How much is possible?

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jon-mullen
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Joined: 10 Sep 2008, 02:56
Location: Big Blue Nation

Re: How much is possible?

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I think you definitely have to draw the line at some number of G's and design your track that way, but there should still be a reward for the drivers with the balls and concentration to run every corner as fast as the car will go.

Wasn't Eau Rouge back in the 80s a corner like that, where the car would stick because of the dip but the forces on the driver were unusual and very unpleasant at speed?
Loud idiot in red since 2010
United States Grand Prix Club, because there's more to racing than NASCAR

DaveKillens
DaveKillens
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Joined: 20 Jan 2005, 04:02

Re: How much is possible?

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Texas Motor Speedway is also the site of the most infamous non-race in auto-racing history. In 2001, CART decided that if the IRL could put on a great show at TMS, then CART’s faster cars would be even better. Depending on what you hear, some put the blame on Bobby Rahal who was CART’s interim CEO in 2000, while others squarely put the blame on Joe Heitzler who succeeded Rahal as CART’s permanent CEO in Dec 2000.

Rahal tested his driver Kenny Bräck for CART at Texas on a bitter cold day during the off-season to determine the safety of the track for the faster Champ Cars. There had been some concerns by CART Chief Steward Wally Dallenbach that the tight confines and high banking may be too much for their cars. For whatever reason, Bräck supposedly only reached a top speed of 206 during the test. The track was then deemed race-worthy. Heitzler quickly decided to move ahead with race plans.

When the teams returned in April for race weekend, it was another story. There were signs of trouble almost immediately. Paul Tracy quickly turned a lap at over 236 mph – an unheard of speed on a mile and a half oval. Cristiano da Matta and Mauricio Gugelmin had separate practice crashes where their cars were running perfectly normal lines, when both cars seemingly snapped into the outside wall. Further inspection revealed no apparent causes. Then, Patrick Carpentier complained when he got out of the car that he could not even stand up due to dizziness and severe vertigo. One by one, other drivers started complaining of disorientation, nausea and vertigo. Some even mentioned having brief blackout periods. No more than fifteen laps could be run without the symptoms appearing.

The problem was a phenomenon called “G-Loc” which normally exists only with fighter pilots. It occurs with excessive vertical G-forces combined with excessive lateral G-force loading. This had never been seen before in motor racing. The IRL had never exceeded 225 mph at Texas. The Champ cars had exceeded that by eleven mph. That difference was enough to change everything. The vertical G-Forces caused by the high-banked turns were sometimes exceeding 5.0 G’s, coupled with 3.5 to 4.0 lateral G-forces in the turns. CART was faced with a dilemma – a race that after thirty laps would have drivers blacking out while doing over 230 mph. This wasn’t good.
There is a limit that any human being cannot endure.
Racing should be decided on the track, not the court room.

Scotracer
Scotracer
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Joined: 22 Apr 2008, 17:09
Location: Edinburgh, Scotland, UK

Re: How much is possible?

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The concept of a single seater on an oval never really made much sense to me. They are supposed to be light-weight nimble racers, not "motorway" cruisers.

Still, the CART cars were incredible :twisted:
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xpensive
xpensive
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Joined: 22 Nov 2008, 18:06
Location: Somewhere in Scandinavia

Re: How much is possible?

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Agreed, while it was painful to behold NA single-seater racing commit suicide, with the help of that IMS egomaniac of course. Those IRL racers are pathetic to my mind.
"I spent most of my money on wine and women...I wasted the rest"

Conceptual
Conceptual
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Joined: 15 Nov 2007, 03:33

Re: How much is possible?

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n smikle wrote:Put some Turbos on, Increase displacement to 3.5 liters... :twisted:

Wall up the sides of the car, Fans, Put on some Fenders to shield the wheels. :twisted:

(Hey Did anyone watch "Speed Racer" the movie? That is my ultimate racing series, Just train some Death row prisoners to drive so the driver death's wont matter.. Immoral? yes.. but it will be the pinnacle of motorsport and maximum entertainment! that should be another topic!! :twisted: )
Careful, I was harshly criticized when I mentioned how awesome the racing in that movie was...

DaveKillens
DaveKillens
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Joined: 20 Jan 2005, 04:02

Re: How much is possible?

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Formula One cars can exceed the limits of human physiology. For many years, the regulations have placed restrictions on aspects of car performance to reduce the danger to the driver and anyone else. Heck, twenty years ago, if allowed, designers could have constructed a vehicle that would easily exceed the limits of reflex, reaction, and everything else involving a driver. So basically, if you lift restrictions, you kill the driver.
But.. but, there's so much to imagine. Four wheel steering. Why stop there, make it eight wheels, eight wheel steering. Gas turbines for powerplants. Huge vertical wings to generate cornering forces. Anti-lock brakes, active suspension, ejection seats, the sky is the limit.
Racing should be decided on the track, not the court room.

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outer_bongolia
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Joined: 13 Feb 2009, 19:17

Re: How much is possible?

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DaveKillens wrote:Formula One cars can exceed the limits of human physiology. For many years, the regulations have placed restrictions on aspects of car performance to reduce the danger to the driver and anyone else. Heck, twenty years ago, if allowed, designers could have constructed a vehicle that would easily exceed the limits of reflex, reaction, and everything else involving a driver. So basically, if you lift restrictions, you kill the driver.
But.. but, there's so much to imagine. Four wheel steering. Why stop there, make it eight wheels, eight wheel steering. Gas turbines for powerplants. Huge vertical wings to generate cornering forces. Anti-lock brakes, active suspension, ejection seats, the sky is the limit.
Double turbo v12's attached to every wheel. :twisted:
Skeptical scrutiny is the means, in both science and religion, by which deep thoughts can be winnowed from deep nonsense.
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