What is wrong with the safety car rule?

[autogyro]

Shut the pit lane other than for damage repair during SC period.

[myurr]

Shut the pit lane other than for damage repair during SC period.

What about:

1) Changes in weather.
2) Damage to tyres or wheels - you get a free pit stop that way.
3) Having damaged cars racing back to the pit lane as fast as they can to take advantage of their free stop.
4) What about minor damage, say to the front wing end plate, that doesn't stop the car from carrying on but they would like to change. Where do you draw the line and then enforce it? Or are you going to make it subjective and down to the stewards?

Can you imagine the outcry had Hamilton been allowed to pit under the safety can in Valencia because he had a damaged front wing yet Alonso and the others had to stay out and change their tyres later?

[marcush.]

sc rules will always be in favour of some and to the dtriment of others.It is pure luck ,rolling the dice how you come out of it to an extend .Some guys even have a nose for opportunities arising and with decisive moves bring themselves into position to make the most out of these situations .
But some seem to think of themselves being more clever than others and fall flat on their face in the process.
Sometime it pays of to ask first before deciding on an assumption .. see montecarlo ,and now Valencia.Again where did they learn from their faults .Or is it they see themselves not at fault at all?.that is a basic fault in understanding how things work.
just amazing that they look into the regs so deeply but do not crosscheck with officials for clarification but go for the loophole they see ..

[autogyro]

Shut the pit lane other than for damage repair during SC period.

What about:

1) Changes in weather.
2) Damage to tyres or wheels - you get a free pit stop that way.
3) Having damaged cars racing back to the pit lane as fast as they can to take advantage of their free stop.
4) What about minor damage, say to the front wing end plate, that doesn't stop the car from carrying on but they would like to change. Where do you draw the line and then enforce it? Or are you going to make it subjective and down to the stewards?

Can you imagine the outcry had Hamilton been allowed to pit under the safety can in Valencia because he had a damaged front wing yet Alonso and the others had to stay out and change their tyres later?

Simple just make the damaged car teams ask for permission to pit.
Same with wet weather tyres across the board.
Speed under the SC is limited to a 'safety' level, no other criteria.

[myurr]

Simple just make the damaged car teams ask for permission to pit.
Same with wet weather tyres across the board.
Speed under the SC is limited to a 'safety' level, no other criteria.

There's not always time and race control and / or the stewards are likely to be busy if there is a SC situation.

In marginal conditions some cars may be able to cope better on one tyre another - a blanket rule for all would not always work.

This assumes that all cars are formed up behind the safety car, something which is definitely not the case on the first lap after an incident when there is the greatest chance of damaged cars being on track and trying to return to the pits.

[Richard]

Simple - keep the pit lane open for damaged cars to be made safe, but the exit is closed so they are only able to rejoin after the on-track cars have resumed race order.

If there is a downpour of rain, then all cars stop in the pits, and then rejoin the race in the same order that they stopped ... except for Glock who will stay out on dry tyres to gain the lead and hold it until the last corner

[myurr]

Simple - keep the pit lane open for damaged cars to be made safe, but the exit is closed so they are only able to rejoin after the on-track cars have resumed race order.

So let's say that a driver misjudges their braking point and runs into the back of another car slashing their rear tyre and giving them a puncture. The driver makes it back to the pits, changes their tyres, but then has to wait until all the other cars are past putting them to the back of the grid? Even though it was no fault of their own that they had to pit?

Also what happens on the first lap when the cars are yet to form up behind the safety car. Are cars that pit just released or do they have to go a lap down and wait for the other cars to form up?

[Richard]

So let's say that a driver misjudges their braking point and runs into the back of another car slashing their rear tyre and giving them a puncture. The driver makes it back to the pits, changes their tyres, but then has to wait until all the other cars are past putting them to the back of the grid? Even though it was no fault of their own that they had to pit?

Also what happens on the first lap when the cars are yet to form up behind the safety car. Are cars that pit just released or do they have to go a lap down and wait for the other cars to form up?

Yes to both. We often see drivers lose track position due to incidents like that, or even forced to retire. Why should a SC mean they get special treatment?

My overall point is that it is better to close the loophole we saw in Valencia to avoid unfair advantage that we saw between Button and Alonso.

[timbo]

Close the pit-lane, if driver has to enter pit-lane for whatever reason he has to do drive-thru when the race is open.
Pit-lane may be open if race control declares a wet race.

[Richard]

Close the pit-lane, if driver has to enter pit-lane for whatever reason he has to do drive-thru when the race is open.
Pit-lane may be open if race control declares a wet race.

That's a viable option too. I bet there is a scenario where it is quicker to do a SC stop, plus a drive through, but no system is perfect.

[WhiteBlue]

Simple - keep the pit lane open for damaged cars to be made safe, but the exit is closed so they are only able to rejoin after the on-track cars have resumed race order.

Excellent. The pit exit should close long enough to make sure that no "free" pit stops can be gained. Same for rain tyres. You simply go down one lap. If the rain is so bad that slicks are undriveable at SC pace you do not get a disadvantage from it.

[timbo]

That's a viable option too. I bet there is a scenario where it is quicker to do a SC stop, plus a drive through, but no system is perfect.

Well, maybe stop-and-go then.
I think that can't turn out as an exploit.
Just make it automatic -- you enter, you receive your penalty right away.

[Richard]

I think stop & go will be a nightmare to administer, and is there enough room for them all to park up for 10 seconds?

I like the idea of a drive through. All the cars that pitted would follow the SC into the pit entrance and parade down the pit lane. It would be eerie to see 10 cars doing that.

[u401768]

Sounds like a viable option to me

[timbo]

I think stop & go will be a nightmare to administer, and is there enough room for them all to park up for 10 seconds?

Well, you're probably right, but if the penalty is stop-and-go, I don't think there would be many guys doing that.

I like the idea of a drive through. All the cars that pitted would follow the SC into the pit entrance and parade down the pit lane. It would be eerie to see 10 cars doing that.

Well, bt once you said about exploiting it, it is clear exploit as guys who didn't pit would have to come in, pit and most probably loose against others.
How about penalty limiter -- make it say 20 kph slower during drive-thru?