2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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Big Tea
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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Stu wrote:
Mon Jul 25, 2022 1:34 pm
I’m amazed that they haven’t said that the plank thickness will increase by 10mm for next year….
Would cure the flexing too :mrgreen:
When arguing with a fool, be sure the other person is not doing the same thing.

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jjn9128
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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Stu wrote:
Mon Jul 25, 2022 1:34 pm
I’m amazed that they haven’t said that the plank thickness will increase by 10mm for next year….
You been reading my posts??
#aerogandalf
"There is one big friend. It is downforce. And once you have this it’s a big mate and it’s helping a lot." Robert Kubica

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Stu
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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jjn9128 wrote:
Mon Jul 25, 2022 8:34 pm
Stu wrote:
Mon Jul 25, 2022 1:34 pm
I’m amazed that they haven’t said that the plank thickness will increase by 10mm for next year….
You been reading my posts??
Not seen it posted before, but apologies if you have already posted this.
Perspective - Understanding that sometimes the truths we cling to depend greatly on our own point of view.

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jjn9128
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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Stu wrote:
Mon Jul 25, 2022 9:21 pm
jjn9128 wrote:
Mon Jul 25, 2022 8:34 pm
Stu wrote:
Mon Jul 25, 2022 1:34 pm
I’m amazed that they haven’t said that the plank thickness will increase by 10mm for next year….
You been reading my posts??
Not seen it posted before, but apologies if you have already posted this.
:P
#aerogandalf
"There is one big friend. It is downforce. And once you have this it’s a big mate and it’s helping a lot." Robert Kubica

michl420
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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For me some floors guide the air more straight through (red Bull) and some with more outwash (Mercedes, McLaren). This new rule (25mm) can change the whole aero concept vor some team?!

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JordanMugen
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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michl420 wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 4:06 pm
This new rule (25mm) can change the whole aero concept vor some team?!
It seems so. Horner seems to think it is a major regulation overhaul on 2023 cars that are already being designed, and seems to be against the changes.

dialtone
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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JordanMugen wrote:
michl420 wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 4:06 pm
This new rule (25mm) can change the whole aero concept vor some team?!
It seems so. Horner seems to think it is a major regulation overhaul on 2023 cars that are already being designed, and seems to be against the changes.
That is a totally reasonable position, especially given that starting next race they have a new sensor in the cars.

mzso
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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JordanMugen wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 5:01 am
michl420 wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 4:06 pm
This new rule (25mm) can change the whole aero concept vor some team?!
It seems so. Horner seems to think it is a major regulation overhaul on 2023 cars that are already being designed, and seems to be against the changes.
At this point I put zero trust in what Horners says. RB thinks (but doesn't actually know) they might loose performance relative to others. That is what his comment suggests.
I have my doubts whether it would take the teams much effort to modify the floor to the new sidewall height.
dialtone wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 5:44 am
That is a totally reasonable position, especially given that starting next race they have a new sensor in the cars.
The sensor is bound to be controversial. You see once car bouncing but they're in the limit, you don't see the other bouncing but they aren't in the limit, and such. The raised sidewall seems like a complete solution.

The FIA probably should have made the new rule earlier though.

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jjn9128
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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Horner's job, like Wolff, is to advocate for his team. Interestingly Wolff's comments on the '23 changes were that they didn't know the '21 edge cutout would be worse for Mercedes... a different story to the one he was selling last year.
#aerogandalf
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n_anirudh
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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Will it affect the *poorer* teams who could have carried parts etc over the next season ?

Secondly, how do the teams know that raising the floor will help? Has there been research carried out and data shared by fia/fom?

Thinking out aloud here: Why is a 10mm change acceptable and not 25mm? Whatever the increase, new aero tests will have to be conducted unless they have accurate 0D models that can predict such changes ?
Last edited by n_anirudh on Sun Jul 31, 2022 12:41 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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JordanMugen
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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n_anirudh wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:36 pm
Thinking out aloud her: Why is a 10mm change acceptable and not 25mm?
Because it's a smaller change, less than 50%. :)

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djos
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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mzso wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 8:59 pm
JordanMugen wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 5:01 am
michl420 wrote:
Fri Jul 29, 2022 4:06 pm
This new rule (25mm) can change the whole aero concept vor some team?!
It seems so. Horner seems to think it is a major regulation overhaul on 2023 cars that are already being designed, and seems to be against the changes.
At this point I put zero trust in what Horners says. RB thinks (but doesn't actually know) they might loose performance relative to others. That is what his comment suggests.
I have my doubts whether it would take the teams much effort to modify the floor to the new sidewall height.
dialtone wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 5:44 am
That is a totally reasonable position, especially given that starting next race they have a new sensor in the cars.
The sensor is bound to be controversial. You see once car bouncing but they're in the limit, you don't see the other bouncing but they aren't in the limit, and such. The raised sidewall seems like a complete solution.

The FIA probably should have made the new rule earlier though.
I don’t trust what Horner says either, however in this case I agree with him. Mercedes need to change their side pod concept to one that provides a properly supported floor.

The FIA should:

A/ monitor for bouncing and step in when individual teams are being irresponsible and risking their drivers health.

and

/B give the teams inerters back, instead of changing the floor regulations and potentially wrecking what has been a great formula so far.
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.

mzso
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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n_anirudh wrote:
Sat Jul 30, 2022 10:36 pm
Will it affect the *poorer* teams who could have carried parts etc over the next season ?

Secondly, how do the teams know that raising the floor will help? Has there been research carried out and data shared by fia/fom?

Thinking out aloud her: Why is a 10mm change acceptable and not 25mm? Whatever the increase, new aero tests will have to be conducted unless they have accurate 0D models that can predict such changes ?
Well, poorer teams now have the same development budget. So it's a matter of choice what you'd want carry over. However I think the cost is overblown (by Horner mainly), since the floor/sidepods seem to be the main distinguishing parts of a car, that is what they would want to redesign first. Also Haas had no trouble completely changing the whole sidepod design within half a season.

The 25mm the FIA probably just pulled out of the air. The same place 10mm comes from, by the teams who'd think it's less disadvantageous for them. I think it should 19.23mm, just to look like it was a results of some complex calculations. :)

(No idea what 0D means)
Last edited by mzso on Sun Jul 31, 2022 7:20 am, edited 1 time in total.

mzso
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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djos wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:29 am
I don’t trust what Horner says either, however in this case I agree with him. Mercedes need to change their side pod concept to one that provides a properly supported floor.
Well it already should be forced on them by stricter flex tests.
djos wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:29 am
The FIA should:

A/ monitor for bouncing and step in when individual teams are being irresponsible and risking their drivers health.
It's strange that people usually complain loudly for physical barriers instead of monitoring and penalties but now most seem to be arguing for the very same thing. I guess Horner is very effective.
djos wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:29 am
/B give the teams inerters back, instead of changing the floor regulations and potentially wrecking what has been a great formula so far.
Most comments I heard was that it would ease the symptoms but wouldn't at all solve the problem.
I think the FIA did the right thing, but did it too late. If it came out with the regulation in may the teams protecting their interests would have had to find a lamer argument.

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djos
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Re: 2022 Aerodynamic Regulations Thread

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mzso wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 7:15 am
djos wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:29 am
I don’t trust what Horner says either, however in this case I agree with him. Mercedes need to change their side pod concept to one that provides a properly supported floor.
Well it already should be forced on them by stricter flex tests.
djos wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:29 am
The FIA should:

A/ monitor for bouncing and step in when individual teams are being irresponsible and risking their drivers health.
It's strange that people usually complain loudly for physical barriers instead of monitoring and penalties but now most seem to be arguing for the very same thing. I guess Horner is very effective.
djos wrote:
Sun Jul 31, 2022 2:29 am
/B give the teams inerters back, instead of changing the floor regulations and potentially wrecking what has been a great formula so far.
Most comments I heard was that it would ease the symptoms but wouldn't at all solve the problem.
I think the FIA did the right thing, but did it too late. If it came out with the regulation in may the teams protecting their interests would have had to find a lamer argument.
The only “penalties” I’m in favour of, are forcing a team with excessive bouncing to address it - or risk being disqualified.

Inerters are a magic bullet, but they are going to help manage it, heck even Indy Car use them!
The impossible often has a kind of integrity which the merely improbable lacks.