Reducing the drag of a two element wing through stall

[DaveKillens]

I remember when races in the past, a driver on a straight would tilt and lower his head in order to open up even more room for air entry into the airbox. So please, the issue on whether a driver can move about and influence airflow has been established. There are powerful precedents.

The rules specify that only specific parts of the car are allowed to be moveable aero devices, such as the front wing. But air is not part of the car, it is the medium it moves through.

[thestig84]

Ha nice on manchild. Get rid of my quote form Vettel saying the Mclaren is with Ferrari as the one to beat and put a sensationalised headline in bold!!!

Ignoring the headline and reading the drivers comments doesnt suggest to me they are massively worried. More concerned with finalising the setup tomorrow.

[WimmelF1]

I miss the X-wings and the early 90's double-extra-superdownforce rearwings. Ahhh, good old times where cheating was considered just being smarter then the guy next to you!

[ringo]

Hi all, what about this - instead of knee use foot. When is on full trotle you can "rest" your feet on some support, just like in normal car. But in this one is hole and you control the air from snokrel.

Note: This isnt my idea, I read about his somewhere and I only draw this picture. But for me is this the most possible way.

BTW: sorry my english

good alternative desing, so basically the third pedal is back.
The "dead" zone may refer to the dead pedal!

That pipe going to the ground could also be routed side ways as well to have less bends going up to the region behind the driver.

[Ciro Pabón]

I won't be satisfied until we each have individual McLaren threads.

[RacingManiac]

Someone need to find a pic of Lewis in his driving gear out of the car during FP1 and 2. According to Gerald Donaldson's podcast after FP, he is seen wearing a kneepad on his left knee only.....perhaps for this doohicky alone....

And I think the cost argument is not how much it cost McLaren to do this, but how much extra others will need to have the same thing. It could be just a few bits of pipe and cover and the new rear wing, or it could mean a new tub to be crash tested. And really for something that serves very little purpose.....

[RacingManiac]

I think you'll be hard pressed to argue it being an aerodynamic device solely. The whole system if the current conjecture is correct, really is a duct in the car with a hole opening midway to the cockpit. There is nothing to "ban" other than either banning driver cooling, or that he cannot move whilst sitting in the car.

[jason.parker.86]

Not the best but certainly no knee pad..

Like the way Mark Webber is having a good old nose

[RacingManiac]

photo-op, not an actual pic from the FPs themselves.....

[jason.parker.86]

Might have been a foto op, but still dont see a diff in the race suits? I know Macca used to use a "press confrence" race suit which used wire inside it to ensure all sponsors got maximum exposure, but this looks like a normal race suit to me

[FuzzyDice]

Ok now when SLC is gone (but im sure he is snooping around ) and pissing contest is over. Do we have an agreement that stall reduces drag (i guess we have since scrabs's sourced confermed) and more importantly HOW?

whole thing puzzles me, when someone says stall i keep seeing plane that spins out of control, yea i was playing too much IL-2 sturmovik so may way of thinking is on the wrong rail. Does anyone has a patience to explain this nice and slow?

[RacingManiac]

Same reason they don't wear gloves of balaclava in a walking around photo-op, I doubt you'll wear your knee pad if you are not actually going to drive....

I tried looking around Motorsport.com's 40+ pages of photos from today but can't find a pic of him outside of the car from the sessions themselves....

[Ciro Pabón]

I think this thread should be merged with McLaren MP4/25 Air Intake. I'll wait until tomorrow, just in case somebody thinks differently.

[segedunum]

It is not illegal. If it were, the FIA/stewards would have refused McLaren permission to race the system this weekend.

It is legal.
Get over it.

I'm afraid the FIA and stewards have a rather poor track record over such things, as we all know, so referring to their decision is the usual cop-out and won't stop discussion about it. You're certainly not adding to it.

[Giblet]

why do people have problems understanding that Driver cannot be considered as a movable aero device.....

The driver is not the issue - it's the system as a whole. I don't know why people are focusing on the driver. As a whole, this system with the driver in the middle, is a system that acts as an aerodynamic device making active decisions.

But, I suppose the FIA just didn't want any more controversy when it came down to it..................

We're focusing on the driver, as he is not part of the car. The car get's crash tested, and scrutinized without the driver in it, as car and driver are separate entities. According to the letter of the rules, the trick wing car has no movable parts, and the driver is not considered part of the vehicle. The idea of a fluidic valve system is pure genius, if that is what is indeed happening.

Everyone says it's legal, but not within the spirit of the rules. Problem is there is not a section in the rules called "spirit".

NASCAR's rules, AFAIK, are not published for all to see, that is why they are considered to be written in pencil.