Sprint format (2023)

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dialtone
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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For some reason I didn't ready much about this new sprint format... It makes no sense. 2 qualis and 2 races for these sprint weekends? Makes no sense whatsoever especially in a city circuit like Baku.

Are people really going to be entertained because they see what could potentially be the exact same race (no setup changes allowed after quali)?

Standing starts, especially into a narrow corner bound by walls, and qualifying are the most crash prone times in a race weekend and they double them, do all the work to save money only to retroactively add more events that the engine needs to last for, and more repair costs for crashed cars, let's not forget all the talk about life-work balance for mechanics and engineers and how much time they spend on the road working...

As one living in the west coast US (but I could be living in the east and it would be the same), the morning event at 1.30am my time with the sprint race at 6.30am is ridiculous, I have to obviously skip the sprint quali, so I'm going to wake up at 6.30am and have no idea what I'm about to watch.
A crash bad enough probably can't be repaired easily in 4 hours (think about Mick Schumacher in Jeddah or Monaco type crashes) and anyway it will involve using more parts than you would otherwise because there's not enough time to throughly check that a given part is going to work. Say you bump the rear wheel on the wall and worry about the gearbox, you could spend the night checking before, now you have 3-4 hours so you're going to replace the whole thing without even thinking about it.

What "the EDGE" wrote at the start of this thread would make 100x more sense, at least I get a mini quali and mini race to setup the car, then make whatever changes I want and get into the real quali and race, but I bet they know nobody would watch a morning sprint race so instead we get this nonsense jumbled up order of events.

Dumbfounded doesn't begin to describe it. I understand iterating towards a better version of the format, but this isn't it.

If Ferrari burns through an engine during this stupid format only to get a 10 places grid penalty for LEC during the real race I'll send a strongly worded tweet over to FOM.

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JordanMugen
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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dialtone wrote:
Sat Apr 29, 2023 6:32 am
For some reason I didn't ready much about this new sprint format... It makes no sense. 2 qualis and 2 races for these sprint weekends? Makes no sense whatsoever especially in a city circuit like Baku.
Of course it makes no sense. Oh well, what can you do. :lol:

Sevach
Sevach
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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It's not called Sprint Qualifying anymore, straight up Sprint Race, 2 races per week the shorter one doesn't affect the main one.
If they want to mix things up i wonder why they didn't go for the full F2 format, partial reverse grid, whomever is 10th in qualifying starts on pole for the sprint, then 9th... , 2 qualifyings is unlikely to deliver any "show".

Extra practice sessions/time and revised parc ferme would be good, but of course their objective is to make things weird.

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Vanja #66
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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SQ should be moved to Friday afternoon and SR to Saturday morning. Leaving the Q session Saturday afternoon will remove the current disconnect from the Race. Also, this would mean two independant Parc Ferme periods, rendering Sprint Q+R as FPs with points regarding setup for the Q and main Race.

If this is done, I don't expect anyone would have any real issues with Sprint addition. It would trully add value to the weekend over typical FP1-2-3-Q-R format. Everyone would be happy, F1, FIA, teams, drivers and fans.
And they call it a stall. A STALL!

#Aerogimli
#DwarvesAreNaturalSprinters
#BlessYouLaddie

BlueCheetah66
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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There shouldnt be two Qualifying sessions, there's no need. Have P1 and P2 on Friday, then there isn't some useless practice session. But the biggest thing I hate about this sprint format is that it isn't consistent. After this season, they have to decide whether they want sprints or not. If they do they have to make it across all the races. MotoGP made it for every race in the season, and even though I'm not a fan of them, its better that it is at every event and not just at a few selected to try and make it look better

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JordanMugen
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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BlueCheetah66 wrote:
Sat Apr 29, 2023 11:09 am
There shouldnt be two Qualifying sessions, there's no need. Have P1 and P2 on Friday, then there isn't some useless practice session. But the biggest thing I hate about this sprint format is that it isn't consistent. After this season, they have to decide whether they want sprints or not. If they do they have to make it across all the races. MotoGP made it for every race in the season, and even though I'm not a fan of them, its better that it is at every event and not just at a few selected to try and make it look better
But the whole point of the Sprint format and moving qualifying to Friday is to add value to Friday?

So how about still having qualifying on Friday and simply basing the Sprint grid on a reverse top 10 of the qualifying result like in F2? The FP2 session on Saturday morning will still be of minor interest, but that's fine, better than having an unnecessary second qualifying.

To be clear, I am not in favour of Sprints at all. But if you're going to use the F2 race format, then do it properly, no?

AR3-GP
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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JordanMugen wrote:
Sat Apr 29, 2023 4:32 pm
BlueCheetah66 wrote:
Sat Apr 29, 2023 11:09 am
There shouldnt be two Qualifying sessions, there's no need. Have P1 and P2 on Friday, then there isn't some useless practice session. But the biggest thing I hate about this sprint format is that it isn't consistent. After this season, they have to decide whether they want sprints or not. If they do they have to make it across all the races. MotoGP made it for every race in the season, and even though I'm not a fan of them, its better that it is at every event and not just at a few selected to try and make it look better
But the whole point of the Sprint format and moving qualifying to Friday is to add value to Friday?

So how about still having qualifying on Friday and simply basing the Sprint grid on a reverse top 10 of the qualifying result like in F2? The FP2 session on Saturday morning will still be of minor interest, but that's fine, better than having an unnecessary second qualifying.

To be clear, I am not in favour of Sprints at all. But if you're going to use the F2 race format, then do it properly, no?
The sprint race should be on Friday, not the GP qualifying (imo).

the EDGE
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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JordanMugen wrote:
Sat Apr 29, 2023 4:32 pm
BlueCheetah66 wrote:
Sat Apr 29, 2023 11:09 am
There shouldnt be two Qualifying sessions, there's no need. Have P1 and P2 on Friday, then there isn't some useless practice session. But the biggest thing I hate about this sprint format is that it isn't consistent. After this season, they have to decide whether they want sprints or not. If they do they have to make it across all the races. MotoGP made it for every race in the season, and even though I'm not a fan of them, its better that it is at every event and not just at a few selected to try and make it look better
But the whole point of the Sprint format and moving qualifying to Friday is to add value to Friday?

So how about still having qualifying on Friday and simply basing the Sprint grid on a reverse top 10 of the qualifying result like in F2? The FP2 session on Saturday morning will still be of minor interest, but that's fine, better than having an unnecessary second qualifying.

To be clear, I am not in favour of Sprints at all. But if you're going to use the F2 race format, then do it properly, no?
No way… F1 should never have reverse grids, in any shape or form.

harty71
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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What a borefest that was.

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JordanMugen
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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I have an idea: instead of doing a sprint race, why not just do a double header Grand Prix?

A Saturday race and a Sunday race, both 305km. It is a format has that been used successfully for a long time in the Australian Touring Car Championship and occassionally in Indycar, and unlike Sprint races, the format *actually works*.

In other series that use that format, there is always good fan engagement and attendance over the two race days, and quite often the two races can turn out quite differently too.

It could be progressive grid or two qualifying sessions, it doesn't really matter. I prefer the progressive grid as that way the Saturday and Sunday races form an overarching narrative. For F1's purposes, I suppose qualifying could be retained on Friday. :)

Obviously, the same points would be awarded for both races. Of course, it defeats the point of awarding a single Grand Prize, but the Sprint format has already messed that up...

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RZS10
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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While we're at it ... why not have a continuous string of just sprint races with the grid always being the reverse order of the previous one?

Friday would have the "morning sprint" and the one in the afternoon would be sponsored, so something like the "Heinz Tomato Ketchup Sprint" or the "Home Depot Sprint".

Then on Saturday when things get even more serious just the "Sprint" and then the "Super Sprint" (just make sure no one abbreviates it as SS because that's bad)

and then on Sunday have a regular race.

Image

CaribouBread
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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Even if we ignore the obvious problems with the sprint format, I do not understand how this format is supposed to attract new fans/be appealing to new viewers. The "hours viewed" metric might go up for Friday but I don't think this would be sustainable.

Its needlessly convoluted, a new viewer will not be able to make heads or tails to which session is the 'important' one. The competitive sessions are spread out on different days, on different hours. The actually entertaining qualifying session is on a Friday, where most people won't be able to watch live.

This tendency for sport to try to monopolize the weekend is just too much. A casual viewer will rarely be willing to invest 3 days of their week to F1.

AR3-GP
AR3-GP
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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CaribouBread wrote:
Sun Apr 30, 2023 3:49 am
Even if we ignore the obvious problems with the sprint format, I do not understand how this format is supposed to attract new fans/be appealing to new viewers. The "hours viewed" metric might go up for Friday but I don't think this would be sustainable.

Its needlessly convoluted, a new viewer will not be able to make heads or tails to which session is the 'important' one. The competitive sessions are spread out on different days, on different hours. The actually entertaining qualifying session is on a Friday, where most people won't be able to watch live.

This tendency for sport to try to monopolize the weekend is just too much. A casual viewer will rarely be willing to invest 3 days of their week to F1.
All good points.

dialtone
dialtone
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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This format is not really about attracting new fans IMHO but it's about having higher average viewership to charge more for sponsors and TV rights.

AR3-GP
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Re: Sprint format (2023)

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dialtone wrote:
Sun Apr 30, 2023 4:44 am
This format is not really about attracting new fans IMHO but it's about having higher average viewership to charge more for sponsors and TV rights.
Correct. It is also helping to get more ticket sales at the track on Friday. Saturday has been made very mediocre, but once you have fans at the track on Friday, they are going to stay for all 3 days. Ordinarily they might have only arrived on Saturday.

I think they should aim to expand to racing on Thursday as well. Why not? (this is sarcasm).