Will Electric Vehicles Be Viable? When?

[Zynerji]

https://techxplore.com/news/2022-01-sci ... tance.html

[Greg Locock]

Is that the tech that Toyota are chasing?

[gruntguru]

Apologies. Posted something here - intended for another thread - another forum - moving it now.

[Greg Locock]

Nice post wrong thread i think!

[gruntguru]

True dat. Thanks Greg. I will try to fix it.

[Mishal21]

From the perspective from the perspective of power grid electric vehicles from the perspective of power grids, electric cars are amazing. They provide an amazing quantity of load-balancing.

The biggest issue with the grid's power supply is demand fluctuates greatly throughout the day. the basic load plants cannot keep up with the demand. It is necessary to do ridiculous things like running more expensive peaking plants, or convince certain kinds of heavy industry that they only work during the evening.

The electric fleet that is a part of vehicles is a massive quantity of batteries that aren't very concerned about charging time. A lot of people charge their vehicles at night and, as long as the batteries are fully charged at the time of morning, everyone is satisfied. This helps fill the gap in demand in the late in the night, which allows lower-cost power sources to supply an increased amount of energy.

[Big Tea]

A short 'fuel and electricity from sunlight' vid here.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ty63Gb1nC1A

Nothing new really, just put in a good way. you will not miss anything much if you skip to 2.30 ish

A solar concentrator about 5.5% efficient

[Greg Locock]

Mishal21 - on the other hand the UK are making it compulsory for chargers to be controlled by the grid, so you can't guarantee that when you get home you'll be able to charge your car.

[Tommy Cookers]

.... This helps fill the gap in demand in the late in the night, which allows lower-cost power sources to supply an increased amount of energy.

the true 'cost' of power being (on this site anyway) the carbon cost
the carbon cost may be higher at night due to the relative lack of 'zero-carbon' power then

[Greg Locock]

It's only solar that chops out at night. Wind may or may not be there, as usual.

https://149366104.v2.pressablecdn.com/w ... 20x480.png



This graph is rather useful. A state the size of Spain, or much bigger than the UK, sees wind drop to 25% for a whole day. That means you need almost a day of batteries or hydro. It does of course explain why the EU has redefined natural gas and nuclear as green fuels (the latter makes sense).

[Stu]

It's only solar that chops out at night. Wind may or may not be there, as usual.

https://149366104.v2.pressablecdn.com/w ... 20x480.png

https://149366104.v2.pressablecdn.com/w ... 20x480.png

This graph is rather useful. A state the size of Spain, or much bigger than the UK, sees wind drop to 25% for a whole day. That means you need almost a day of batteries or hydro. It does of course explain why the EU has redefined natural gas and nuclear as green fuels (the latter makes sense).

It would be interesting to see how a Solar + wind line would look/compare on that graph (I can visualise it, but it being ‘on-the-page’ would be good). It would also be useful if it was done on a cost/kW.

[Stu]

Mishal21 - on the other hand the UK are making it compulsory for chargers to be controlled by the grid, so you can't guarantee that when you get home you'll be able to charge your car.

There is a very good reason for that, but it is political so we cannot talk about it.

[Jolle]

Mishal21 - on the other hand the UK are making it compulsory for chargers to be controlled by the grid, so you can't guarantee that when you get home you'll be able to charge your car.

There is a very good reason for that, but it is political so we cannot talk about it.

Aside from political, it’s also impossible not to implement something like that.

Let’s say, in 2050 all the commuters have their electric company car, they all get home at around six-ish and plug in their cars. The overcapacity needed for that first hour would be so big, that you’ll need extra powerplants just to cope with that short recharge every day.

When I was at uni, the power would go down every morning around half past eight.. turned out, all the teachers were turning on their Senseo machines to make themselves a cup of coffee…

[Stu]

Mishal21 - on the other hand the UK are making it compulsory for chargers to be controlled by the grid, so you can't guarantee that when you get home you'll be able to charge your car.

There is a very good reason for that, but it is political so we cannot talk about it.

Aside from political, it’s also impossible not to implement something like that.

Let’s say, in 2050 all the commuters have their electric company car, they all get home at around six-ish and plug in their cars. The overcapacity needed for that first hour would be so big, that you’ll need extra powerplants just to cope with that short recharge every day.

When I was at uni, the power would go down every morning around half past eight.. turned out, all the teachers were turning on their Senseo machines to make themselves a cup of coffee…

As far as the UK requirement goes it becomes political because domestic solar generation cannot be used, by law. Only a matter of time before Excise Duty (at above domestic rate) is applied to EV charging at home. Sneaky.
But that is political…..

[Big Tea]

There is a very good reason for that, but it is political so we cannot talk about it.

Aside from political, it’s also impossible not to implement something like that.

Let’s say, in 2050 all the commuters have their electric company car, they all get home at around six-ish and plug in their cars. The overcapacity needed for that first hour would be so big, that you’ll need extra powerplants just to cope with that short recharge every day.

When I was at uni, the power would go down every morning around half past eight.. turned out, all the teachers were turning on their Senseo machines to make themselves a cup of coffee…

As far as the UK requirement goes it becomes political because domestic solar generation cannot be used, by law. Only a matter of time before Excise Duty (at above domestic rate) is applied to EV charging at home. Sneaky.
But that is political…..

I suspect that it may eventually also 'work the other way' in that if your car is plugged in and there is a lack of capacity in your area a few amps may be borrowed off your car as it is not being used.