Pirelli will take Bridgestone's place after 2010

[WhiteBlue]

Pirelli is expected to kick off its Formula One testing programme before the 2010 calendar's August break is out.

The Italian marque recently began testing its new GP2 tyres, and Germany's Auto Bild Motorsport believes Mugello will be the scene of the first F1 prototypes' debuts -- fitted to Toyota's 2009 car, the TF109.

Mercedes reserve driver Nick Heidfeld is tipped to be in the cockpit, with a public announcement expected imminently.

Mugello will reportedly be the first of six dedicated Pirelli tyre tests before Abu Dhabi, where in the days after the F1 season finale, the 12 teams will get their first taste of next year's rubber.

Four compounds will be supplied to the teams, with the target being a range of reliable, consistent tyres.

"I do not think companies today can afford hundreds of millions of euros to make their tyres faster," said Pirelli's F1 chief Paul Hembery.

And he added: "We want to stay (in F1) longer than three years."

I agree with Paul Hembery that it not the job of the tyre companies to make their tyres faster. A control tyre needs to be reliable and consistent. If there is something I wish from a tyre in addition it is duarability, low rolling resistance and lack of marbles.

[Edis]

Pirelli is expected to kick off its Formula One testing programme before the 2010 calendar's August break is out.

The Italian marque recently began testing its new GP2 tyres, and Germany's Auto Bild Motorsport believes Mugello will be the scene of the first F1 prototypes' debuts -- fitted to Toyota's 2009 car, the TF109.

Mercedes reserve driver Nick Heidfeld is tipped to be in the cockpit, with a public announcement expected imminently.

Mugello will reportedly be the first of six dedicated Pirelli tyre tests before Abu Dhabi, where in the days after the F1 season finale, the 12 teams will get their first taste of next year's rubber.

Four compounds will be supplied to the teams, with the target being a range of reliable, consistent tyres.

"I do not think companies today can afford hundreds of millions of euros to make their tyres faster," said Pirelli's F1 chief Paul Hembery.

And he added: "We want to stay (in F1) longer than three years."

I agree with Paul Hembery that it not the job of the tyre companies to make their tyres faster. A control tyre needs to be reliable and consistent. If there is something I wish from a tyre in addition it is duarability, low rolling resistance and lack of marbles.

Reliable and consistent is a really good recipe of how to make a boring race. Make the tires fast, unreliable (aside from safety) and unconsistent instead, that will make for better racing.

[Edis]

Pirelli proposes that it will think of implementing michelins idea of 18" wheels in a couple of years.
There was a discussion on the dead weight of the wheels being some 30kgs more. F1 uses magnetism alloy wheels. Why is there no wheels of carbon fiber, is it impossible to make a F1 spec wheels with carbon fiber?

Reason why there will be a 30KG weight increase, sinply put the magneasium alloys are best suited to the job over Carbon wheels, simply put, they are better suited to loadings, and last a longer period of time. Carbon wheels would only be allowed to be raced for about 4-5 races, where Magnesium alloys will generally last up to half a season on average.

On the basis of cost, not to mention man hours to construct carbon wheels. Magnesium wheels only need a block of prime metal and a CNC machine to get to work, between 4-10 hours later you have a wheel, a carbon wheel takes much longer to construct.

Im expecting the weight of the car to go up from 640KG for 2011-2012 to go arround 675KG to compensate for at least some of the weight. The thing is, that the wheels will weigh arround 30KG more, the suspension will be up to 20KG more, but the engines will potentially weigh less and with the posibility of a standardised fuel tank on the horizon for the new engine as well, will also reduce weight in another area.

Magnesium wheels are forged, not machined from solid.

Carbon fibre wheels aren't used because they are banned. They were tried by some series with a few spectacular crashes caused by wheel failures as a result, so they were banned in F1 on safety grounds.

Magnesium wheels are usually checked with x-ray, magnaflux or similar before they are reused.

As for the weight of 18" wheels I would expect them to be around the same weight as the current wheels, with the tires being a bit lighter and the rims a bit heavier.

For a major regulation change in 2013 it would also be possible to reduce the minimum weight limit in order to get rid of the +50 kg of ballast currently used. Engine minimum weight could also be reduced.

[FW17]

Pirelli Motorsport Director Paul Hembery is confident the company will be ready to deliver when it takes over as F1 tyre supplier.

The Italian marque will replace Bridgestone at the start of the 2011 season, but they have a lot to prove following problems during their previous foray into the F1 market in 1991. Back then the tyres they supplied Benetton and Brabham were reasonable during qualifying, but it was a different story during races.

Hembery, though, insists things will be different this time.

"Some people like to live in the past," he told Germany's Auto Bild. "Of course we had this problem, but what we had developed was a very aggressive qualifying tyre. In the last 20 years, the rules and technologies have changed significantly.

He admits that they will adopt a conservative approach for overseas races as the circuits are unknown to them.

"We know the characteristics of many of the European tracks from GP3," he added. "The overseas tracks are largely unknown to us. We will therefore take an accordingly conservative approach to the selection of rubber compounds."

The next season is going to have a significant reduction in downforce levels with the banning of DDD. Why is'nt there a signficant push from the sport for an increase in mechanical grip that would ensure closer racing?

Why does F1 community stand by and allow tyre manufacturers to bring crap to races. Hungary was an example of how they got it wrong. Still people want to take this route next year?? This is an outrage!!

[autogyro]

+1
Tyres should be a technical development area in F1, not a brick wall on grip.

[Jersey Tom]

They can't afford to make their tires faster? Not sure I believe that. They can't afford NOT to, at least in consumer tires, or else the competition will surpass them and take their market share.

Then again, when it comes to control tires in a race series... my opinions:

1. Absolutely need to be consistent and predictable.
2. "Grip," as in raw speed, isn't particularly important
3. Drivability is essential

[FW17]

Then again, when it comes to control tires in a race series... my opinions:

1. Absolutely need to be consistent and predictable.
2. "Grip," as in raw speed, isn't particularly important
3. Drivability is essential

Pirelli needs to set a tarrget on how long the hardest tyre compound last - 150 kms or 300 kms. With statements of "conservative approach " looks like they are aiming for 300 kms with no mechanical grip on offer to make best of next years aero reduction.

Right now one can say the balance between aero to mechanical grip is about 80:20, next year there could be a chance for this to become 60:40 if the mechanical grip is improved but with "consistent and predictable" that ratio will remain 80:20

[WhiteBlue]

If tyre performance will go down a bit and we get significantly less marbles all the worries about too much durability would be unnecessary. We could see much more on track passing making tyre stops redundant.

[raymondu999]

I think it'll work on either extreme. A 0-stop tyre would help racing as much as a 2/3-stop tyre, methinks.

[Jersey Tom]

If tyre performance will go down a bit and we get significantly less marbles all the worries about too much durability would be unnecessary. We could see much more on track passing making tyre stops redundant.

You're not going to get rid of marbles.

1. Hot tread rubber is sticky.
2. Tires wear.

Combine the two.. and when tires wear you get little worms and balls of rubber kicked off of them. Even with a 1-stop or 0-stop tire.. with that many cars running that many laps you're going to get wear debris... and it doesn't take much to significantly change the grip level off the line. Once the rubber cools and hardens up a bit, it's like driving on ball bearings.

Could make the tread as hard as a bowling ball so they don't wear at all.. but you do have to have some sufficient level of grip given the power of the cars, so that they're actually drivable.

[ringo]

Less grip would make for better racing IMO.
So Pirelli can't lose. Comparisons can only be drawn from comparing 2010 lap times to 2011 and even then the cars wont have DDD and F ducts, so Pirelli have the luxury of making a slower tyre than bridgestone, with whatever characteristics they see fit.

[Jersey Tom]

Less grip would make for better racing IMO.
So Pirelli can't lose. Comparisons can only be drawn from comparing 2010 lap times to 2011 and even then the cars wont have DDD and F ducts, so Pirelli have the luxury of making a slower tyre than bridgestone, with whatever characteristics they see fit.

Well.. not quite. Pirelli can come out with a complete trainwreck of a tire in terms of handling.. which can't be dialed out with any amount of suspension tuning. That'd be a 'lose'.

[WhiteBlue]

Could make the tread as hard as a bowling ball so they don't wear at all.. but you do have to have some sufficient level of grip given the power of the cars, so that they're actually drivable.

I hear your words but I'm having problems to believe them. The bowling ball hardness is a figure of speech I guess? I have seen significant differences in the level of rubbering in and marbeling over the +20 years I have followed F1 races. It was worst during the last tyre war. There are also big differences between circuits. Hungary and Monaco have traditionally been circuits that are prone to marbles because teams use softer tyres and they are tight and slow. I don't remember the problem to be very significant on tracks like Spa where they do not usually use soft tyres. So there must be something between a seven lap tyre and a 200 lap tyre like the stuff they use at LeMans.

[ESPImperium]

I think it'll work on either extreme. A 0-stop tyre would help racing as much as a 2/3-stop tyre, methinks.

Make the top 10 guys to only use the option tyre for the race with anyone that starts 11the and below can have access to a single "zero stop" tyre if they wish, but that tyre must start the race stone cold without tyre warmers???

[747heavy]

AFAIK tire warmers are being banned next year anyway, as it stands now.
So Pirelli will have one thing more to take into consideration.

IMHO the situation with Heidfeld testing the tires is a joke.
Nothing against him, far from, but it´s just not right IMO, to use a (test)driver which is contracted to one of the competitors.
I did not seems a fair and creditable approach to me, for a sole supplier.

Nothing to do with his driving talent or his ability as a test driver, just with his contractual situation.