2025 Oracle Red Bull Racing F1 Team

[euv2]

F1 fans are so quick to attribute performance to 1 or 2 major figures. What happens if MCL fails to have a winning car in 26, is Marshall not the best then? What happens if Mercedes has the fastest car in 26, somehow all the talent drain has been negated and Allison is the new GOAT? What if Ferrari is dominant in 26, are Newey, Marshall all frauds? What if RBR makes the best car again, were Marshall and Newey not so important and all the credit went to Wache and Balbo?

The narratives people draw up from very little insight into how these teams work and how much innovation is contributed to the car from junior to seniors is all a mystery, but hey let's keep deifying 1-2 engineers and pretend like MCL weren't already well on track to produce the fastest car even before Marshall had any impact.

On a side note, race week again and even after a month's break and probably countless simulator runs for Zandvoort, wouldn't be surprised to see the RB21 struggle again in FP1.

[Bill]

F1 fans are so quick to attribute performance to 1 or 2 major figures. What happens if MCL fails to have a winning car in 26, is Marshall not the best then? What happens if Mercedes has the fastest car in 26, somehow all the talent drain has been negated and Allison is the new GOAT? What if Ferrari is dominant in 26, are Newey, Marshall all frauds? What if RBR makes the best car again, were Marshall and Newey not so important and all the credit went to Wache and Balbo?

The narratives people draw up from very little insight into how these teams work and how much innovation is contributed to the car from junior to seniors is all a mystery, but hey let's keep deifying 1-2 engineers and pretend like MCL weren't already well on track to produce the fastest car even before Marshall had any impact.

On a side note, race week again and even after a month's break and probably countless simulator runs for Zandvoort, wouldn't be surprised to see the RB21 struggle again in FP1.

McLaren's Team Principal, Andrea Stella, praised former Red Bull engineer Rob Marshall's arrival as a transformative, "profound impact" on the team, exceeding high expectations. Marshall's championship-winning expertise, particularly in car layout and design under the new regulations, is seen as a key factor in McLaren's resurgence and the first constructors' championship in 26 years. Stella also highlighted Marshall's positive, hands-on approach and collaborative spirit as significant assets to the technical team's morale and performance.

[Avocado]

Marshall has a long history.

[Wouter]

Max is always the bad guy and Mad Max. Here is someone who knows him better than the F1 fans:

"Max Verstappen’s former Trainer: What I’ve Seen in Max That NO ONE Else Has"

[f1isgood]

F1 fans are so quick to attribute performance to 1 or 2 major figures. What happens if MCL fails to have a winning car in 26, is Marshall not the best then? What happens if Mercedes has the fastest car in 26, somehow all the talent drain has been negated and Allison is the new GOAT? What if Ferrari is dominant in 26, are Newey, Marshall all frauds? What if RBR makes the best car again, were Marshall and Newey not so important and all the credit went to Wache and Balbo?

The narratives people draw up from very little insight into how these teams work and how much innovation is contributed to the car from junior to seniors is all a mystery, but hey let's keep deifying 1-2 engineers and pretend like MCL weren't already well on track to produce the fastest car even before Marshall had any impact.

On a side note, race week again and even after a month's break and probably countless simulator runs for Zandvoort, wouldn't be surprised to see the RB21 struggle again in FP1.

You can be as sensible as you want, but internet forums will always degenerate into noise over time. It's a blind alley with blind folks.

[Macklaren]

F1 fans are so quick to attribute performance to 1 or 2 major figures. What happens if MCL fails to have a winning car in 26, is Marshall not the best then? What happens if Mercedes has the fastest car in 26, somehow all the talent drain has been negated and Allison is the new GOAT? What if Ferrari is dominant in 26, are Newey, Marshall all frauds? What if RBR makes the best car again, were Marshall and Newey not so important and all the credit went to Wache and Balbo?

The narratives people draw up from very little insight into how these teams work and how much innovation is contributed to the car from junior to seniors is all a mystery, but hey let's keep deifying 1-2 engineers and pretend like MCL weren't already well on track to produce the fastest car even before Marshall had any impact.

On a side note, race week again and even after a month's break and probably countless simulator runs for Zandvoort, wouldn't be surprised to see the RB21 struggle again in FP1.

Agree with this. While Stella has been very effusive about Marshall and his arrival has been a huge boost to the team, keep in mind that 1) Marshall's role is mostly to make sure every dept talks to each other...marshall the troops if you will (pun intended). He's not a mad genius developing silver bullets like Newey may have been 2) McL's upturn began in Austria 2023 before Marshall started with the team. So the existing dept heads (maybe with some left over input from Key even) began the recovery...not something Marshall brought with him from RBR

[pantherxxx]

The 2015 Red Bull was similarly weak, or even weaker car than this. And they had Marshall and Newey in the team, they had the same correlation issues with the wind tunnel and CFD. The new reg will be totally different, anything can happen to the pecking order.

[Bill]

F1 fans are so quick to attribute performance to 1 or 2 major figures. What happens if MCL fails to have a winning car in 26, is Marshall not the best then? What happens if Mercedes has the fastest car in 26, somehow all the talent drain has been negated and Allison is the new GOAT? What if Ferrari is dominant in 26, are Newey, Marshall all frauds? What if RBR makes the best car again, were Marshall and Newey not so important and all the credit went to Wache and Balbo?

The narratives people draw up from very little insight into how these teams work and how much innovation is contributed to the car from junior to seniors is all a mystery, but hey let's keep deifying 1-2 engineers and pretend like MCL weren't already well on track to produce the fastest car even before Marshall had any impact.

On a side note, race week again and even after a month's break and probably countless simulator runs for Zandvoort, wouldn't be surprised to see the RB21 struggle again in FP1.

Agree with this. While Stella has been very effusive about Marshall and his arrival has been a huge boost to the team, keep in mind that 1) Marshall's role is mostly to make sure every dept talks to each other...marshall the troops if you will (pun intended). He's not a mad genius developing silver bullets like Newey may have been 2) McL's upturn began in Austria 2023 before Marshall started with the team. So the existing dept heads (maybe with some left over input from Key even) began the recovery...not something Marshall brought with him from RBR

In terms of innovation what did Newey comeup with that f1 didn't already have,the blown diffuser wasn't his idea neither the double diffuser,even flexy wings it was honda who started tinkering with those.Newey strength is incorporating other people ideas into his own design. He is the biggest thief in f1 that's why he is always carrying that red notebook.

[PlatinumZealot]

F1 fans are so quick to attribute performance to 1 or 2 major figures. What happens if MCL fails to have a winning car in 26, is Marshall not the best then? What happens if Mercedes has the fastest car in 26, somehow all the talent drain has been negated and Allison is the new GOAT? What if Ferrari is dominant in 26, are Newey, Marshall all frauds? What if RBR makes the best car again, were Marshall and Newey not so important and all the credit went to Wache and Balbo?

The narratives people draw up from very little insight into how these teams work and how much innovation is contributed to the car from junior to seniors is all a mystery, but hey let's keep deifying 1-2 engineers and pretend like MCL weren't already well on track to produce the fastest car even before Marshall had any impact.

On a side note, race week again and even after a month's break and probably countless simulator runs for Zandvoort, wouldn't be surprised to see the RB21 struggle again in FP1.

Agreed 100%

To my other point... A driver that is super talented who will drive anything you throw at him can create a situation where the engineers keep pushing the car down a bad path, even if the simultion tools aren't calibrated properly.

This could be exaclty why Yuki was thrown into the seat over Liam too. To be a sort of recallibration. People dismiss the importance of this.

[Big Tea]

F1 fans are so quick to attribute performance to 1 or 2 major figures. What happens if MCL fails to have a winning car in 26, is Marshall not the best then? What happens if Mercedes has the fastest car in 26, somehow all the talent drain has been negated and Allison is the new GOAT? What if Ferrari is dominant in 26, are Newey, Marshall all frauds? What if RBR makes the best car again, were Marshall and Newey not so important and all the credit went to Wache and Balbo?

The narratives people draw up from very little insight into how these teams work and how much innovation is contributed to the car from junior to seniors is all a mystery, but hey let's keep deifying 1-2 engineers and pretend like MCL weren't already well on track to produce the fastest car even before Marshall had any impact.

On a side note, race week again and even after a month's break and probably countless simulator runs for Zandvoort, wouldn't be surprised to see the RB21 struggle again in FP1.

Agree with this. While Stella has been very effusive about Marshall and his arrival has been a huge boost to the team, keep in mind that 1) Marshall's role is mostly to make sure every dept talks to each other...marshall the troops if you will (pun intended). He's not a mad genius developing silver bullets like Newey may have been 2) McL's upturn began in Austria 2023 before Marshall started with the team. So the existing dept heads (maybe with some left over input from Key even) began the recovery...not something Marshall brought with him from RBR

In terms of innovation what did Newey comeup with that f1 didn't already have,the blown diffuser wasn't his idea neither the double diffuser,even flexy wings it was honda who started tinkering with those.Newey strength is incorporating other people ideas into his own design. He is the biggest thief in f1 that's why he is always carrying that red notebook.

They say that copying someone's idea is plagiarism, but copying everyone's is research.
Quite often the way an idea is applied is more beneficial than the original, which seems to be Newey's approach, and it seems to work. (Not defending him or otherwise)

[Emag]

F1 fans are so quick to attribute performance to 1 or 2 major figures. What happens if MCL fails to have a winning car in 26, is Marshall not the best then? What happens if Mercedes has the fastest car in 26, somehow all the talent drain has been negated and Allison is the new GOAT? What if Ferrari is dominant in 26, are Newey, Marshall all frauds? What if RBR makes the best car again, were Marshall and Newey not so important and all the credit went to Wache and Balbo?

The narratives people draw up from very little insight into how these teams work and how much innovation is contributed to the car from junior to seniors is all a mystery, but hey let's keep deifying 1-2 engineers and pretend like MCL weren't already well on track to produce the fastest car even before Marshall had any impact.

On a side note, race week again and even after a month's break and probably countless simulator runs for Zandvoort, wouldn't be surprised to see the RB21 struggle again in FP1.

Agree with this. While Stella has been very effusive about Marshall and his arrival has been a huge boost to the team, keep in mind that 1) Marshall's role is mostly to make sure every dept talks to each other...marshall the troops if you will (pun intended). He's not a mad genius developing silver bullets like Newey may have been 2) McL's upturn began in Austria 2023 before Marshall started with the team. So the existing dept heads (maybe with some left over input from Key even) began the recovery...not something Marshall brought with him from RBR

In terms of innovation what did Newey comeup with that f1 didn't already have,the blown diffuser wasn't his idea neither the double diffuser,even flexy wings it was honda who started tinkering with those.Newey strength is incorporating other people ideas into his own design. He is the biggest thief in f1 that's why he is always carrying that red notebook.

I think the narrow chassis body of the march 881 (his first car) defines his style of designing cars. Newey popularized the “idea” that mechanical compromises can be worth huge aero benefits if carefuly studied.

Newey didn’t really “invent” anything as far as I remember, because most things were already invented conceptually by the time he came along F1. What he was always good at, was pushing ideas to the extreme and integrating the mechanical platform of the car to serve the aero platform.

[bigblue]

Yeah, he sucks at car design, apart from the designing cars that win aspect. Repeatedly. Across different teams.

[Henk_v]

As I will sail a big regatta over the weekend, Ive been studying the weather here quite intensively and what will cross Zandvoort fridaynight is just evil. It is the leftovers from a hurricane , pushed by a second hurricane. The weather forecast is highly unstable. Very big chances we will not be able to see how RB came out of summer recess. Green track almost guaranteed and Rain is very likely. The wind will be gusty and the gusts look nasty.

[Macklaren]

As I will sail a big regatta over the weekend, Ive been studying the weather here quite intensively and what will cross Zandvoort fridaynight is just evil. It is the leftovers from a hurricane , pushed by a second hurricane. The weather forecast is highly unstable. Very big chances we will not be able to see how RB came out of summer recess. Green track almost guaranteed and Rain is very likely. The wind will be gusty and the gusts look nasty.

WOW thanks. Is there risk that the race might be called off/truncated?

[pantherxxx]

Well, McLaren actually improved after Newey left the team. The 2006 car he designed was only the third-best, while the 2007 challenger was arguably the best car on the grid. And they built that without Newey. If he truly is this all-knowing genius who single-handedly guarantees success, then how do you explain that? Newey is a brilliant designer, but he’s not a one-man army. Success in F1 comes from organization, resources, and execution as much as from individual brilliance. Adrian Newey has almost always worked with top teams with huge budgets and resources. In other words, Newey’s genius is real — but it’s also amplified because he’s always had the perfect platform to execute his ideas. If he were chief designer at a midfield team with half the budget (say, Sauber back in the day), it’s very unlikely his cars would have dominated.