What will come after the 2.4 V8?

[WhiteBlue]

Please excuse my poor attempt at humor.

On more serious note you will find by carefully reading my posts that I have predicted the EWG not to use the GRE concept in its entirety. Quite contrary I have always thought that a 1.6L four cylinder F1 engine is likely to be much lighter than a GRE and could actually use a V4 config.

[010010011010]

You used to be cool man...

No seriously though, it shows much more character to be able to say when your wrong, or lets say, 'unlikely to be correct'.

I was most likely worng about the possibility of hydrogen being used in F1, especially in the way i had suggested (being burnt in an ICE) and I accept that.

In any event, it was a 1.4 liter engine that had been tabled according to pitpass, dont know where they got that from though

[gibells]

No VW.

http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=393109



Could this mean no change in engine configurations?

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

No VW.

http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=393109



Could this mean no change in engine configurations?

Thanks gibells.

Good job I think. VW demanded alot of FIA, and what is good for them is not neccesarily good for F1.

[xpensive]

I might be seriousy mistaken, but my impression is that none of those involved today wanted a change in the first place?

[agip]

So we won't have any new engine manufacturers until...?

[xpensive]

Until the FIA liberates the homologation rules, I believe there must be an incentive for a new player to think outside the box.

I agree that v-angle, cylinder-bore and spacing as well as crank-height are sensible for the sake of interchangeability, but to harness natural developments is plain wrong to my mind.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

The problem with development is cost.

Teams dont want to spend 150 million on RnD for engines anymore.

[Pingguest]

The problem with development is cost.

Teams dont want to spend 150 million on RnD for engines anymore.

Indeed, they want to spend it on other things. Like aerodynamics.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

The problem with development is cost.

Teams dont want to spend 150 million on RnD for engines anymore.

Indeed, they want to spend it on other things. Like aerodynamics.

No, not WANT to spend. NEED to spend
Engine equalisation is a about as good as can be expected. When in F1 has there ever been such parity in the engine departments?
Aero is the last bastian of development freedom, hence why all the cash is being spent there.

[xpensive]

As I said, I can appreciate that a certain engine manufacturer is somewhat hesitant to jump on yet another engine configuration, after developed a 3.5 V12, a 3.0 V12, a 3.0 V10 and then a 2.4 V8, all within twelve years.

But I think opening for developments within the concept should be equal for all, not just for those behind or with compelling "reliability" arguments.

[segedunum]

I'm sure engine manufacturers would like to get more out of their F1 engine programmes than they do now because right now they're of no value to anything else they do. The 'world engine' was artificial bollocks and cost was certainly a big issue, but we need to see some real engine development eventually otherwise the status quo ends up becoming a cost that more importantly isn't going anywhere.

However, there was a certain amount of backside covering and politics with this. The established engine makers and teams, Mercedes in particular, have seen VW come into other racing formulas and get rules changed to their advantage. They would also be beside themselves if VW started supplying McLaren and especially Red Bull with an engine that changed the rules of the game. It's a case of locking in current perceived advantages and making sure no one else can lock in their own later. That's what homologation has given us.

[autogyro]

Further development in ic engines for F1 has little if anywhere to go.
It has all been done before.
For decades any differences between engine manufacturers F1 units has only been artificialy created from the regulation changes.
Aero is getting close to its end as well.
Any engine that comes after the 2.4 V8 will be of no interest unless it is included in a new energy efficient F1 design direction.

[agip]

Renault, Cosworth write to F1 about 2013 engine rules

Renault and Cosworth have written a letter to the FIA as F1 struggles to find agreement over a new engine formula for 2013.

The FIA is pushing hard for turbocharged 4 cylinder engines with exhaust-heat KERS capabilities to replace the current normally-aspirated V8s, and aiming to rubber-stamp the rules at the World Motor Sport Council in December.

Superficially, the engine makers support the sport's 'green' direction but are concerned about initial costs and then a development arms race.

Germany's Auto Motor und Sport reports that the Renault and Cosworth-powered teams last week signed a letter to the FIA pointing out the weaknesses of the proposed new rules.

They want tight limits on things including minimum weights for pistons and conrods and the entire engine unit.

"If the new engine formula becomes an arms race in turbochargers and cylinder heads, then an independent engine manufacturer will have no chance," said Cosworth's Mark Gallagher.

Renault team boss Eric Boullier said the French supplier will support new rules "within certain cost limits".

"Our market in production cars is for four cylinders with a hybrid. For that reason we are not unhappy with that engine format (for F1).

"But it is about how the rules are defined. The less clear they are, the more expensive it becomes," he insisted.

It is hoped that a cost-effective and modern engine formula might entice new suppliers, including the recently departed Honda and Toyota, into F1.

But Ross Brawn, still with contacts within Honda, said: "They're not planning to return."

[autogyro]

Manufacturers are rightly worried. A sensible fuel limited formula will place them in a 'real' development race that will mean something in the real world.
If they get their way and cobble up yet another set of artificial regulations, then IMO the public will lose interest and F1 will fade away.
All they wish to do is to delay progress at the cost of much more efficient and cleaner road vehicles.
Bankers!!! or something similar.