Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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NathanOlder
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:31 pm
NathanOlder wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:29 pm
Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:59 am


Should we just ignore his pre Red Bull career as well? It was obvious from the start that Vettel was a big talent.
True, winning the BMW championship the way he did was very impressive. Not so much when he got to F3, but still was looking a very good prospect.
Plus his stint with Torro Rosso, I don't know what happened to him in 2014 but I have a feeling he'd already decided to go to Ferrari after winning the title in 2013.
I disagree, I think he decided to leave in the spring time of 2014. There's no way he would decide to leave RedBull before he knew what the 2014 order would be. Why decide to leave the best team on the grid at that time? Vettel is 100% a guy who loved breaking records ect, he always wanted fastest laps ect. So he would go to where the best car was. It must have been a fair way in to 2014 when it was clear RedBull would be behind for a while.
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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NathanOlder wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:36 pm
Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:31 pm
NathanOlder wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:29 pm


True, winning the BMW championship the way he did was very impressive. Not so much when he got to F3, but still was looking a very good prospect.
Plus his stint with Torro Rosso, I don't know what happened to him in 2014 but I have a feeling he'd already decided to go to Ferrari after winning the title in 2013.
I disagree, I think he decided to leave in the spring time of 2014. There's no way he would decide to leave RedBull before he knew what the 2014 order would be. Why decide to leave the best team on the grid at that time? Vettel is 100% a guy who loved breaking records ect, he always wanted fastest laps ect. So he would go to where the best car was. It must have been a fair way in to 2014 when it was clear RedBull would be behind for a while.
I think he had an inkling in 2013. I remember his words to the team over the radio after he won the US GP (the second to last race of the season) - "we have to remember these days, there's no guarantee they'll last forever". He won the last 2013 race in Brazil and then didn't win a race again with RedBull.
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Baulz
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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Was he thinking their dominance may not last with the rule change in 2014?

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Moore77
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:31 pm
NathanOlder wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:29 pm
Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:59 am


Should we just ignore his pre Red Bull career as well? It was obvious from the start that Vettel was a big talent.
True, winning the BMW championship the way he did was very impressive. Not so much when he got to F3, but still was looking a very good prospect.
Plus his stint with Torro Rosso, I don't know what happened to him in 2014 but I have a feeling he'd already decided to go to Ferrari after winning the title in 2013.
I guess, it's probably an instinctive decision in 2014. Until 2013, Ferrari had big hopes of getting the new engine regulations right as Luca was the proponent of the new engine regulations as he wanted the formula to move away from Aero. I am sure at that point, Alonso was firmly in place in Ferrari and was most likely hoping for a turn around in 2014. Ferrari didn't get it right and Alonso was frustrated, more than ever and that made the Ferrari management to look elsewhere. Red Bull didn't get it right either and Vettel was frustrated. It was the right time for Ferrari to go after Vettel and lure him to Ferrari. Any A list driver wouldn't have signed with Ferrari at that stage. The only potential reason why Vettel signed, is to emulate his hero, which he admitted once he joined. Having won 4 titles, he seemed to have been content and the next stage of satisfaction was to go to Ferrari and do what Schumacher did. Otherwise, looking at Ferrari's situation in 2014, there was no hope for any A list driver to go there. So, it must have been an instinctive decision in 2014.
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NathanOlder
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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Moore77 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:21 pm
Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:31 pm
NathanOlder wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:29 pm


True, winning the BMW championship the way he did was very impressive. Not so much when he got to F3, but still was looking a very good prospect.
Plus his stint with Torro Rosso, I don't know what happened to him in 2014 but I have a feeling he'd already decided to go to Ferrari after winning the title in 2013.
I guess, it's probably an instinctive decision in 2014. Until 2013, Ferrari had big hopes of getting the new engine regulations right as Luca was the proponent of the new engine regulations as he wanted the formula to move away from Aero. I am sure at that point, Alonso was firmly in place in Ferrari and was most likely hoping for a turn around in 2014. Ferrari didn't get it right and Alonso was frustrated, more than ever and that made the Ferrari management to look elsewhere. Red Bull didn't get it right either and Vettel was frustrated. It was the right time for Ferrari to go after Vettel and lure him to Ferrari. Any A list driver wouldn't have signed with Ferrari at that stage. The only potential reason why Vettel signed, is to emulate his hero, which he admitted once he joined. Having won 4 titles, he seemed to have been content and the next stage of satisfaction was to go to Ferrari and do what Schumacher did. Otherwise, looking at Ferrari's situation in 2014, there was no hope for any A list driver to go there. So, it must have been an instinctive decision in 2014.
+1
Something we agree on :lol:
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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Baulz wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:00 pm
Was he thinking their dominance may not last with the rule change in 2014?
He would have to have expected that it wouldn't. Usually a major rule change ends a period of dominance. I do wonder if the team, and thus him, knew that their car for the forthcoming rule system wouldn't be an outright winner. They'd spent a lot of effort on the aero philosophy up to then and must have known that losing the diffuser blowing that they'd mastered would make their job much trickier. I guess Vettel might also have had an idea that losing diffuser blowing was going to be detrimental to his preferred driving method. He certainly had thrived with the blown diffuser.
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Moore77
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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NathanOlder wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:43 pm
Moore77 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:21 pm
Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 12:31 pm


Plus his stint with Torro Rosso, I don't know what happened to him in 2014 but I have a feeling he'd already decided to go to Ferrari after winning the title in 2013.
I guess, it's probably an instinctive decision in 2014. Until 2013, Ferrari had big hopes of getting the new engine regulations right as Luca was the proponent of the new engine regulations as he wanted the formula to move away from Aero. I am sure at that point, Alonso was firmly in place in Ferrari and was most likely hoping for a turn around in 2014. Ferrari didn't get it right and Alonso was frustrated, more than ever and that made the Ferrari management to look elsewhere. Red Bull didn't get it right either and Vettel was frustrated. It was the right time for Ferrari to go after Vettel and lure him to Ferrari. Any A list driver wouldn't have signed with Ferrari at that stage. The only potential reason why Vettel signed, is to emulate his hero, which he admitted once he joined. Having won 4 titles, he seemed to have been content and the next stage of satisfaction was to go to Ferrari and do what Schumacher did. Otherwise, looking at Ferrari's situation in 2014, there was no hope for any A list driver to go there. So, it must have been an instinctive decision in 2014.
+1
Something we agree on :lol:
This represents our disagreements. :D
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Wass85
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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Schumacher did the same when leaving Benetton in 95, I have a feeling he wanted to emulate is hero by bring Ferrari back to the top.

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raymondu999
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:57 pm
Schumacher did the same when leaving Benetton in 95, I have a feeling he wanted to emulate is hero by bring Ferrari back to the top.
Wasn’t Schumacher’s hero Senna? Or do you mean Vettel emulate Schumacher?
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Wass85
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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raymondu999 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:08 pm
Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:57 pm
Schumacher did the same when leaving Benetton in 95, I have a feeling he wanted to emulate is hero by bring Ferrari back to the top.
Wasn’t Schumacher’s hero Senna? Or do you mean Vettel emulate Schumacher?
Yeah speaking of Vettel pal.

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raymondu999
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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While we’re on this topic, this is a good read

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... ver-alonso
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Wass85
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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raymondu999 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:16 pm
While we’re on this topic, this is a good read

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... ver-alonso
Interesting, so it does look like he had made his mind up by 2013 that he wanted to try and do a Schumacher and win with Ferrari in this new era.

Wass85
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 1:57 pm
Schumacher did the same when leaving Benetton in 95, I have a feeling he wanted to emulate his hero by bringing Ferrari back to the top.

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Moore77
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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Wass85 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 3:43 pm
raymondu999 wrote:
Thu Sep 17, 2020 2:16 pm
While we’re on this topic, this is a good read

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arti ... ver-alonso
Interesting, so it does look like he had made his mind up by 2013 that he wanted to try and do a Schumacher and win with Ferrari in this new era.
I first read that story in 2016, when one of the forum members had posted it. You can find that post on this forum here.
viewtopic.php?p=628503#p628503

Back then I thought it was a concoction of after thoughts, which I still think it is, to prove they had the upper hand on Alonso in decision making. No doubt Vettel harbored feelings to join Ferrari, but he had joined hands in 2013 to leave a team that had given him 3 titles up to that point and was about to deliver another one, was difficult to believe. But truth has always been stranger than fiction. May be Vettel was just happy with 3 (or 4 as he was almost riding high) and wanted to take that leap of faith.
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selvam_e2002
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Re: Silly Season 2020/2021 (starting with silliness in 2019)

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It is not Alonso frustrated with Ferrari in 2014. He is still discussing with Ferrari and he is not aware of Vettel already signed. RB announced that Vettel signed with Ferrari. The announcement not from Ferrari nor Vettel. This caused Alonso to look elsewhere else he would be in Ferrari.

Luca already left Ferrari before Alonso moved out. So I don't think the article shared is a valid one.

We are speculate lot of things however we cannot confirm for what purpose Vettel left RB.