I have no problem with your opinion. In fact I would love to hear how one could evaluate things better in a scientific way. Please, give me details what you think I'm doing wrong and could be done better.Mystery Steve wrote:WB,
While I appreciate the effort you've put into creating those charts, I do disagree with the data and how it is being used. The problem with odds is they aren't created to predict future events or analyze an individual/team, but rather to induce betting.
It would be amazing if we could trust everyone to behave and actually think their comments 3 times over before hitting the submit button.Mystery Steve wrote:Unfortunately, I don't see this topic going anywhere since the question is mostly unanswerable with any certainty. It's only a matter of time before this thread degenerates into another fanboy thread.
....
Of course they do, but they are working the odds to induce betting. When they set the over/under for a game at X number of points/runs/goals/whatever, it doesn't mean they think the margin of victory will be that amount. They are setting it at a value that would entice betting. After all, they are trying to make money, not predict the future. Also, maybe I am nitpicking here, but an important distinction to make is the definition of "fastest" in the context of this question. If you interpret it to mean the ability to attain the lowest lap time, then the WDC odds lose relevance. When they give Alonso the best odds they mean he would be most likely to earn the most points in his Ferrari. Of course, if "fastest" means becoming WDC then using the odds is at least relevant. However, you still have to be careful with the conclusions you make from those numbers. Personally, the only conclusion I can reach from looking at that graph is that Alonso, Vettel, Hamilton, etc are all good drivers on good teams...WhiteBlue wrote: The main point for my view is that betting is a market mechanism that creates significant data about the future expectations for drivers and teams (cars). Odds under ten are backed by huge number of people putting their money on the line similarly as they do in the stock market. The economic theory says that in an ideal market the capital instantaneously reacts to all relevant information about profit chances. You have to be very well informed and clever to beat the bookies when it comes to odds because they use this market mechanism perfectly.
Perhaps you have a justification for reading further into the numbers. If you do, I would be interested to hear it.Absolutely, I'm not judging anyone. Having reread my comment, the tone sounds condescending and that wasn't my intention. I was merely making an observation based on recent threads. I hope I am wrong.mx_tifosi wrote:It's not so hard to let everyone have their own opinion and simply state yours with an optional explanation of why.
I actually didn't mean for it to seem directed at you. It was for those who can't seem to be able to let others have an opinion and are constantly trolling and bickering. We should be able to debate or just share our comments without having to fight and kill threads.Mystery Steve wrote:...
Absolutely, I'm not judging anyone. Having reread my comment, the tone sounds condescending and that wasn't my intention. I was merely making an observation based on recent threads. I hope I am wrong.mx_tifosi wrote:It's not so hard to let everyone have their own opinion and simply state yours with an optional explanation of why.
...
I have to concur with MX tifosi. The question here is "Who would be fastest?" and that would no doubt go to Raikkonen if he were currently in F1. His "on limit" abilities were very remniscent of Mika Hakkinen in the way he could extract maximum performance from a fast car. Give him a dog of car and the story changes yes, but we are talking RB6 here. And if you want to see an RB6 fly, give it to Raikkonen and watch in awe...mx_tifosi wrote:It would be amazing if we could trust everyone to behave and actually think their comments 3 times over before hitting the submit button.Mystery Steve wrote:Unfortunately, I don't see this topic going anywhere since the question is mostly unanswerable with any certainty. It's only a matter of time before this thread degenerates into another fanboy thread.
....
It's not so hard to let everyone have their own opinion and simply state yours with an optional explanation of why.
My simple reason for choosing Raikkonen is that the RB6 seems like it's easily taken to the limits and quick in most situations. Raikkonen would excel in this car, although the only, and worst, fault is that it has proven to be unreliable in multiple areas; engine, suspension, brakes.
You may see him in the RB7.JohnsonsEvilTwin wrote:I have to concur with MX tifosi. The question here is "Who would be fastest?" and that would no doubt go to Raikkonen if he were currently in F1. His "on limit" abilities were very remniscent of Mika Hakkinen in the way he could extract maximum performance from a fast car. Give him a dog of car and the story changes yes, but we are talking RB6 here. And if you want to see an RB6 fly, give it to Raikkonen and watch in awe...
That is a flawed way of decided the order. Far too many variables. For instance was Alonso confortable enough at Mclaren to get the most out of himself and the car? I would say no.ringo wrote:A good way of determining who will be fastest is driver comparisons as they change teams and get new partners. This way all the drivers can be linked.
for example;
Hamilton Alonso, Hamilton was proven to be faster.
then Massa Alonso, Alonso is faster. Massa Kimi, Massa is faster. Massa shumacher, Shumacher was faster. Button Barichello, barichello was faster. Shumacher Barichello etc.
so we get a little hierarchy from these details
Hamilton
Alonso/ Shumacher
Massa/ Barichello
Raikonen
Button
and the list goes on as we compare drivers who've had worked with more than 1 driver over the years. The more details the easier to triangulate and find out who trumps who. Heiki and truli can fit in based on hamilton, fisichella, Alonso, glock etc.
For Webber Vettel, Webber is the faster now. We can look on webber's teammates to fit him into the list.
