Ferrari & McLaren compared on medium tires and similar fuel

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firbanks
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Re: Ferrari & McLaren compared on medium tires and similar fuel

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Rob W wrote:Vettel was in front of Alonso and pulling away for a large chunk of the race.
After pit stops, Alonso was around 3.6 sec back from Vettel. This gap slowly came down by a few tenths per lap until Alonso caught Vettel (recall him moving out of Vettel's wake to keep his car cool). So the Ferrari was in fact faster after pitting.

Rob W wrote:Maybe the graph would show relative pace more accurately if it ignored laps where drivers encounter significant traffic (lap 27 for example) or other hindrances.

If the idea is to get an idea of the race pace then only 'free' laps should be considered. Anything else just skews the curve.
This is true. The lines will become more accurate as outliers are removed. I looked at lap 27 for Vettel and it does look as though he was slowed by a few tenths by lapped traffic. But take a look at the variation in lap times and it is obvious drivers are not consistently making 'perfect' laps anyways. So you can either high grade data and end up with a small and potentially biased dataset or just look at the general trends that are coming out.

vall
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Re: Ferrari & McLaren compared on medium tires and similar fuel

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firbanks wrote:
Rob W wrote:Vettel was in front of Alonso and pulling away for a large chunk of the race.
After pit stops, Alonso was around 3.6 sec back from Vettel. This gap slowly came down by a few tenths per lap until Alonso caught Vettel (recall him moving out of Vettel's wake to keep his car cool). So the Ferrari was in fact faster after pitting.

From the first plot one can clearly see how Alonso's lap time improved by 1s after the overtook Vettel.

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ringo
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Re: Ferrari & McLaren compared on medium tires and similar fuel

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This data is too selective, I bet if the same thing was done with Massa's times it would be a much different story. :wink: I don't think this data is enough to draw any conclusions on tyre wear. It almost has no relation past a certain point. Especially when we don't know the effort that the drivers are putting in.
This would have some credence if all drivers stated that they were pushing 100% and were only limited by their tyres and nothing else.
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Mr Alcatraz
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Re: Ferrari & McLaren compared on medium tires and similar fuel

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I can think of two reasons Fred's pace improved after he got past Vettel:

1) He was in clean air which allowed him to push a little harder without an overheating issue that they might have some concern about due to Bulk's overheating lump!

2) I really don't think these teams really know how long to expect these tire to go before they really fall off (they've done a lot of testing, but each track is different). Once Vettel was behind Fred and fading, I think that Ferrari decided to let Fred see what kind of pace he could hold. I think that is why it appeared that Fred was pushing harder than he needed to toward the end of the race!

I also like Fred’s perspective on the early flyaway races:
"I think it is not very important, and I always repeat the same thing - that the first three or four races of the championship are not, in my opinion, crucial for anything," he claimed, "You just need to take some solid points for the team, to get used to the new regulations, to understand a little bit better the tyres, the races... At the end, it depends on how competitive your car is to you getting more or less points but, from a driver's point of view, it is not a crucial part.
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tinhouse
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Joined: 18 Jan 2006, 15:28

Re: Ferrari & McLaren compared on medium tires and similar fuel

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Tazio wrote:
2) I really don't think these teams really know how long to expect these tire to go before they really fall off (they've done a lot of testing, but each track is different). Once Vettel was behind Fred and fading, I think that Ferrari decided to let Fred see what kind of pace he could hold. I think that is why it appeared that Fred was pushing harder than he needed to toward the end of the race!
I think that might be the right one. According to the BBC's pit reporter (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsp ... 572060.stm) Alonso was nursing his tyres with the intention of mounting an assault on Vettel in the last 10 laps when the fuel loads evened out. If so then it would have been exactly the kind of racing I was hoping the new rules would generate: a driver trying to hold a sweet spot between conserving resources and keeping the leader in sight and then reeling them in during the closing stages.

I guess with Vettel out then it made sense for both team and driver to get some data in the bank to help with those judgement calls in the future.

Matt.

Richard
Richard
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Re: Ferrari & McLaren compared on medium tires and similar fuel

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tinhouse wrote:
Tazio wrote:
2) I really don't think these teams really know how long to expect these tire to go before they really fall off (they've done a lot of testing, but each track is different). Once Vettel was behind Fred and fading, I think that Ferrari decided to let Fred see what kind of pace he could hold. I think that is why it appeared that Fred was pushing harder than he needed to toward the end of the race!
I think that might be the right one. According to the BBC's pit reporter (http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/motorsp ... 572060.stm) Alonso was nursing his tyres with the intention of mounting an assault on Vettel in the last 10 laps when the fuel loads evened out. If so then it would have been exactly the kind of racing I was hoping the new rules would generate: a driver trying to hold a sweet spot between conserving resources and keeping the leader in sight and then reeling them in during the closing stages.

I guess with Vettel out then it made sense for both team and driver to get some data in the bank to help with those judgement calls in the future.

Matt.
That doesn't ring true when you look at the other 20 odd drivers still on the track. We didn't see anyone making a big push to threaten the car in front.