Are drivers exploiting loopholes to gain position?

[Hangaku]

Alonso was unlucky and Hamilton was honest, you can believe this but it is not the first time FIA helps Hamilton and modify the rules once Hamilton has pissed on them.

Compare this to two years ago when Hamilton was having the book thrown at him for every single thing he did? How easily people forget these things when the shoe is on the other foot [-X

[ElTron]

Compare this to two years ago when Hamilton was having the book thrown at him for every single thing he did? How easily people forget these things when the shoe is on the other foot [-X

OK:

2007
GP Nürburgring
Hamilton gets out the track by the rain and he is returned to the track by a crane =D> =D> =D>
GP Monza
Hamilton put the car diagonally across the grid and makes several changes trajectory. No penalty.
GP Japan
Ham stops hardly behind the safety causing Vettel-Webber crash. Without penalty
Gp Brazil
He used 2 rain tyres in the first test day when only 1 ensemble was permitted for the 2 test sessions. 15000 Eur for McLaren and no penalty for him.
2008
2009
He advanced Trulli under the SC and he lied about this. No penalty.
2010
GP Malasia
5 changes of direction to avoid Petrov advanced him. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
GP China
Run in the pit lane parallel to Vettel. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
GP Canada
He get down the car while the car was moving, he pushed it to the control. Fine and no penalty. Again he ran in the pit lane paralle Alonso.
GP Europe
He advances safety car and suffer a drive through without consequences because the penalty arrived too late.

I think that my memory is not so big to remember all the Hamilton times he has pissed over the FIA rules.

[deus1066]

2007
GP Nürburgring
Hamilton gets out the track by the rain and he is returned to the track by a crane =D> =D> =D>
GP Monza
Hamilton put the car diagonally across the grid and makes several changes trajectory. No penalty.
GP Japan
Ham stops hardly behind the safety causing Vettel-Webber crash. Without penalty
Gp Brazil
He used 2 rain tyres in the first test day when only 1 ensemble was permitted for the 2 test sessions. 15000 Eur for McLaren and no penalty for him.
2008
2009
He advanced Trulli under the SC and he lied about this. No penalty.
2010
GP Malasia
5 changes of direction to avoid Petrov advanced him. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
GP China
Run in the pit lane parallel to Vettel. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
GP Canada
He get down the car while the car was moving, he pushed it to the control. Fine and no penalty. Again he ran in the pit lane paralle Alonso.
GP Europe
He advances safety car and suffer a drive through without consequences because the penalty arrived too late.

I think that my memory is not so big to remember all the Hamilton times he has pissed over the FIA rules.

My personal interpretation

2007
GP Nürburgring
Hamilton gets out the track by the rain and he is returned to the track by a crane
I believe at the time this was no breech of the rules (surprisingly), similar to Schumachers car being pushed back on to the track in 2003.
GP Monza
Hamilton put the car diagonally across the grid and makes several changes trajectory. No penalty.
I don't remember this one, so can't comment. I assume you're right. Though a lot of 'dangerous' driving goes unpunished e.g. Schumacher barging Hakinen of the track (almost) in Spa 1999(?) or barging Massa of the track in Montreal this year
GP Japan
Ham stops hardly behind the safety causing Vettel-Webber crash. Without penalty
We've seen this happen many times, e.g. china this year when abrupt stopping behind the SC led to cars taking to the grass at the hairpin to avoid a pile up - again no penalty
Gp Brazil
He used 2 rain tyres in the first test day when only 1 ensemble was permitted for the 2 test sessions. 15000 Eur for McLaren and no penalty for him.
Fair enough, team's error, not his.
2008
Then there was the whole Spa incident... I personally think he didn't deserve the penalty, was side by side going into the final corner, yielded the place back and then re-overtook
2009
He advanced Trulli under the SC and he lied about this. No penalty.
He lost the points and Mclaren receive a suspended 2 year sentence
2010
GP Malasia
5 changes of direction to avoid Petrov advanced him. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
Utilised a loop-hole in the rule as he was not defending the position into an overtaking zone but breaking the tow. The rule has since been clarified
GP China
Run in the pit lane parallel to Vettel. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
We've seen this happen many times over the years, and there has very, very rarely been a penalty. I believe the worst penalty has been a fine to the team. In this case Vettel was not entirely innocent, by giving Hamilton the squeeze into the pit garage side he also got a repremand. I personally think the driver on the pit garage side should have to yield as they're most likley to harm people, catch air lines etc... and usually the one who was released into the path of the other car. In most cases this car yeilds anyway (eventually)
GP Canada
He get down the car while the car was moving, he pushed it to the control. Fine and no penalty. Again he ran in the pit lane paralle Alonso.
I'm not sure I understand your first point, I assume you mean you didn't like him pushing his car back. Again Mclaren were fined and the rule was clarified. With regard the pit incident, again we've seen this happen a lot over the years and its very rarely punished (though it should as its plain dangerous).
GP Europe
He advances safety car and suffer a drive through without consequences because the penalty arrived too late.
This is one is a bit bizarre, he is right to get the penalty but race control messed up on 2 accounts. 1) the safety car should pick up the leader, not the 2nd place man and let the leader disappear off a lap ahead. 2) they should have given the penalty much sooner. Neither of these errors were Hamilton's fault.

I think that my memory is not so big to remember all the Hamilton times he has pissed over the FIA rules.
I would say he's exploited loop holes, and been punished whenever he has broken clear rules. Over the years they've probably evened out. Just my opinion though.

[ElTron]

That's ok.

Hamilton is a champion that exploits loop-holes. This is closely to say: He is a champion but he plays dirty.

Several times McLaren has been fined but he rarely has received any penalties. And now you say, FIA should have given the penalty much sooner but it is not a Hamilton's fault. What a coincidence, isn't it?

[komninosm]

Compare this to two years ago when Hamilton was having the book thrown at him for every single thing he did? How easily people forget these things when the shoe is on the other foot [-X

OK:

2007
GP Nürburgring
Hamilton gets out the track by the rain and he is returned to the track by a crane =D> =D> =D>
GP Monza
Hamilton put the car diagonally across the grid and makes several changes trajectory. No penalty.
GP Japan
Ham stops hardly behind the safety causing Vettel-Webber crash. Without penalty
Gp Brazil
He used 2 rain tyres in the first test day when only 1 ensemble was permitted for the 2 test sessions. 15000 Eur for McLaren and no penalty for him.
2008
2009
He advanced Trulli under the SC and he lied about this. No penalty.
2010
GP Malasia
5 changes of direction to avoid Petrov advanced him. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
GP China
Run in the pit lane parallel to Vettel. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
GP Canada
He get down the car while the car was moving, he pushed it to the control. Fine and no penalty. Again he ran in the pit lane paralle Alonso.
GP Europe
He advances safety car and suffer a drive through without consequences because the penalty arrived too late.

I think that my memory is not so big to remember all the Hamilton times he has pissed over the FIA rules.

Those are some nice tinted glasses you got there... [-X :^o

[komninosm]

That's ok.

Schumacher is a champion that exploits loop-holes. This is closely to say: He is a champion but he plays dirty.

Fixed.

PS: Hamilton won the championship in 2008, the year you had no comments/penalties for him in your rant of a post earlier. So your logic is doubly lacking. :^o [-X

[komninosm]

Another small point regarding the "Hamilton intentionally shafted Alonso" conspiracy theory: if, as the conspiracy theorists imply, Hamilton was in full control of the situation to the point of being able to punish Alonso without suffering himself, would he really have messed up on something as simple as passing the second safety car line in front of the safety car?

Honestly, the idea that Hamilton intentionally screwed over Alonso is completely at odds with the awkward manner in which he incurred his penalty. Also, unlike Alonso, who clearly singles out Hamilton as a championship rival, there's no reason to believe Hamilton sees Alonso any differently to the other drivers in contention. If I had to guess which driver Hamilton was focusing on at that point in the race, it'd be Vettel, not Fernando.

Next thing you know they'll be saying it's payback for when Alonso delayed Hamilton in the pits in that Qualifying session 3 years ago. Oh wait did I just open up another can of worms

[dannyteasdale]

2007
GP Nürburgring
Hamilton gets out the track by the rain and he is returned to the track by a crane =D> =D> =D>
GP Monza
Hamilton put the car diagonally across the grid and makes several changes trajectory. No penalty.
GP Japan
Ham stops hardly behind the safety causing Vettel-Webber crash. Without penalty
Gp Brazil
He used 2 rain tyres in the first test day when only 1 ensemble was permitted for the 2 test sessions. 15000 Eur for McLaren and no penalty for him.
2008
2009
He advanced Trulli under the SC and he lied about this. No penalty.
2010
GP Malasia
5 changes of direction to avoid Petrov advanced him. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
GP China
Run in the pit lane parallel to Vettel. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
GP Canada
He get down the car while the car was moving, he pushed it to the control. Fine and no penalty. Again he ran in the pit lane paralle Alonso.
GP Europe
He advances safety car and suffer a drive through without consequences because the penalty arrived too late.

I think that my memory is not so big to remember all the Hamilton times he has pissed over the FIA rules.

My personal interpretation

2007
GP Nürburgring
Hamilton gets out the track by the rain and he is returned to the track by a crane
I believe at the time this was no breech of the rules (surprisingly), similar to Schumachers car being pushed back on to the track in 2003.
GP Monza
Hamilton put the car diagonally across the grid and makes several changes trajectory. No penalty.
I don't remember this one, so can't comment. I assume you're right. Though a lot of 'dangerous' driving goes unpunished e.g. Schumacher barging Hakinen of the track (almost) in Spa 1999(?) or barging Massa of the track in Montreal this year
GP Japan
Ham stops hardly behind the safety causing Vettel-Webber crash. Without penalty
We've seen this happen many times, e.g. china this year when abrupt stopping behind the SC led to cars taking to the grass at the hairpin to avoid a pile up - again no penalty
Gp Brazil
He used 2 rain tyres in the first test day when only 1 ensemble was permitted for the 2 test sessions. 15000 Eur for McLaren and no penalty for him.
Fair enough, team's error, not his.
2008
Then there was the whole Spa incident... I personally think he didn't deserve the penalty, was side by side going into the final corner, yielded the place back and then re-overtook
2009
He advanced Trulli under the SC and he lied about this. No penalty.
He lost the points and Mclaren receive a suspended 2 year sentence
2010
GP Malasia
5 changes of direction to avoid Petrov advanced him. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
Utilised a loop-hole in the rule as he was not defending the position into an overtaking zone but breaking the tow. The rule has since been clarified
GP China
Run in the pit lane parallel to Vettel. Reprimand by danger driving. No penalty.
We've seen this happen many times over the years, and there has very, very rarely been a penalty. I believe the worst penalty has been a fine to the team. In this case Vettel was not entirely innocent, by giving Hamilton the squeeze into the pit garage side he also got a repremand. I personally think the driver on the pit garage side should have to yield as they're most likley to harm people, catch air lines etc... and usually the one who was released into the path of the other car. In most cases this car yeilds anyway (eventually)
GP Canada
He get down the car while the car was moving, he pushed it to the control. Fine and no penalty. Again he ran in the pit lane paralle Alonso.
I'm not sure I understand your first point, I assume you mean you didn't like him pushing his car back. Again Mclaren were fined and the rule was clarified. With regard the pit incident, again we've seen this happen a lot over the years and its very rarely punished (though it should as its plain dangerous).
GP Europe
He advances safety car and suffer a drive through without consequences because the penalty arrived too late.
This is one is a bit bizarre, he is right to get the penalty but race control messed up on 2 accounts. 1) the safety car should pick up the leader, not the 2nd place man and let the leader disappear off a lap ahead. 2) they should have given the penalty much sooner. Neither of these errors were Hamilton's fault.

I think that my memory is not so big to remember all the Hamilton times he has pissed over the FIA rules.
I would say he's exploited loop holes, and been punished whenever he has broken clear rules. Over the years they've probably evened out. Just my opinion though.

=D>

[Intego]

That's ok.

Schumacher is a champion that exploits loop-holes. This is closely to say: He is a champion but he plays dirty.

Fixed.

So, komninosm, you fake quotes???

Original:

That's ok.

Hamilton is a champion that exploits loop-holes. This is closely to say: He is a champion but he plays dirty.

[myurr]

That's ok.

Schumacher is a champion that exploits loop-holes. This is closely to say: He is a champion but he plays dirty.

Fixed.

So, komninosm, you fake quotes???

He did point out that he'd modified it. Just like I'm now going to point out I've fixed ElTron's quote for him below:

That's ok.

Alonso is a champion that exploits loop-holes. This is closely to say: He is a champion but he plays dirty.

[gridwalker]

But you could also say :

Senna was a champion that exploits loop-holes. This is closely to say: He is a champion but he plays dirty.

It is an attribute that is very common amongst those with enough verve, passion, drive and panache to become WDC ...

[Richard]

Its called racing, enjoy it, or take up knitting.

[dannyteasdale]

I cant believe there is even a thread called this.
Do you honestly think a Driver sits there n a breifing -
Right guys ive found a bit of a flaw in the FIA rule book - If the safety car is coming out the pits I will overtake him, at that time I'll make my best mate Alonso stay behind the safety car so He get peeved.

1. Its ridculous enough but how does the driver make sure hes at the pit exit when its deployed?
2. Its absolute rubbish - Like richard_leeds said - Its racing - Deal with it or take up knitting. Good point by the way - Its definatly my next hobby if I ever fall outta love with F1. haha

Get real

[bean]

I think that my memory is not so big to remember all the Hamilton times he has pissed over the FIA rules.

I agree with you that your memory does not function correctly, but you do try really hard to 'remember' incidents that will feed your Hamilton hatred. =D>

[Just_a_fan]

I don't know whether the drivers are exploiting loopholes to gain advantage but it seems Ferrari did with their testing of the blown diffuser before Valencia.

Lucky for them they tested it whilst Alonso was wearing a helmet camera; that means it's a filming day. Hmmm...

Interestingly, at the end of the film you can watch Alonso do a practice start. The procedure required to get the "not launch control" system set up was shown quite nicely. No doubt all team have similar such "not LC" systems.