2023 Alpine F1 Team

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diffuser
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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Holm86 wrote: ↑
Tue Oct 17, 2023 5:50 pm
Seems like a joke, but it isn't πŸ˜„

https://www.instagram.com/p/CygZgnoKfpZ ... BiNWFlZA==
I guess it's news cause of the people involved but nothing has changed from the Alpine F1 point of view. It's the same 24% of Alpine F1. The group is just spread over more people now.

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ME4ME
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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In some Renault-Alpine boardroom:

1st person: "Ah yes, this should compensate for those annoying peope we got rid of."
2nd person: "..they only costed us money!"
3rd person: "Yeah and also there was that Alonso guy! Actually expecting a contract.."
4th person: "We're way better off now.. "

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organic
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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JordanMugen
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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Where is the pace? It seems Alpine-Renault's in-season development has been very poor, unless I'm mistaken?

Alpine-Renault had two cars in the top 8 in COTA, didn't they? Within striking distance of the likes of McLaren, Ferrari and Mercedes? What has gone so wrong since then with falling backwards instead of gaining more on the leaders?

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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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JordanMugen wrote: ↑
Fri Nov 03, 2023 10:54 pm
Where is the pace? It seems Alpine-Renault's in-season development has been very poor, unless I'm mistaken?

Alpine-Renault had two cars in the top 8 in COTA, didn't they? Within striking distance of the likes of McLaren, Ferrari and Mercedes? What has gone so wrong since then with falling backwards instead of gaining more on the leaders?
PU bad at altitude imo.

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diffuser
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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AR3-GP wrote: ↑
Fri Nov 03, 2023 11:28 pm
JordanMugen wrote: ↑
Fri Nov 03, 2023 10:54 pm
Where is the pace? It seems Alpine-Renault's in-season development has been very poor, unless I'm mistaken?

Alpine-Renault had two cars in the top 8 in COTA, didn't they? Within striking distance of the likes of McLaren, Ferrari and Mercedes? What has gone so wrong since then with falling backwards instead of gaining more on the leaders?
PU bad at altitude imo.
Alonso finished 5th last year. Ocon 8th.

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AR3-GP
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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diffuser wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 6:20 am
AR3-GP wrote: ↑
Fri Nov 03, 2023 11:28 pm
JordanMugen wrote: ↑
Fri Nov 03, 2023 10:54 pm
Where is the pace? It seems Alpine-Renault's in-season development has been very poor, unless I'm mistaken?

Alpine-Renault had two cars in the top 8 in COTA, didn't they? Within striking distance of the likes of McLaren, Ferrari and Mercedes? What has gone so wrong since then with falling backwards instead of gaining more on the leaders?
PU bad at altitude imo.
Alonso finished 5th last year. Ocon 8th.
2022 PU was fine. It's the 2023 PU that doesn't have as much as the others.

Enstone
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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There's cooling issues... which has been a problem since the start of the year and which is being tested in a new layout for 2024. This system is a parachute and penalizes the team on the straights. (in addition to the deficit of 15-20hp from the PU).

Famin has told that even on the integration there's work to do for next year with a new gearbox !

P6 this year the badest result since a while... this Rossi management period was a real waste of time, money, and pilots looking at how Piastri is delivering :!:

Farnborough
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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organic wrote: ↑
Fri Oct 20, 2023 8:41 pm
Mclaren young driver academy :D

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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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Farnborough wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 1:58 pm
organic wrote: ↑
Fri Oct 20, 2023 8:41 pm
Mclaren young driver academy :D
He's probably heading to the WEC program with Alpine so not this time :mrgreen:

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diffuser
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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AR3-GP wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 12:36 pm
diffuser wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 6:20 am
AR3-GP wrote: ↑
Fri Nov 03, 2023 11:28 pm


PU bad at altitude imo.
Alonso finished 5th last year. Ocon 8th.
2022 PU was fine. It's the 2023 PU that doesn't have as much as the others.
Alpine did change their piston rings in the off season. I don't remember for sure but I don't think Honda or Merc made many changes in the off season.

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diffuser
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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Enstone wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 1:33 pm
There's cooling issues... which has been a problem since the start of the year and which is being tested in a new layout for 2024. This system is a parachute and penalizes the team on the straights. (in addition to the deficit of 15-20hp from the PU).

Famin has told that even on the integration there's work to do for next year with a new gearbox !

P6 this year the badest result since a while... this Rossi management period was a real waste of time, money, and pilots looking at how Piastri is delivering :!:
I also think they aren't as fuel efficient as others. They're always carrying more fuel weight than others.

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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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diffuser wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 2:17 pm
AR3-GP wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 12:36 pm
diffuser wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 6:20 am

Alonso finished 5th last year. Ocon 8th.
2022 PU was fine. It's the 2023 PU that doesn't have as much as the others.
Alpine did change their piston rings in the off season. I don't remember for sure but I don't think Honda or Merc made many changes in the off season.
Merc was reported to have made double digit gains in the off season and they also resolved their high altitude weakness. As for Honda, they made continued refinement of the ERS system.

I won't give up on this :lol:

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diffuser
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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AR3-GP wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 2:40 pm
diffuser wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 2:17 pm
AR3-GP wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 12:36 pm


2022 PU was fine. It's the 2023 PU that doesn't have as much as the others.
Alpine did change their piston rings in the off season. I don't remember for sure but I don't think Honda or Merc made many changes in the off season.
Merc was reported to have made double digit gains in the off season and they also resolved their high altitude weakness. As for Honda, they made continued refinement of the ERS system.

I won't give up on this :lol:
By definition, ERS is limited to 160HP, so your gains are gonna be on efficiency. Also, they're biggest impediment to making any changes is that Alpine has to approve them as "reliability" updates. The FIA really depend on the PU Manufacturers to police each other. So you're changes there were probably software related. Why would Honda be taking $$$ from the 2026 project to help RBR who dropped them? Remember Honda owns the IP. That's hardware and software. RBR can't touch that PU. That and Honda moved everybody out of the project in 2021. They brought some back for the 2026 project but alot of the people have changed. They, like most, just have maintaining engineering staff left on the current PU. Pretty sure that the PU budget is capped now. Just don't remember when the CAP went into effect. If it is in effect, spending money from the 2026 project to make improvements on a dead project isn't wise. That's probably why Alpine want the fuel increase, it doesn't steal resources from the 2026 project.

AR3-GP
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Re: 2023 Alpine F1 Team

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diffuser wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 5:27 pm
AR3-GP wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 2:40 pm
diffuser wrote: ↑
Sat Nov 04, 2023 2:17 pm


Alpine did change their piston rings in the off season. I don't remember for sure but I don't think Honda or Merc made many changes in the off season.
Merc was reported to have made double digit gains in the off season and they also resolved their high altitude weakness. As for Honda, they made continued refinement of the ERS system.

I won't give up on this :lol:
By definition, ERS is limited to 160HP, so your gains are gonna be on efficiency. Also, they're biggest impediment to making any changes is that Alpine has to approve them as "reliability" updates. The FIA really depend on the PU Manufacturers to police each other. So you're changes there were probably software related. Why would Honda be taking $$$ from the 2026 project to help RBR who dropped them? Remember Honda owns the IP. That's hardware and software. RBR can't touch that PU. That and Honda moved everybody out of the project in 2021. They brought some back for the 2026 project but alot of the people have changed. They, like most, just have maintaining engineering staff left on the current PU. Pretty sure that the PU budget is capped now. Just don't remember when the CAP went into effect. If it is in effect, spending money from the 2026 project to make improvements on a dead project isn't wise. That's probably why Alpine want the fuel increase, it doesn't steal resources from the 2026 project.
We have discussed this at length! The manufacturers have been driving london buses through the regulations and Renault approved it! It's not all about 2026. Manufacturers still want to win NOW. Remember that the engine development is budget capped and manufacturers had more resources than that already:

Honda is improving the PU for next year, direct from Honda: https://www.gpblog.com/en/news/239287/h ... -2024.html

This is direct from Koji Watanabe at Honda on improvements that Ferrari and Mercedes made last winter and Honda will again make improvement for RB in 2024.
"In terms of power and performance, we may not improve anything, but in other areas we can also make strides with this engine. At Ferrari, for example, they have developed the engine considerably and Mercedes' ERS system (Energy Recovery, ed.) is also very strong. We will also improve our engine for next year in terms of its longevity. So there is definitely something in the pipeline," Watanabe informed.
RB pays Honda for services. That's why Honda still work for them. Also, what Honda learn now on the track benefits 2026. RB is helping them as much as they help RB.