2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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toraabe
toraabe
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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chrisc90 wrote:
21 Mar 2023, 20:38
The shorter ratios normally account for a faster accelerating car. I don’t think gear ratios have anything to do with it to be fair
Alpine / Renault always had the longest ratio. Last year they were quite quick using DRS. Faster acceleration yes, but when peak power was at 290km/t your DRS will have little effect because red bull probably has it at 320... I personally think they miscalculated it. You can change it if approved by all other teams.

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AMG.Tzan
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Hammerfist wrote:
21 Mar 2023, 16:26
Even if they find gobs of downforce and get firmly ahead of the Aston I don’t see them anywhere near Redbull s straight line speed. And let’s face it if it’s gonna be a Redbull copy cat then they will always be second to the original. That’s just how things work in f1. I’m surprised at the big talk coming from Toto. It’s clear to me they are too far away to catch up even next year. Perhaps in 2025 if Redbull gets close to the ceiling of development for their concept. But otherwise I don’t see it.
Key to higher top speed is higher downforce generated by the floor!

Look at how shallow rear wing Red Bull is running! This is what gives them their higher top speed…which means their floor is working much better than Mercedes’s one!

Mercedes has been talking about the importance of the underfloor with these regulations since last year and they have often said that that’s where the concept changes compared to Red Bull!
"The only rule is there are no rules" - Aristotle Onassis

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ringo
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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wogx wrote:
21 Mar 2023, 18:03
Brundle gave an interesting two cents in the Sky studio on the subject of the ended cooperation between Cullen and Hamilton.
It turns out that the topic is a bit more complex than just - we don't work together well, so we part ways.

Cullen was with Hamilton when he was at his best as a driver. Over time, her services and salary also began to increase.

Cullen's contract was structured to get her salary and bonuses. Of which her salary was actually built on bonuses. Bonuses at Mercedes are based on the so-called "Performance Clause", i.e. the higher a driver finishes in races, the bigger bonus he gets from Mercedes to be distributed over the part of the garage that achieved this success. Mercedes does not honor with bonuses the places 4-20, only those who finish on the podium.

You know what this entails.... It turns out that in connection with the fact that Mercedes stopped winning races, not only the team of high-level engineers and designers has changed over the past months, but also the mechanics. They too, through the lack of success in 2022, got hit quite hard in the pocket, some of them left for other teams and some rotated.

Cullen also got hit pretty hard in the pocket because of this. No wins from Hamilton and Mercedes and the golden goose starts to rust.

Sure - in 2022 Hamilton could still compensate her part of the salary resulting from the lack of results, but in 2023, seeing the prospect of no wins himself, he had to start rethinking the question of keeping Cullen. - Can he afford it personally?

Sure, he could keep 20x such servants running around him. However, he decided to end his partnership with her.

Was firing her supposed to be a signal to Toto?

Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)
If she is hired by the team, how could Hamilton fire her?
What if she got too greedy and said hey, I need more pay or I am gone, and left.
Hamilton could have nothing to do with her leaving. I am sure he would have kept her if she took a pay cut like he did.
It seems more that she decided to leave, than her being fired.
For Sure!!

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ringo
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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I do not think Totto can leave Mercedes without a proper continuity plan. The team will be lost like Williams was after Sir Frank stepped down as team Boss.
As for Hamilton and his comfort in the car, it seems some feature in the car is putting him off. He says something at the rear of the car. I think the aero balance is not what he is used to.
But he needs to adapt like everyone else. If it's something the engineers could have resolved if they were listening to him, then they really should take the blame for making a poorly balanced car.
For Sure!!

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wogx
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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ringo wrote:
22 Mar 2023, 03:18

If she is hired by the team, how could Hamilton fire her?
What if she got too greedy and said hey, I need more pay or I am gone, and left.
Hamilton could have nothing to do with her leaving. I am sure he would have kept her if she took a pay cut like he did.
It seems more that she decided to leave, than her being fired.
She was a personal assistant for LH, so...
Mercedes Formula 1 boss Toto Wolff has implied it was Lewis Hamilton’s decision to split with trainer Angela Cullen, saying change comes when “things don’t work out anymore”.
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... /10445148/
Last edited by wogx on 22 Mar 2023, 04:10, edited 1 time in total.
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wogx
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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ringo wrote:
22 Mar 2023, 03:22
But he needs to adapt like everyone else. If it's something the engineers could have resolved if they were listening to him, then they really should take the blame for making a poorly balanced car.
On the other hand I haven't heard Russell complaining about the balance
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mendis
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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ringo wrote:
22 Mar 2023, 03:22
I do not think Totto can leave Mercedes without a proper continuity plan. The team will be lost like Williams was after Sir Frank stepped down as team Boss.
This is 11th year for Toto at Mercedes. If he hasn't worked on succession planning all this while, then he is a questionable leader and can't be expected to make that happen now. It then becomes someone else's job to step in and fix it.

Bill
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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AMG.Tzan wrote:
21 Mar 2023, 22:37
Hammerfist wrote:
21 Mar 2023, 16:26
Even if they find gobs of downforce and get firmly ahead of the Aston I don’t see them anywhere near Redbull s straight line speed. And let’s face it if it’s gonna be a Redbull copy cat then they will always be second to the original. That’s just how things work in f1. I’m surprised at the big talk coming from Toto. It’s clear to me they are too far away to catch up even next year. Perhaps in 2025 if Redbull gets close to the ceiling of development for their concept. But otherwise I don’t see it.
Key to higher top speed is higher downforce generated by the floor!

Look at how shallow rear wing Red Bull is running! This is what gives them their higher top speed…which means their floor is working much better than Mercedes’s one!

Mercedes has been talking about the importance of the underfloor with these regulations since last year and they have often said that that’s where the concept changes compared to Red Bull!
redbull can run their car very low something merc tried but gave up on the idea too early because floor was getting damage.Redbull never gave up on high rake concept even when merc was 2 second quick like in 2014 ,it took them 8 eight year to win their champ with max although with help of floor being cut.Honda too never gave up on size zero concept and in 2021 they brought an engine which was even smaller than the original size 0 and are now dominating.even if merc make a great car their deployment or hybrid area is not as good as the Honda so championship is unlikely until 2026.merc has the right idea they should just have soldiered on ,thats were great technical leadership comes in rather than just starting all over and hoping things work out ,they will probably go backward.

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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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AR3-GP
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Bill wrote:
22 Mar 2023, 09:17
AMG.Tzan wrote:
21 Mar 2023, 22:37
Hammerfist wrote:
21 Mar 2023, 16:26
Even if they find gobs of downforce and get firmly ahead of the Aston I don’t see them anywhere near Redbull s straight line speed. And let’s face it if it’s gonna be a Redbull copy cat then they will always be second to the original. That’s just how things work in f1. I’m surprised at the big talk coming from Toto. It’s clear to me they are too far away to catch up even next year. Perhaps in 2025 if Redbull gets close to the ceiling of development for their concept. But otherwise I don’t see it.
Key to higher top speed is higher downforce generated by the floor!

Look at how shallow rear wing Red Bull is running! This is what gives them their higher top speed…which means their floor is working much better than Mercedes’s one!

Mercedes has been talking about the importance of the underfloor with these regulations since last year and they have often said that that’s where the concept changes compared to Red Bull!
redbull can run their car very low something merc tried but gave up on the idea too early because floor was getting damage.Redbull never gave up on high rake concept even when merc was 2 second quick like in 2014 ,it took them 8 eight year to win their champ with max although with help of floor being cut.Honda too never gave up on size zero concept and in 2021 they brought an engine which was even smaller than the original size 0 and are now dominating.even if merc make a great car their deployment or hybrid area is not as good as the Honda so championship is unlikely until 2026.merc has the right idea they should just have soldiered on ,thats were great technical leadership comes in rather than just starting all over and hoping things work out ,they will probably go backward.
You might have a point here. Unfortunately for Merc, I think their actions are more pressured by Hamilton's desire for short term success, rather than looking towards the long term with Russell.

Who really knows what the W13 concept could have become. While it did not perform right away, primarily due to the correlation issues, I suspect rival teams are breathing a sigh of relief that Mercedes was never able to realize the potential they saw in the data and have now seemingly abandoned it. The car was so different looking. That definitely scared people in the paddock. You much prefer if your rivals cars are similar to your own because it enables an easier exchange of ideas if they manage to do something better than you. If that W13 worked, no one would have been able to copy it. Scary.

Bill
Bill
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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lewis will be better served if he do a swap with charles his career is coming to an end and Toto want charles for future ,i get the feeling both are getting inpatient with their respective teams .i dont belief ferrari has suddenly lost all the pace we saw last year ,i think they have something to unlock

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chrisc90
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Why would Charles drop to a lesser team though? Doesn’t make sense.

I really can’t see any driver adjustments happening to be fair, especially in the top flight. Excluding a retirement of Lewis - potentially.

Then his seat probably filled with lando who is clearly a talent that’s not having the smoothest of times at mclaren.

KimiRai
KimiRai
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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chrisc90 wrote:
23 Mar 2023, 00:39
Why would Charles drop to a lesser team though? Doesn’t make sense.
Why would Alonso drop to a lesser team? Doesn't make sense.

I'm not saying Charles should go to Merc necessarily, of course...

Hammerfist
Hammerfist
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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Id rather be at mercedes than ferrari. Merc is about to overtake ferrari on track and are already ahead in the standings and its a much more stable team imho.

Lewis isnt going anywhere until he retires.

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JordanMugen
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Re: 2023 Mercedes-AMG | Petronas F1 Team

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KimiRai wrote:
23 Mar 2023, 02:45
chrisc90 wrote:
23 Mar 2023, 00:39
Why would Charles drop to a lesser team though? Doesn’t make sense.
Why would Alonso drop to a lesser team? Doesn't make sense.

I'm not saying Charles should go to Merc necessarily, of course...
1. Because he had no choice. Alpine wouldn't give him the deal he wanted. Perhaps Alonso was also shown the wind tunnel numbers and that sealed the deal, who knows?

2. Charles could certainly be tempted by Mercedes, if Ferrari continues to disappoint him and Mercedes are more promising. I wouldn't put it past Red Bull to be keen on an out-of-contract Leclerc as well. :)

I guess Mercedes would also consider Norris, and probably Piastri, Albon and De Vries too (Albon or De Vries if they are after a number 2 driver).

The ball would in Hamilton's court as to whether he wants to continue with Mercedes, of course.