Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Big Tea
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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djos wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 12:51 am
Agreed, I can usually get another 20kms out of a tank when the computer shows 0km’s of range.
But you can bring fuel in a can then. When a 'letric cars stops, its really stopped.
Its a tow to a charger or expensive specialist help.
I suppose if you are really cheeky you could ask someone if you can plug in to their house for a while :mrgreen:
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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Andres125sx
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Big Tea wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 2:47 pm
djos wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 12:51 am
Agreed, I can usually get another 20kms out of a tank when the computer shows 0km’s of range.
But you can bring fuel in a can then. When a 'letric cars stops, its really stopped.
Its a tow to a charger or expensive specialist help.
I suppose if you are really cheeky you could ask someone if you can plug in to their house for a while :mrgreen:
True, but a tow to a charger is far from a problem, at least if you pay road assistance wich is standard on almost any car issurance, isn´t it?

Anycase this is the same as with first smartphones... A mobile whose battery can´t last two days? No way, my nokia battery only need to be charged once a week, I´m never going to use a smartphone... :P

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Big Tea
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Andres125sx wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 11:40 am
Big Tea wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 2:47 pm
djos wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 12:51 am
Agreed, I can usually get another 20kms out of a tank when the computer shows 0km’s of range.
But you can bring fuel in a can then. When a 'letric cars stops, its really stopped.
Its a tow to a charger or expensive specialist help.
I suppose if you are really cheeky you could ask someone if you can plug in to their house for a while :mrgreen:
True, but a tow to a charger is far from a problem, at least if you pay road assistance wich is standard on almost any car issurance, isn´t it?

Anycase this is the same as with first smartphones... A mobile whose battery can´t last two days? No way, my nokia battery only need to be charged once a week, I´m never going to use a smartphone... :P
There is also the time spent at the charger, providing it is free when you arrive. I mean it is not the same mental calculation as running low on petrol and knowing it will be an inconvenience if you run out. There is probably a similar calculation of 'how much of the trip is down hill' too
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

Jolle
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 2:17 pm
Andres125sx wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 11:40 am
Big Tea wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 2:47 pm


But you can bring fuel in a can then. When a 'letric cars stops, its really stopped.
Its a tow to a charger or expensive specialist help.
I suppose if you are really cheeky you could ask someone if you can plug in to their house for a while :mrgreen:
True, but a tow to a charger is far from a problem, at least if you pay road assistance wich is standard on almost any car issurance, isn´t it?

Anycase this is the same as with first smartphones... A mobile whose battery can´t last two days? No way, my nokia battery only need to be charged once a week, I´m never going to use a smartphone... :P
There is also the time spent at the charger, providing it is free when you arrive. I mean it is not the same mental calculation as running low on petrol and knowing it will be an inconvenience if you run out. There is probably a similar calculation of 'how much of the trip is down hill' too
In my almost 30 years of driving cars I only once ran out of diesel, and that was just being a fool. In fact, it was an old style diesel where you just couldn’t top it off and start again but had to prime and bleed the whole system.

Who knows, if this would be a problem with E cars, maybe there would be a market for small emergency battery packs to help you to the next charger. But.. haven’t seen anything like that so I guess not so much still.

Just_a_fan
Just_a_fan
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Big Tea wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 2:47 pm
djos wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 12:51 am
Agreed, I can usually get another 20kms out of a tank when the computer shows 0km’s of range.
But you can bring fuel in a can then. When a 'letric cars stops, its really stopped.
Its a tow to a charger or expensive specialist help.
I suppose if you are really cheeky you could ask someone if you can plug in to their house for a while :mrgreen:
Buddy charging is also available with some cars - you can run a cable between them and top one up from the other. Of course that requires someone to be helpful which is probably less likely these days.
Turbo says "Dumpster sounds so much more classy. It's the diamond of the cesspools." oh, and "The Dutch fans are drunk. Maybe"

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Big Tea
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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I wonder on the drawbacks of a very small donkey motor driving a ( or the existing) generator that could add a small mileage or more over a reasonable time. Considering how light some portable generators are it would surely not be that big a penalty?

I just looked up a small Hyundai unit and it had a weight of 22lbs.
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

Jolle
Jolle
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:17 pm
I wonder on the drawbacks of a very small donkey motor driving a ( or the existing) generator that could add a small mileage or more over a reasonable time. Considering how light some portable generators are it would surely not be that big a penalty?

I just looked up a small Hyundai unit and it had a weight of 22lbs.
A simple battery pack of a few KG is probably also enough. The electric equivalent of a 5l petrol can.

Tommy Cookers
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Jolle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:19 pm
A simple battery pack of a few KG is probably also enough. The electric equivalent of a 5l petrol can.
would that be a simple 600 Volt battery pack - or a simple 800 Volt battery pack ?
simply connected to the charging socket of the main battery pack ?

my original point was a wondering about the actual battery energy state when the system decides to shut down
(because the shutdown is driven by the battery life warranty not the battery energy state)

and .... towing isn't simple

Jolle
Jolle
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Tommy Cookers wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:46 pm
Jolle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:19 pm
A simple battery pack of a few KG is probably also enough. The electric equivalent of a 5l petrol can.
would that be a simple 600 Volt battery pack - or a simple 800 Volt battery pack ?
simply connected to the charging socket of the main battery pack ?

my original point was a wondering about the actual battery energy state when the system decides to shut down
(because the shutdown is driven by the battery life warranty not the battery energy state)

and .... towing isn't simple
A simple battery with a transformer. You hook it up, provides 230 volts to charge the car for a few miles.
These batteries are already available and I’ve used them quite often as a silent alternative instead of a generator.

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Big Tea
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Jolle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:58 pm
Tommy Cookers wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:46 pm
Jolle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:19 pm
A simple battery pack of a few KG is probably also enough. The electric equivalent of a 5l petrol can.
would that be a simple 600 Volt battery pack - or a simple 800 Volt battery pack ?
simply connected to the charging socket of the main battery pack ?

my original point was a wondering about the actual battery energy state when the system decides to shut down
(because the shutdown is driven by the battery life warranty not the battery energy state)

and .... towing isn't simple
A simple battery with a transformer. You hook it up, provides 230 volts to charge the car for a few miles.
These batteries are already available and I’ve used them quite often as a silent alternative instead of a generator.
I assume it would have to 'live' in the car to be worth while, so what would be the trade off a small genny (other than noise) which would be as flexible as required as long as fuel was available?
As a factory built-in unit the weight would be lower and could possibly be as convenient as a dash switch. I am not thinking something to rival a hybrid here, just something to help 'range anxiety' and not leave the fear of 'getting stuck somewhere remote'. Literally a last gasp aid
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

Jolle
Jolle
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 5:08 pm
Jolle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:58 pm
Tommy Cookers wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:46 pm

would that be a simple 600 Volt battery pack - or a simple 800 Volt battery pack ?
simply connected to the charging socket of the main battery pack ?

my original point was a wondering about the actual battery energy state when the system decides to shut down
(because the shutdown is driven by the battery life warranty not the battery energy state)

and .... towing isn't simple
A simple battery with a transformer. You hook it up, provides 230 volts to charge the car for a few miles.
These batteries are already available and I’ve used them quite often as a silent alternative instead of a generator.
I assume it would have to 'live' in the car to be worth while, so what would be the trade off a small genny (other than noise) which would be as flexible as required as long as fuel was available?
As a factory built-in unit the weight would be lower and could possibly be as convenient as a dash switch. I am not thinking something to rival a hybrid here, just something to help 'range anxiety' and not leave the fear of 'getting stuck somewhere remote'. Literally a last gasp aid
I was more thinking as a service from charge stations, where you could pick up one, just like you do with petrol when you run out. Or, does everyone have 5 litres of petrol as a small bomb in the back of their car?

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Big Tea
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Jolle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 5:14 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 5:08 pm
Jolle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 3:58 pm


A simple battery with a transformer. You hook it up, provides 230 volts to charge the car for a few miles.
These batteries are already available and I’ve used them quite often as a silent alternative instead of a generator.
I assume it would have to 'live' in the car to be worth while, so what would be the trade off a small genny (other than noise) which would be as flexible as required as long as fuel was available?
As a factory built-in unit the weight would be lower and could possibly be as convenient as a dash switch. I am not thinking something to rival a hybrid here, just something to help 'range anxiety' and not leave the fear of 'getting stuck somewhere remote'. Literally a last gasp aid
I was more thinking as a service from charge stations, where you could pick up one, just like you do with petrol when you run out. Or, does everyone have 5 litres of petrol as a small bomb in the back of their car?
There could even be an opening for a 'call for a boost' service van
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

Jolle
Jolle
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Joined: Wed Jan 29, 2014 9:58 pm
Location: Dordrecht

Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 5:18 pm
Jolle wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 5:14 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 5:08 pm


I assume it would have to 'live' in the car to be worth while, so what would be the trade off a small genny (other than noise) which would be as flexible as required as long as fuel was available?
As a factory built-in unit the weight would be lower and could possibly be as convenient as a dash switch. I am not thinking something to rival a hybrid here, just something to help 'range anxiety' and not leave the fear of 'getting stuck somewhere remote'. Literally a last gasp aid
I was more thinking as a service from charge stations, where you could pick up one, just like you do with petrol when you run out. Or, does everyone have 5 litres of petrol as a small bomb in the back of their car?
There could even be an opening for a 'call for a boost' service van
Basically, in essence, it’s not so different from petrol cars.

Billzilla
Billzilla
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Big Tea wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 2:47 pm
But you can bring fuel in a can then. When a 'letric cars stops, its really stopped.
Its a tow to a charger or expensive specialist help.
FWIW here in Australia a lot of the car club service vehicles have a small generator now, for just such occasions.
And with a Tesla (at least) for every, say, 10 km you tow the car you get about 15 km more range thanks to the regen function. So not a lot of towing is needed.

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Big Tea
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Re: Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

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Billzilla wrote:
Mon Dec 06, 2021 9:17 pm
Big Tea wrote:
Sun Dec 05, 2021 2:47 pm
But you can bring fuel in a can then. When a 'letric cars stops, its really stopped.
Its a tow to a charger or expensive specialist help.
FWIW here in Australia a lot of the car club service vehicles have a small generator now, for just such occasions.
And with a Tesla (at least) for every, say, 10 km you tow the car you get about 15 km more range thanks to the regen function. So not a lot of towing is needed.
Can you (in practical terms) recharge by towing?
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.