2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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yener
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Godlameroso

If Hamilton would keep pushing he could easily have a 25+ gap at the end. And keep in mind that he didnt use his "new" engine. That engine is good for another 0.2 seconds a lap.

It was a good fight and i really dont mind RBR finishing second this year, it just doesnt feel right after Silverstone. It would be another story if he didnt crash Max out in England.

The pressure is really high and lets see what will happen at SA. If merc have to change their rear wing, then still RBR is to slow. The rear wing trick gives them maybe in good circumstances and high speed tracks 0.2 maybe 0.3 seconds.

Another thing is Lewis his steering wheel which was moving like the DAS in Brazil, when he was asked he told "the steering wheel was loose" yeah right
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godlameroso
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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People thought Max had it sealed, and now people thing Hamilton has it sealed. I just don't know man, I just don't know. I may sound like a broken record, but having had some time around the next track, I can't say it will be as easy for Mercedes. For one, you can't run max downforce around there, second we know the Red Bull is good around esses and high speed corners, which is all the next track is.

It will be closer next race, the track characteristics are a mixture of Mexico and COTA, or a flat Spa or a faster Montreal. There are two traction sensitive corners around Jeddah, the banked "hairpin" and the final corner. The rest you have to be very brave and come close to the wall. 2 stopper for sure.
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NathanOlder
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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godlameroso wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:16 am
People thought Max had it sealed, and now people thing Hamilton has it sealed. I just don't know man, I just don't know. I may sound like a broken record, but having had some time around the next track, I can't say it will be as easy for Mercedes. For one, you can't run max downforce around there, second we know the Red Bull is good around esses and high speed corners, which is all the next track is.

It will be closer next race, the track characteristics are a mixture of Mexico and COTA, or a flat Spa or a faster Montreal. There are two traction sensitive corners around Jeddah, the banked "hairpin" and the final corner. The rest you have to be very brave and come close to the wall. 2 stopper for sure.
You were saying RedBull would be on top in Qatar with all the high speed corners there, Mercedes show up with an older power unit than expected and still bossed it. For a car that was supposedly meant to be better, the RedBull only hit 3 purple mini sectors out of 23 on the lap in Qatar. And was quarter of a second off the pace in the middle sector that has no straights.
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Just_a_fan
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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godlameroso wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:16 am


It will be closer next race, the track characteristics are a mixture of Mexico and COTA, or a flat Spa or a faster Montreal. There are two traction sensitive corners around Jeddah, the banked "hairpin" and the final corner. The rest you have to be very brave and come close to the wall. 2 stopper for sure.
COTA is a bit of an outlier recently - the bumps meant the black cars ran with higher than normal ride height which lost a chunk of performance. If Jeddha is smooth the difference between Red Bull and Mercedes will be different to COTA.
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etusch
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Just_a_fan wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 9:02 am
godlameroso wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:16 am


It will be closer next race, the track characteristics are a mixture of Mexico and COTA, or a flat Spa or a faster Montreal. There are two traction sensitive corners around Jeddah, the banked "hairpin" and the final corner. The rest you have to be very brave and come close to the wall. 2 stopper for sure.
COTA is a bit of an outlier recently - the bumps meant the black cars ran with higher than normal ride height which lost a chunk of performance. If Jeddha is smooth the difference between Red Bull and Mercedes will be different to COTA.
didn't Redbull also lost performance because of that bumps? Why talking as if it affected only mercs badly? There are more variable and track may match Redbull more on the contrary of general expectation or may be we will see what expected.
My point is; people still thinks under 7 championships affect and this season have not able to change this by now. Normally it should be changed from beginning of season. These are last 2 races and you will win or lost everything.

Just_a_fan
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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etusch wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 10:49 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 9:02 am
godlameroso wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:16 am


It will be closer next race, the track characteristics are a mixture of Mexico and COTA, or a flat Spa or a faster Montreal. There are two traction sensitive corners around Jeddah, the banked "hairpin" and the final corner. The rest you have to be very brave and come close to the wall. 2 stopper for sure.
COTA is a bit of an outlier recently - the bumps meant the black cars ran with higher than normal ride height which lost a chunk of performance. If Jeddha is smooth the difference between Red Bull and Mercedes will be different to COTA.
didn't Redbull also lost performance because of that bumps? Why talking as if it affected only mercs badly? There are more variable and track may match Redbull more on the contrary of general expectation or may be we will see what expected.
My point is; people still thinks under 7 championships affect and this season have not able to change this by now. Normally it should be changed from beginning of season. These are last 2 races and you will win or lost everything. Merc open their dirty hands much earlier, now Redbull will play with all what they have. we will see what will happen
The Red Bull handled the bumps better, yes, but their car is also designed to run the rear higher anyway so they weren't affected quite as much as Mercedes by the changes required it seems. Their car worked better at the track, no doubt about it. But COTA and Jeddha are likely to be different if the new circuit is smooth precisely because it is smooth.
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basti313
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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etusch wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 10:49 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 9:02 am
godlameroso wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:16 am


It will be closer next race, the track characteristics are a mixture of Mexico and COTA, or a flat Spa or a faster Montreal. There are two traction sensitive corners around Jeddah, the banked "hairpin" and the final corner. The rest you have to be very brave and come close to the wall. 2 stopper for sure.
COTA is a bit of an outlier recently - the bumps meant the black cars ran with higher than normal ride height which lost a chunk of performance. If Jeddha is smooth the difference between Red Bull and Mercedes will be different to COTA.
didn't Redbull also lost performance because of that bumps? Why talking as if it affected only mercs badly? There are more variable and track may match Redbull more on the contrary of general expectation or may be we will see what expected.
My point is; people still thinks under 7 championships affect and this season have not able to change this by now. Normally it should be changed from beginning of season. These are last 2 races and you will win or lost everything. Merc open their dirty hands much earlier, now Redbull will play with all what they have. we will see what will happen
It is nonsense to discuss ride height as an issue. The ride height is one of the primary parameters when adjusting the car and Merc simply got one of these parameters wrong. Just like RedBull was on a wrong path in Turkey.

The big question is how well they arrive to the track. In Nl RedBull had a perfect setup as they run the track on demos. I also suspect that Merc had some more knowledge on the grip change in Turkey maybe from their customer GT3 cars or some HWA test runs.
The interesting factor is, that really no one has any data of Jeddah. Big question will be who nails the setup. Unfortunately it seems the Bull is not that easy to adjust.

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SiLo
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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etusch wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 10:49 am
Just_a_fan wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 9:02 am
godlameroso wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:16 am


It will be closer next race, the track characteristics are a mixture of Mexico and COTA, or a flat Spa or a faster Montreal. There are two traction sensitive corners around Jeddah, the banked "hairpin" and the final corner. The rest you have to be very brave and come close to the wall. 2 stopper for sure.
COTA is a bit of an outlier recently - the bumps meant the black cars ran with higher than normal ride height which lost a chunk of performance. If Jeddha is smooth the difference between Red Bull and Mercedes will be different to COTA.
didn't Redbull also lost performance because of that bumps? Why talking as if it affected only mercs badly? There are more variable and track may match Redbull more on the contrary of general expectation or may be we will see what expected.
My point is; people still thinks under 7 championships affect and this season have not able to change this by now. Normally it should be changed from beginning of season. These are last 2 races and you will win or lost everything.
I believe Red Bull requested permission to strengthen parts of the car, and Mercedes simply raised the ride height to compensate instead. So strategically Red Bull went the better route but likely a higher risk play. Clearly worked out for them though.
Felipe Baby!

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SiLo
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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godlameroso wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:16 am
People thought Max had it sealed, and now people thing Hamilton has it sealed. I just don't know man, I just don't know. I may sound like a broken record, but having had some time around the next track, I can't say it will be as easy for Mercedes. For one, you can't run max downforce around there, second we know the Red Bull is good around esses and high speed corners, which is all the next track is.

It will be closer next race, the track characteristics are a mixture of Mexico and COTA, or a flat Spa or a faster Montreal. There are two traction sensitive corners around Jeddah, the banked "hairpin" and the final corner. The rest you have to be very brave and come close to the wall. 2 stopper for sure.
I think Losail kind of disproves this "RB high speed king" rhetoric, Mercedes looked very good there everywhere on track, especially the corners. I know there are corners but this feels much more like Silverstone levels for a downforce package, and they were very fast there too.

I'm hoping Perez can have a good race as well, I really want to see both Mercs and both RBs right at the front fighting. I assume the DRS issue won't be a problem as they will probably run the spoon wing?
Felipe Baby!

Alexf1
Alexf1
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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I expect the low downforce Baku/Spa/Monza rw if asphalt grip levels allow it.

https://www.motorsportweek.com/2021/08/ ... elopments/

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SiLo
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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Alexf1 wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 12:58 pm
I expect the low downforce Baku/Spa/Monza rw if asphalt grip levels allow it.

https://www.motorsportweek.com/2021/08/ ... elopments/
That's what I would expect as well. Maybe not Monza levels, but at least Baku/Silverstone.
Felipe Baby!

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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godlameroso wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 1:16 am
People thought Max had it sealed, and now people thing Hamilton has it sealed. I just don't know man, I just don't know. I may sound like a broken record, but having had some time around the next track, I can't say it will be as easy for Mercedes. For one, you can't run max downforce around there, second we know the Red Bull is good around esses and high speed corners, which is all the next track is.

It will be closer next race, the track characteristics are a mixture of Mexico and COTA, or a flat Spa or a faster Montreal. There are two traction sensitive corners around Jeddah, the banked "hairpin" and the final corner. The rest you have to be very brave and come close to the wall. 2 stopper for sure.
Your game's track model needs some updating though. The big turns are banked now, and the other zig-zags are less tight in real life. This would affect the layout tremendously. By my eyes I would say Spa leaning to a Monza set-up.
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ringo
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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With esses. I dont think the downforce will be too low. Maybe medium. The track seems to need a good rear end to limit sliding in the esses and to promote good tyre deg
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SiLo
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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ringo wrote:
Wed Nov 24, 2021 3:04 pm
With esses. I dont think the downforce will be too low. Maybe medium. The track seems to need a good rear end to limit sliding in the esses and to promote good tyre deg
Also need a good front end as well. Really it's about balance. Too much at the front and you'll just spin around, too much at the rear and youll just understeer into a wall.
Felipe Baby!

Tvetovnato
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Re: 2021 Red Bull Racing F1 Team

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The question is how fast the esses will be still. The simulations I’ve seen so far either make them look like they will mostly be taken flat out, or with just a slight lift. But when we get there they might be a bit sharper. Hard to tell.