the only thing huppening really is all the field to come together and we get also a standing start again which is great.
Liberty want the races to finish under green flag, we also as fans of F1 want that even if its bad for someone who had disapear in the distance before the Red Flag. Its the best scenario in my mind to keep everyone happy and have racing till the end.
I think the safety car is a relic of the past. Imho they should just make them stop at the starting grid instead. Maybe even do a standing start after, but I think most would prefer a flying start to be practically the same as a safety car restart. Just do a warming lap when the issue is dealt with and then restart the race.

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Big Tea
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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chrisc90 wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 9:59 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 9:53 pm
chrisc90 wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 9:34 pm


They'd then be a extra lap down then?
They are lapped, they are not going to be on the podium so why run a non competitive (no overtaking) lap just for the numbers? The race finishes when the leader crosses the line even if they are 4 laps down.
So what if car position 11 was lapped, but the lead car was between car position 10 and 11? It could only be a few seconds for car position 11 behind 10 with a big pace advantage. So why should position 11 lose out on potential points just because they are lapped?
They could still be classified as -1 lap without having to actually cover the distance, and take out the time. If necessary, hold them back 10 seconds at the pit exit. It would save lots of time for the restart, and in reality, if they are already a lap or more down they are not going to make up 10 seconds.
I suppose in extremes there could be a leading car recovering, but this is not going to be often, and they will stil have the 10 seconds.
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cliffgamerz
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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Cs98 wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 8:29 am
cliffgamerz wrote:
Tue Sep 13, 2022 11:10 am
I re-watched the last part of the race again to see what went wrong, on lap 47 Ricardo came to halt on entry to second Lesmo corner where there was no escape route to clear the car by marshals, so it should have been a double waved yellows and or virtual safety car should have been put up immediately, but instead a yellow on the second sector was put up for full 1 lap or to be precise around a full minute to change status to FULL SAFETY CAR on OSD only and not VIRTUAL SAFETY CAR which was on lap 48, but safety car wasn't out on track till lap 51 started and it caught Russell and not Max!? Now to my surprise what happened between lap 48 till 51 where was safety car and no media or people are discussing this matter, on sky commentary on Karun questioned on lap 50 where is safety car on track but it was still not on track but on pit-lane. FIA seriously needs to answer this procedure as it was not according to normal standard procedure, last year Abu Dhabi is a different thing and its not related to what happened here, the system is flawed and i was surprised no teams nor media or fans as discussing this topic. Also it wasn't a crash and no debris or damage to barrier was there to halt the safe restart to race which was bizarre, at least one lap racing was possible because car was cleared off track at end of lap 51. All these careful observations were made by pausing the broadcast and taking notes, so anyone else can do the same to confirm my findings.

I can also understand the anger of Tifosi's shown at end of the race, but honestly it was so wrong of anyone to Boo at drivers for something they didn't have control at or even do anything wrong from their end, it is pathetic if the crowd threw foul language and hatred towards Max's family or team members, those people should be banned from entry to any F1 events or any events. To be just mad or angry at FIA for what happened is fair, but that doesn't mean doing death threats or calling names, instead it needs proper investigation and review like last years last race. Also i see people on this forum just show a hate towards other fans, so i never comment always,i just want to share my unbiased opinion and if anyone is offended by anything i say i will say sorry in advance as i don't intend to hurt anyone's feelings, we are just fans, let the drivers and teams do the fighting on track, lets just enjoy the races as they are as long as they are fair and fun to watch.
The safety car came out much earlier than lap 51. It’s just they didn’t film it. The timing was very poor because the SC came out right after Verstappen/Leclerc passed. And then they pitted on the next lap. Leading to a very long chase after the SC. So they caught the SC several laps after it came out.
It was only mentioned on HUD on TV overlay, the actual car maybe came out on lap 51, just re-watch the race and see on lap 51 the car exited the pits when camera caught safety car. i don't have the F1TV feed as its not available in my region to prove the same as that could prove that properly. If someone has that maybe they can share some views on it, and i am not saying you are wrong or i am right, its unclear until proven.

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hollus
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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I’ll try a pic tonight. But as said above: SC on track in front of Russel from lap 48.
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organic
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Re: 2022 Italian Grand Prix - Monza, Sep 09 - 11

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hollus wrote:
Wed Sep 14, 2022 1:13 pm
I’ll try a pic tonight. But as said above: SC on track in front of Russel from lap 48.
I've just checked the onboard of Russell at lap 48 on F1tv and Russell is indeed behind the SC:

F1tv blocks my screenshots so idk how to acquire proof

But at 1:17:47 on the broadcast, it's lap 48/53 and Russell is a few car lengths behind the SC