That is true but I can't help it. They are pissing me off sometimes.
That is true but I can't help it. They are pissing me off sometimes.
A small footnote in a larger scheme of things? Or the beginning of a junior team coalition?Michael Andretti is expected to be stepping down as CEO of Andretti Global and interestingly, Zak Brown, CEO of McLaren, has joined the board of directors for Andretti Acquisition Corp. II.
Now THAT is a Trumpism....mclaren111 wrote: ↑Fri Sep 27, 2024 11:00 ammwillems wrote: ↑Thu Sep 26, 2024 3:06 pmFake news and haters, and other words of polarism, to describe people, opinions and facts that you don't like. So instead of arguing the point and using reason, you just label things instead, which conveys some unmentioned fact or reason that is implied but may not exist or is highly vague.
Do you mean fake news like CNN and MSM outlets ? I heard ESPN is very bad...
I am quoting only a portion of the post, because opinions about drivers are exactly that - opinions. Everyone has one, and it's no one's place to question the opinion of another, as it's all subjective.Darth-Piekus wrote: ↑Fri Sep 27, 2024 5:43 pmMclaren had a competitive car for wins after Miami but the Red Bull car was still slightly better. Even with the second upgrade package in Hungaroring the car was far from dominant. Except Singapore, Hungaroring and Zadvoort the car had competition from Ferrari or Mercedes.
venkyhere wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 5:43 am
I am quoting only a portion of the post, because opinions about drivers are exactly that - opinions. Everyone has one, and it's no one's place to question the opinion of another, as it's all subjective.
But the quoted portion above, is simply incorrect.
With Miami upgrade, the Mclaren became the fastest car. The wins in Imola, Canada, Spain for Redbull were NOT because it was the faster car. The only place where the Mclaren was 'beaten for pace' was in Baku (despite Mclaren winning), because it's a tailor made Ferrari track. Otherwise, without an iota of doubt, the Mclaren has been the fastest car (even in Spa) since Miami.
It would likely have cost our drivers much more and put the team quite far behind Red Bull even today.Darth-Piekus wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 7:39 amHave in mind though that a driver who could perform better than Perez might have costed Max points on the other hand.
Your McLaren bias at times is off the scale hilarious. Most people here commenting are McLaren fans however you do need some realism also.Darth-Piekus wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 7:12 amThat is extremely debatable and in my opinion you are incorect. The car was only the fastest by far in Zandvoort, Hungaroring and Singapore. Nowhere else you mentioned it had the capacity to be dominant for an easy win like Red Bull's car of the last two years.
True and not to insult your intelligence, but that’s not ours or Mclarens fault. It’s a Red Bull issue and has been for many, many seasons, my memory doesn’t serve me well for the 2021 WCC season but considering how close Merc and Red Bull were you can argue Perez cost them that WCC.mwillems wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 7:14 amvenkyhere wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 5:43 am
I am quoting only a portion of the post, because opinions about drivers are exactly that - opinions. Everyone has one, and it's no one's place to question the opinion of another, as it's all subjective.
But the quoted portion above, is simply incorrect.
With Miami upgrade, the Mclaren became the fastest car. The wins in Imola, Canada, Spain for Redbull were NOT because it was the faster car. The only place where the Mclaren was 'beaten for pace' was in Baku (despite Mclaren winning), because it's a tailor made Ferrari track. Otherwise, without an iota of doubt, the Mclaren has been the fastest car (even in Spa) since Miami.
Not fast enough that circumstances can't give the win to someone else. It's just that when those circumstances were in control of the driver or strategy team and not events out of our control then it becomes frustrating.
You do have to bear in mind that yes, we are closing in.on the WCC, but only because of a poorly scoring Red Bull driver. If Perez had performed better then our mistakes would also potentially cost us the WCC too.
Come on! The "shady" moves you refer to were largely the work of Mark Webber getting his future an F1 drive. The handwringing by Renault and so many others who should know better is nauseating.CjC wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 9:22 amTrue and not to insult your intelligence, but that’s not ours or Mclarens fault. It’s a Red Bull issue and has been for many, many seasons, my memory doesn’t serve me well for the 2021 WCC season but considering how close Merc and Red Bull were you can argue Perez cost them that WCC.mwillems wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 7:14 amvenkyhere wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 5:43 am
I am quoting only a portion of the post, because opinions about drivers are exactly that - opinions. Everyone has one, and it's no one's place to question the opinion of another, as it's all subjective.
But the quoted portion above, is simply incorrect.
With Miami upgrade, the Mclaren became the fastest car. The wins in Imola, Canada, Spain for Redbull were NOT because it was the faster car. The only place where the Mclaren was 'beaten for pace' was in Baku (despite Mclaren winning), because it's a tailor made Ferrari track. Otherwise, without an iota of doubt, the Mclaren has been the fastest car (even in Spa) since Miami.
Not fast enough that circumstances can't give the win to someone else. It's just that when those circumstances were in control of the driver or strategy team and not events out of our control then it becomes frustrating.
You do have to bear in mind that yes, we are closing in.on the WCC, but only because of a poorly scoring Red Bull driver. If Perez had performed better then our mistakes would also potentially cost us the WCC too.
One could argue that McLaren pulled some shady moves to get Piastri but they wanted him and made sure they got him and they are currently reaping that benefit.
Red Bull pull some shady moves too by dropping drivers mid season which seems to be a strategy that isn’t playing out too well for them- although Lawson might prove me wrong.
If their poor driver recruitment is letting McLaren off the hook in WCC then is it a case of who’s mistake is the smallest rather than one team excelling over the other?
As the old saying goes, you can only beat the opposition in front of you
No it isn't our fault, but in terms of the context of what the team and drivers are doing, it is worth bearing in mind. I'll take it, because it's all part of the Red Bull implosion. But if Red Bull weren't imploding and they could have replaced Perez, then there's a good chance they'd be taking the WCC too. But fortune has smiled on us in that regards, thanks to Christian "Horny" Horner, otherwise those mistakes would be costing us in the WCC too.CjC wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 9:22 amTrue and not to insult your intelligence, but that’s not ours or Mclarens fault. It’s a Red Bull issue and has been for many, many seasons, my memory doesn’t serve me well for the 2021 WCC season but considering how close Merc and Red Bull were you can argue Perez cost them that WCC.mwillems wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 7:14 amvenkyhere wrote: ↑Mon Sep 30, 2024 5:43 am
I am quoting only a portion of the post, because opinions about drivers are exactly that - opinions. Everyone has one, and it's no one's place to question the opinion of another, as it's all subjective.
But the quoted portion above, is simply incorrect.
With Miami upgrade, the Mclaren became the fastest car. The wins in Imola, Canada, Spain for Redbull were NOT because it was the faster car. The only place where the Mclaren was 'beaten for pace' was in Baku (despite Mclaren winning), because it's a tailor made Ferrari track. Otherwise, without an iota of doubt, the Mclaren has been the fastest car (even in Spa) since Miami.
Not fast enough that circumstances can't give the win to someone else. It's just that when those circumstances were in control of the driver or strategy team and not events out of our control then it becomes frustrating.
You do have to bear in mind that yes, we are closing in.on the WCC, but only because of a poorly scoring Red Bull driver. If Perez had performed better then our mistakes would also potentially cost us the WCC too.
One could argue that McLaren pulled some shady moves to get Piastri but they wanted him and made sure they got him and they are currently reaping that benefit.
Red Bull pull some shady moves too by dropping drivers mid season which seems to be a strategy that isn’t playing out too well for them- although Lawson might prove me wrong.
If their poor driver recruitment is letting McLaren off the hook in WCC then is it a case of who’s mistake is the smallest rather than one team excelling over the other?
As the old saying goes, you can only beat the opposition in front of you