Vettel and Webber have secured a perfect result for Red Bull by finishing 1-2 in Japan. The Bulls started from the front row of the grid and were never under threat to secure this finish. Fernando Alonso finished third and keeps his championship hopes up.
zgred wrote:Yes Giblet, we can clearly hear revving up engines which will indicate red but what I am missing is indication of green.
38) STARTING PROCEDURE
38.1 30 minutes before the start of the formation lap the pit exit will be opened and cars will be permitted to
leave the pit lane to cover a reconnaissance lap. At the end of this lap they will stop on the grid in starting
order with their engines stopped.
Should they wish to cover more than one reconnaissance lap, this must be done by driving down the pit
lane at greatly reduced speed between each of the laps.
Any car which does not complete a reconnaissance lap and reach the grid under its own power will not be
permitted to start the race from the grid.
38.2 17 minutes before the start of the formation lap, a warning signal will be given indicating that the end of the
pit lane will be closed in two minutes.
15 minutes before the start of the formation lap the end of the pit lane will be closed and a second warning
signal will be given. Any car which is still in the pit lane can start from the end of the pit lane provided it got
there under its own power. If more than one car is affected they must line up in the order in which they
qualified. However, any car reaching the end of the pit lane after the five minute signal must start behind
any car already at the pit exit.
All such cars may then join the race once the whole field has passed the end of the pit lane for the first
time after the start.
38.3 The approach of the start will be announced by signals shown ten minutes, five minutes, three minutes,
one minute and fifteen seconds before the start of the formation lap, each of which will be accompanied by
an audible warning.
When the ten minute signal is shown, everybody except drivers, officials and team technical staff must
leave the grid.
38.4 When the three minute signal is shown all cars on the grid must have their wheels fitted, after this signal
wheels may only be removed in the pit lane, or on the grid during a race suspension.
A ten second time penalty (see Article 16.3.b) will be imposed on any driver whose car did not have all its
wheels fully fitted at the three minute signal.
38.5 When the one minute signal is shown, engines should be started and all team personnel must leave the
grid by the time the 15 second signal is given taking all equipment with them. If any driver needs
assistance after the 15 second signal he must raise his arm and, when the remainder of the cars able to do
so have left the grid, marshals will be instructed to push the car into the pit lane. In this case, marshals with
yellow flags will stand beside any car (or cars) concerned to warn drivers behind.
38.6 When the green lights are illuminated, the cars will begin the formation lap with the pole position driver
leading.
When leaving the grid all drivers must proceed at a greatly reduced speed until clear of any team
personnel standing beside the track. Marshals will be instructed to push any car (or cars) which remain on
the grid into the pit lane by the fastest route immediately after cars able to do so have left the grid. Any
driver being pushed from the grid may not attempt to start the car and must follow the instructions of the
marshals.
38.7 During the formation lap practice starts are forbidden and the formation must be kept as tight as possible.
38.8 Overtaking during the formation lap is only permitted if a car is delayed and cars behind cannot avoid
passing it without unduly delaying the remainder of the field. In this case, drivers may only overtake to re-
establish the original starting order. Any driver delayed in this way, and who is unable to re-establish the
original starting order before he reaches the first safety car line, must enter the pit lane and start from the
end of the pit lane as specified in Article 38.2.
Any driver who is delayed leaving the grid may not overtake another moving car if he was stationary after
the remainder of the cars had crossed the Line, and must start the race from the back of the grid. If more
than one driver is affected, they must form up at the back of the grid in the order they left to complete the
formation lap. If the Line is not situated in front of pole position, and for the purposes of this Article as well
as Articles 40.14 and 42.6, it will be deemed to be a white line one metre in front of pole position.
Either of the penalties under Articles 16.3a) or b) will be imposed on any driver who, in the opinion of the
Stewards, unnecessarily overtook another car during the formation lap.
38.9 When the cars come back to the grid at the end of the formation lap, they will stop on their respective grid
positions, keeping their engines running.
There will be a standing start, the signal being given by means of lights activated by the permanent starter.
Once all the cars have come to a halt the five second light will appear followed by the four, three, two and
one second lights. At any time after the one second light appears, the race will be started by extinguishing
all red lights.
38.10 Unless specifically authorised by the FIA, during the start of a race the pit wall must be kept free of all
persons with the exception of two people from each team, officials and fire marshals.
38.11 If, after returning to the starting grid at the end of the formation lap a problem arises, the following
procedures shall apply :
a) If a car develops a problem that could endanger the start the driver must immediately raise his hands
above his head and the marshal responsible for that row must immediately wave a yellow flag. If the
race director decides the start should be delayed the green lights will be illuminated two seconds after
the abort lights are switched on, a board saying “EXTRA FORMATION LAP” will be displayed and all
cars able to do so must complete a further formation lap whilst the car which developed the problem
is moved into the pit lane.
The team may then attempt to rectify the problem and, if successful, the car may then start from the
end of the pit lane. Should there be more than one car involved their starting order will be determined
by the order in which they reached the end of the pit lane.
Every time this happens the race will be shortened by one lap.
b) If any other problem arises, and if the race director decides the start should be delayed, the following
procedures shall apply :
1) If the race has not been started, the abort lights will be switched on, a board saying “DELAYED
START” will be displayed, all engines will be stopped and the new formation lap will start five
minutes later with the race distance reduced by one lap. The next signal will be the three minute
signal.
Tyre changing on the grid is not permitted during such a delay.
Every time this happens the race will be shortened by one lap.
2) If the race has been started the marshals alongside the grid will wave their yellow flags to inform
the drivers that a car is stationary on the grid.
3) If, after the start, a car is immobilised on the starting grid, it shall be the duty of the marshals to
push it into the pit lane by the fastest route. Any driver being pushed from the grid may not
attempt to start the car.
4) Once the car is in the pit lane his mechanics may attempt to start it, if successful the driver may
rejoin the race. The driver and mechanics must follow the instructions of the track marshals at
all times during such a procedure.
38.12 Should Article 38.12 apply, the race will nevertheless count for the Championship no matter how often the
procedure is repeated, or how much the race is shortened as a result.
38.13 Either of the penalties under Articles 16.3a) or b) will be imposed for a false start judged using an FIA
supplied transponder which must be fitted to the car as specified.
38.14 Only in the following cases will any variation in the start procedure be allowed :
a) If it starts to rain after the five minute signal but before the race is started and, in the opinion of the
race director teams should be given the opportunity to change tyres, the abort lights will be shown on
the Line and the starting procedure will begin again at the ten minute point.
b) If the start of the race is imminent and, in the opinion of the race director, the volume of water on the
track is such that it cannot be negotiated safely even on wet-weather tyres, the abort lights will be
shown on the Line and information concerning the likely delay will be displayed on the timing
monitors. Once the start time is known at least ten minutes warning will be given.
c) If the race is started behind the safety car, Article 40.14 will apply.
38.15 The stewards may use any video or electronic means to assist them in reaching a decision. The stewards
may overrule judges of fact. A breach of the provisions of the Code or these Sporting Regulations relating
to the starting procedure, may result in the exclusion of the car and driver concerned from the Event.
imightbewrong wrote:From what I can see in the regulation, there is no clear definition of what a false start entails. So I'm not sure it was illegal or not.
http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.ns ... 6-2010.pdf
38.13 Either of the penalties under Articles 16.3a) or b) will be imposed for a false start judged using an FIA
supplied transponder which must be fitted to the car as specified.
16.3 The stewards may impose any one of three penalties on any driver involved in an Incident :
a) A drive-through penalty. The driver must enter the pit lane and re-join the race without stopping ;
b) A ten second time penalty. The driver must enter the pit lane, stop at his pit for at least ten seconds
and then re-join the race.
Yeah, but they don't define what a false start is. Is twitching allowed? And by twitching I mean moving and then fully stopping before doing that actual start. That is not defined. As usual, the regulations are full of holes.chrys wrote:imightbewrong wrote:From what I can see in the regulation, there is no clear definition of what a false start entails. So I'm not sure it was illegal or not.
http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.ns ... 6-2010.pdf
38.13 Either of the penalties under Articles 16.3a) or b) will be imposed for a false start judged using an FIA
supplied transponder which must be fitted to the car as specified.
16.3 The stewards may impose any one of three penalties on any driver involved in an Incident :
a) A drive-through penalty. The driver must enter the pit lane and re-join the race without stopping ;
b) A ten second time penalty. The driver must enter the pit lane, stop at his pit for at least ten seconds
and then re-join the race.
imightbewrong wrote:
Yeah, but they don't define what a false start is. Is twitching allowed? And by twitching I mean moving and then fully stopping before doing that actual start. That is not defined. As usual, the regulations are full of holes.
http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.ns ... 9-trad.pdf94. Penalty for false start
A false start occurs when, before the appropriate signal is
given, a competitor under the starter's orders moves forward from
the prescribed position.
.......
Thanks, that makes it a bit clearer. But I'm still not entirely sure that they have covered twitches, is it considered a start if you stop the car again inside your start box before the light is turned off?chrys wrote:imightbewrong wrote:
Yeah, but they don't define what a false start is. Is twitching allowed? And by twitching I mean moving and then fully stopping before doing that actual start. That is not defined. As usual, the regulations are full of holes.http://argent.fia.com/web/fia-public.ns ... 9-trad.pdf94. Penalty for false start
A false start occurs when, before the appropriate signal is
given, a competitor under the starter's orders moves forward from
the prescribed position.
.......
I have to agree with everything you said, except the part of wanting him to be punished. As far as I understand he did not breach the rules. Furthermore I don't think it had an effect on the outcome of the race, since he came to a full stop before the lights went out.Giblet wrote:I'd like to see him punished simply because I don't think his outright pace has been enough to outweigh his horrible racecraft this season.
However, that jump had no effect on the race, but could have caused a false start, much like american football. When the center huts the ball, the whole team is hinged on that action, if he twitches, half the team crosses the line of scrimmage. If others had jumped because of him, saying "Vettel moved" would hold no water.
But as you said jakeconway (welcome to F1Technical by the way!!) if the system didn't pick it up, and that is the measure of a false start, then it didn't actually happen.
Also, since Massa wasn't punished for a more obvious start line infraction, it would be kind of lame to hit Vettel for something so minor.
