2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

This forum contains threads to discuss teams themselves. Anything not technical about the cars, including restructuring, performances etc belongs here.
adrianjordan
54
User avatar
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 10:34 am
Location: West Yorkshire, England

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by adrianjordan » Wed May 30, 2018 11:00 am

Weren't they all expecting a new PU in Montreal anyway? I thought Renault were bringing their upgraded units to that race??

Also I get confused. Couldn't he swap it anyway, but would have to take a penalty later in the season if he went over his allocation for the whole season? Ie: He'd only have to take a penalty when he takes his 4th MGU-K...
In 2007 I had the chance to go to a meet-and-greet with an F1 test driver. I decided not to as I didn't think he'd even amount to much...he was the BMW Sauber test driver and his name was Sebastian Vettel...

Benii6
10
Joined: Sat Feb 03, 2018 3:32 pm

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Benii6 » Wed May 30, 2018 1:44 pm

adrianjordan wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 11:00 am
Weren't they all expecting a new PU in Montreal anyway? I thought Renault were bringing their upgraded units to that race??

Also I get confused. Couldn't he swap it anyway, but would have to take a penalty later in the season if he went over his allocation for the whole season? Ie: He'd only have to take a penalty when he takes his 4th MGU-K...
I think there is a limit of 2 MGU-Ks per year.

johnny vee
3
User avatar
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 9:03 am

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by johnny vee » Wed May 30, 2018 3:09 pm

Only the ES and CE have a limit of 2 for the year without penalty.
MGU-K is 3 for the year...
"Because you didn't come here to make the choice, you've already made it. You're here to try to understand why you made it. I thought you'd have figured that out by now." The Oracle, Matrix Reloaded

Wouter
175
Joined: Sat Dec 16, 2017 12:02 pm

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Wouter » Wed May 30, 2018 3:41 pm

johnny vee wrote:
Wed May 30, 2018 3:09 pm
Only the ES and CE have a limit of 2 for the year without penalty.
MGU-K is 3 for the year...

From the Formula1 site:
Each driver is permitted to use only three ICE, MGU-H and TC, and only two ES, CE and MGU-K during a championship season and any combination of them may be fitted to a car at any one time. Should a driver use more than that during the course of a season, a grid penalty will be imposed.

johnny vee
3
User avatar
Joined: Thu Apr 05, 2018 9:03 am

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by johnny vee » Thu May 31, 2018 6:29 am

Thank you Wouter, I stand corrected.
"Because you didn't come here to make the choice, you've already made it. You're here to try to understand why you made it. I thought you'd have figured that out by now." The Oracle, Matrix Reloaded

loner
39
User avatar
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:34 pm

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by loner » Thu May 31, 2018 3:31 pm

loner wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:45 pm
congratulations MASSIVE jump coming...
according to Abiteboul Renault will give you half a second from the PU in race trim soon which will make RBR unlock performance from the chassis as well , if this to happen its very possible for RBR to get the 2018 title
i wonder if we can question the reliability of this information source though...
for Canada
Renault:
"It's a small gain in power, although we know we won't be the only one [bringing an engine upgrade].
:roll: that mean not before another 8 races for Renault to introduce a nother upgrade...
para bellum.

adrianjordan
54
User avatar
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 10:34 am
Location: West Yorkshire, England

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by adrianjordan » Thu May 31, 2018 4:45 pm

loner wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 3:31 pm
loner wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:45 pm
congratulations MASSIVE jump coming...
according to Abiteboul Renault will give you half a second from the PU in race trim soon which will make RBR unlock performance from the chassis as well , if this to happen its very possible for RBR to get the 2018 title
i wonder if we can question the reliability of this information source though...
for Canada
Renault:
"It's a small gain in power, although we know we won't be the only one [bringing an engine upgrade].
:roll: that mean not before another 8 races for Renault to introduce a nother upgrade...
Well that's the problem with only having 3 PU per season.
In 2007 I had the chance to go to a meet-and-greet with an F1 test driver. I decided not to as I didn't think he'd even amount to much...he was the BMW Sauber test driver and his name was Sebastian Vettel...

loner
39
User avatar
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:34 pm

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by loner » Thu May 31, 2018 10:35 pm

adrianjordan wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 4:45 pm
loner wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 3:31 pm
loner wrote:
Fri Apr 20, 2018 8:45 pm
congratulations MASSIVE jump coming...
according to Abiteboul Renault will give you half a second from the PU in race trim soon which will make RBR unlock performance from the chassis as well , if this to happen its very possible for RBR to get the 2018 title
i wonder if we can question the reliability of this information source though...
for Canada
Renault:
"It's a small gain in power, although we know we won't be the only one [bringing an engine upgrade].
:roll: that mean not before another 8 races for Renault to introduce a nother upgrade...
Well that's the problem with only having 3 PU per season.
why not Renault approach in R&D ?!!
para bellum.

adrianjordan
54
User avatar
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 10:34 am
Location: West Yorkshire, England

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by adrianjordan » Thu May 31, 2018 11:25 pm

Doesn't matter what their R&D is like. You can only introduce so many updates in a season with limited PU usage. RBR are potentially in the run for WDC at present, so they're not going to start taking additional penalties for PU changes when they don't have to.
In 2007 I had the chance to go to a meet-and-greet with an F1 test driver. I decided not to as I didn't think he'd even amount to much...he was the BMW Sauber test driver and his name was Sebastian Vettel...

loner
39
User avatar
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:34 pm

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by loner » Fri Jun 01, 2018 1:48 pm

adrianjordan wrote:
Thu May 31, 2018 11:25 pm
Doesn't matter what their R&D is like. You can only introduce so many updates in a season with limited PU usage. RBR are potentially in the run for WDC at present, so they're not going to start taking additional penalties for PU changes when they don't have to.
it does .. if the Canada upgrade was more powerful it would help 3 teams to perform better , you won't be worry about
when to update if you have strong PU already...
para bellum.

adrianjordan
54
User avatar
Joined: Sun Feb 28, 2010 10:34 am
Location: West Yorkshire, England

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by adrianjordan » Sat Jun 02, 2018 1:40 am

Sorry, I don't follow your logic.

If you're in the fight for the championship you are not going to be taking new PU's above your standard allocation with the associated penalties. Therefore the PU supplier will only introduce updates to coincide with when those new units are expected.
In 2007 I had the chance to go to a meet-and-greet with an F1 test driver. I decided not to as I didn't think he'd even amount to much...he was the BMW Sauber test driver and his name was Sebastian Vettel...

loner
39
User avatar
Joined: Fri Feb 26, 2016 5:34 pm

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by loner » Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:01 pm

RBR not winning on merit lets not kid ourselves they are not in the fight for the title .. because Renault don't provide them with top PU due to lack of R&D, same 3 PU per year rule for Mercedes and Ferrari.
Renault say the upcoming upgrade is small this is not 3 PU per year fault.
para bellum.

ME4ME
162
User avatar
Joined: Fri Dec 19, 2014 3:37 pm

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by ME4ME » Sat Jun 02, 2018 4:55 pm

I think the races they have won were very much on merit. Monaco because of the excellent car and China because of great team work with strategy and double-stacking the cars twice in the pit. Red Bull has certainly waisted points though, so if they're a realistic title contender has yet to be seen. It's a long shot for sure, and depends to a great extent on Renaults relative PU performance after the introduction of the upgrade package.

godlameroso
344
User avatar
Joined: Sat Jan 16, 2010 8:27 pm
Location: Miami FL

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by godlameroso » Sat Jun 02, 2018 6:31 pm

On normal tracks Ferrari and Mercedes are still slightly ahead, on aero heavy tracks that require good tire wear because of low traction Red Bull is more than a match. I think however that both Mercedes and Ferrari have more efficient engines than the Renault. The Red Bull has to save fuel more often than Ferrari or Mercedes. They tend to be the faster car towards the end of the race but by then it's too late the other two have better early and mid race pace.
The height of cultivation is really nothing special. It is merely simplicity; the ability to express the utmost with the minimum. Mr.Lee

Phil
397
User avatar
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2012 3:22 pm

Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Phil » Sat Jun 02, 2018 6:50 pm

I'm especially curious to see how the intra-team-dynamics continue at RedBull. No doubt, Verstappen is the guy to beat on pure pace, but at the moment he is driving with huge risk for reward, while his team-mate seems to just nail that good balance of getting the most out of himself with little error. Right now, Daniel has more than double the points of Max.

After 6 races:

1: Lewis Hamilton 110
2. Sebastian Vettel 96 (-14)
3. Daniel Ricciardo 72 (-38)
4. Valtteri Bottas 68 (-42)
5. Kimi Raikkonen 60 (-50)
6. Max Verstappen 35 (-75)
...

Considering how consistent both Hamilton and Vettel are running, even if Max were to win the next 3 races could not take the lead in the championship, not even by a long shot, unless you assume both Lewis and Seb failing to score points in all of the next 3 races. That's already a huge gap...

RedBull have gone all out in giving Max a huge long-term contract, while Daniel, the guy who is 3rd in the championship and 37 points ahead of his team-mate, does not. Surely, they will not do team-orders, but you do have to wonder....
Not for nothing, Rosberg's Championship is the only thing that lends credibility to Hamilton's recent success. Otherwise, he'd just be the guy who's had the best car. — bhall II
#Team44 supporter