Porsche announces possible return to F1

[marcush.]

The TAG project was obviously a customer project as well.
But of course ..if you don´t feel the budget is sufficient for the task...don´t play ... all racers have to learn this...and they should learn quickly as it might be your last mistake....
starting a project is the easy part.
But going into a project glueing up some old bits you happen to have is ... a bit optimistic. the real word for it I decided to forget.
Their Indy adventures where littered with a questionableapproach and expertise as well .The US racers gave them a run for their money and sent them home with not much left of their sails...
I wonder if Porsche is at the forefront of technology at these times....and even aware of the mountain to climb if they want to do such a development in house.
I´m not talking a about engineers there ..the suits can talk long and confident..
but my fear is that current F1 engine suppliers are a considerable amount of steps in front at this time ,so if they plan to do something they would surely need to look at least towards munich to start on a decent level.

[Pup]

I don't think it's worth putting too much weight on their past performance, regardless of how well or poorly they did. We're not talking about Porsche going racing; we're talking about VAG going racing. Their concern is over which stickers to put on the cars in which series.

I'll be interested to see what they decide. I'm sure there are people at Porsche who think their stickers should go on both.

[WhiteBlue]

Have a look at the new 911 GT2 RS. It got all the bells and whistles you need for a 2013 F1 project. Direct injection, variable valve timing and lift, twin turbo with variable vanes and unbelievable efficiency. The engine has unbelievable milage for a 620 hp car. They are building 500 of those and most are actually sold at 230 k€ price tag.

[Pup]

Yup. All they'd have to do is add 30 horsepower, take out 2 liters, lop off a couple of cylinders, trim it down a few pounds, add a pneumatic valve train, double the boost pressure, and then redesign it as a stressed inline 4 - and bingo was his name-o.

[donskar]

Have a look at the new 911 GT2 RS. It got all the bells and whistles you need for a 2013 F1 project. Direct injection [Illegal in F1, right?], variable valve timing [Illegal in F1, right?], and lift, [Illegal in F1, right?], twin turbo with variable vanes and unbelievable efficiency. The engine has unbelievable milage for a 620 hp car. They are building 500 of those and most are actually sold at 230 k€ price tag.

Funny -- but NOT ha-ha -- that my children drive $16K Toyotas with technology banned in F1 . . . . My old 1995 Nissan (bought for $5,000) had VVT -- technology way too far out for the pinnacle of motorsport.

[mx_tifoso]

@ Pup;

Donskar, I would have thought that after all of the times you have brought up that same subject you would have learned why the regulations are the way they are. What is good for a road car is not necessarily good for a race car, the conditions in which they run are completely different. Does an F1 engine run at partial load for most of it's life and idle in traffic? Does it have to meet C02/pollution requirements? Does your corolla rev to 18K rpm? etc.

And by the way, WB mentioned the year 2013, when it is expected that F1 will move to a new powertrain formula. So your points about certain technology currently being banned doesn't really have any relevance to what he was saying does it?

[agungn51]

Something very wrong about the VW Logo in the backdrop. Any reasons Why? (may have been discussed in the past)

http://www.scuderiatororosso.com/cs/Sat ... 2807620404

any connection ?????


http://www.worldcarfans.com/11010012877 ... eo-mueller

http://www.worldcarfans.com/11010012875 ... s-increase

[747heavy]

many things are possible, but on the other hand, there have been strong connections between Red Bull and VW before.
Just think about the prominent sponsoring of the VW Tuareg in the Paris-Dakar etc.
Also AFAIK the STR trailers are pulled by MAN trucks (part owned by VW), and VW has long supplied cars to the Red Bull Racing academy and it´s drivers. (Patrick Friesacher driving an VW Golf R 3.2 company car for example)
So most likely, they are shown on the wall as a "technical partner", if this develops into something more remains to be seen.
At present, I would not read too much into it, but never say never in F1.

[WhiteBlue]

Yup. All they'd have to do is add 30 horsepower, take out 2 liters, lop off a couple of cylinders, trim it down a few pounds, add a pneumatic valve train, double the boost pressure, and then redesign it as a stressed inline 4 - and bingo was his name-o.

So what? Why should that be a problem for a company that has all the necessary technology and all resources? It is a development project with very limited scope. All you do is downsizing, higher turbo charging, designing for shorter life and low weight. Porsche and Audi engineers do such things all the time. Stuck has said that the group can do this essentially in a very short time. It will probably take less time than Ferrari will take. Porsche engineering has 500 employees for customer developments. Porsche has 2300 employees in their own product development. A group with such massive design and development resources should not have a big problem with that task.

[agungn51]

many things are possible, but on the other hand, there have been strong connections between Red Bull and VW before.
Just think about the prominent sponsoring of the VW Tuareg in the Paris-Dakar etc.
Also AFAIK the STR trailers are pulled by MAN trucks (part owned by VW), and VW has long supplied cars to the Red Bull Racing academy and it´s drivers. (Patrick Friesacher driving an VW Golf R 3.2 company car for example)
So most likely, they are shown on the wall as a "technical partner", if this develops into something more remains to be seen.
At present, I would not read too much into it, but never say never in F1.

porsche has 911 GT3 with KERS developed by Williams ...... they are getting closer to F1

http://www.worldcarfans.com/11002112453 ... s-f1-video

[Pandamasque]

VW claimed that they would think of joining the dumbed down Formula 1 awhile back when the whole GRE talk started. So what's the news? I don't understand what all the excitement is all about. The fact that the engines will probably not wear Skoda or Seat stickers?

[xpensive]

Yup. All they'd have to do is add 30 horsepower, take out 2 liters, lop off a couple of cylinders, trim it down a few pounds, add a pneumatic valve train, double the boost pressure, and then redesign it as a stressed inline 4 - and bingo was his name-o.

So what? Why should that be a problem for a company that has all the necessary technology and all resources?
...

...

Twenty years ago they approached F1 with the same very attitude as Mercedes had when entering group C, both with disastrous results, which was only a few years after Porsche had had monumental success in F1 with their 1.5 turbo V6.

Difference was that in 1982 they had to listen to John Barnard, but in 1989 Hans Mezger tried to do it on his own.

[hugobos]

Xpensive,

That is correct.
Tag provided the money, and Mclaren sub-contracted Porsche on a commercial basis for the build of an Engine.
Barnard not only gave outlines, but also had influence on the V angle, the numer of cylinders 6. Mounting of the pumps, The type of Turbo, he had Porsche redesign the placement of the bolt heads, various casings and so on. The work went back and forth between Barnard and a uneasy Mezger. The biggest trick was that Mclaren was the source of money, for the design, prototype and so the production right were in fact Mclarens.
I hope Porsche will come to F1, I think the Mclarens are going to change engines anyway. For a Mclaren engine or who knows a Mclaren Tag Porsche again.

[WhiteBlue]

... I already pointed out that BMW also did it some years ago. They were really successful with their own V10 and V8. They probably used most of their own in house resources and quietly bought some guys with essential know how to compliment their own strength with recent detail from some competitors. No reason why Porsche could not repeat this. There are enough guys from Munich, Viry-Chatillon, Brixworth, Maranello, Cologne and Northampton in the market who have done it recently and probably would not mind to sell their services for a nice salary and job title.

[xpensive]

Xpensive,

That is correct.
Tag provided the money, and Mclaren sub-contracted Porsche on a commercial basis for the build of an Engine.
Barnard not only gave outlines, but also had influence on the V angle, the numer of cylinders 6. Mounting of the pumps, The type of Turbo, he had Porsche redesign the placement of the bolt heads, various casings and so on. The work went back and forth between Barnard and a uneasy Mezger. The biggest trick was that Mclaren was the source of money, for the design, prototype and so the production right were in fact Mclarens.
I hope Porsche will come to F1, I think the Mclarens are going to change engines anyway. For a Mclaren engine or who knows a Mclaren Tag Porsche again.

Welcome to F1T Hugo, I'm sure you will like it here.