Red Bull Racing sign deal with Infiniti

[horse]

All dealings for resource's are made without factoring in engine costs.

If engine cost were added, Mercedes Renault and Ferrari would be the leading spenders in F1, somthing Markko is very quick to tell the media.

Red Bull will make a significant saving from this move though, right? Also, customer engine costs are capped. This is part of the BBC F1 story:

That will save the team 8m Euros (£6.8m) a year, the cost of all customer engine supplies in Formula 1.

It is not yet clear whether Renault/Nissan will provide further financial support for Red Bull, but even if the deal just provides for free engines it will be a significant boost to the team.

It means that money - estimated to be about 4-5% of their total budget - can be freed up to be spent in other areas, potentially increasing performance.

Lotus Renault are the defacto works team. They will not be worried as I believe Genii capita own the engine department too.

Oh, I didn't know that, thanks. Any thoughts on whether there will be any competition between the Infinity engineers and the Renault (Lotus) engineers?

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

Yes the saving will be from the cost of purchasing engines. BUT, in terms of resource restriction, the money wont be channelled back into developing the car(legally anyway), because engine cost and development has its own set of parameters outside of those of the normal resource restriction agreement.

As far as Im aware the Renault Lotus engineers and the infinty engineers are exactly the same, they are only operating as a name change on the cam covers of the engine. The status quo remains the same.

Same engine
Same engineers
Different badge

Marketing excercise

[Isak]

I'm suprised nobody has brung up the question whether the FIA will see the Infinity-branded renault engine as a completely new engine, thus needing a new homologisation process.

This would allow for a very sneaky way of adding torque to the current Renault engine before homologisating it as Infinity.

If this is the case, hats off, pretty clever. (and i'm by no mean a Red Bull fan)

[gridwalker]

it's said it's nissan's high quality brand, just like toyota have lexus etc... so, american? i really don't think so...

I believe that Lexus was created for the US market because Toyota had a reputation for building low quality cars for the budget consumer : they felt that their brand was not synonymous with the qualities needed for a successful entry into the US luxury car market, so spun off a rebranded subsidiary that could stand on its own merit.

From the opening paragraph of the Infiniti wiki article, this is exactly the same strategy that Nissan took for breaking into the same market : Infiniti started selling in the US before any other country BUT is not sold in Japan, so I would think it reasonable to assume that Infiniti is a US registered corporate subsidiary (though I would need to do some more research to confirm that).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infiniti

Infiniti (Japanese: インフィニティ, Infiniti?) is the premium or luxury division of Japanese automaker Nissan Motors. Infiniti officially started selling vehicles on November 8, 1989 in North America. Marketing operations have since grown to include the Middle East, South Korea, Russia, Taiwan, China, and Ukraine. Infiniti began sales in additional European markets in late 2008. The marketing network for Infiniti-branded vehicles now includes over 230 dealers in over 15 countries.

The marque is not used in Japan and the automaker markets most of equivalent Infiniti models domestically as Nissans: Infiniti G as the Nissan Skyline sedan and coupe, Infiniti M as the Nissan Fuga, Infiniti EX as the Nissan Skyline crossover, and Infiniti Q45 as the Nissan Cima. The Infiniti FX has no Nissan equivalent and is not sold in Japan.

On a personal note, I HATE the branding : every time I type Infiniti, my fingers reach for the Y key and I have to force myself to type that 4th I (shuddering as I do so) ...

[Richard]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infiniti

Infiniti officially started selling vehicles on November 8, 1989 in North America. Marketing operations have since grown to include the Middle East, South Korea, Russia, Taiwan, China, and Ukraine.

That list of countries says a lot about Nissan's view of the N.American car market!

[FW17]

Toyota had a reputation for building low quality cars for the budget market

=D> =D> =D>

I think you should recheck that fact or you meant economy cars.

[gridwalker]

@WilliamsF1 : When Lexus was first launched in the UK, I read a marketing report about the reasons why Toyota decided to create an entirely new brand for that market segment. Apparently their market research had shown that the prodominant impression in the US market at the time was that Toyotas were cheap and poorly built.

That impression may have changed over the last 20 years, but those were certainly the conclusions that were given in the industry press.

Still, I hold all market research at arm's length until I know the testing and sampling methodology (which I will never know in this instance) as any statistician will tell you that a survey is only as good as its sample group ...

I just thought I'd relay the information I had, even if it is impossible for me to provide a source.

[StrFerrari4Ever]

Does that mean the guys who support Red Bull from Renault will have different tops with the Infiniti badges? Like the engine advisor guy who is at Red Bull forgot his name though.

[manchild]

Only two things are infinite, the universe and human stupidity, and I'm not sure about the former. - Albert Einstein

If I was working in Viry, I'd feel like whore instead like proud engineer - giving it to anyone who pays.

[djos]

Lotus Renault are the defacto works team. They will not be worried as I believe Genii capita own the engine department too.

I was under the impression that Renault sold Genii the F1 team but kept the F1 Engine company (Renault Sport F1)?

http://www.renault.com/en/passionsport/ ... nault.aspx

[horse]

Yeah, think you might be right about that. This press release seems to back up that Genii capital don't own Renault engines.

I reiterate the assertion, then, that Red Bull could well become the sole "works" Renault engine team. Renault Sport F1 doesn't need to supply engines to Lotus Renault for the sake of it...

[timbo]

Petronas Engine "program" is really a misnomer since there was no real engine program at all. It was a simple rebadging exercise. Petronas didnot use their own product in those engines either, they used Shell.
it is exactly the same thing with the Infinity and Renault engines. Nothng changes, only the decals (very important) and the badging on the engine.

Not so sure.
At some point they employed Osamu Goto and it was reported they did some mods to Ferrari engines, such as lowering CofG and increasing rpm/power.
Maybe this was just a façade, who knows.

[raymondu999]

Seems like the press have actually bloated what is actually inside the press release for the Infiniti deal. According to Adam Cooper it's actually just a sponsorship deal, and there will be no impact on the name "Red Bull Racing-Renault"

http://adamcooperf1.com/2011/02/28/f1s- ... -red-bull/

[McG]

Seems like the press have actually bloated what is actually inside the press release for the Infiniti deal. According to Adam Cooper it's actually just a sponsorship deal, and there will be no impact on the name "Red Bull Racing-Renault"

http://adamcooperf1.com/2011/02/28/f1s- ... -red-bull/

Yeah I just read something similar on http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport1/hi/motorsp ... 409120.stm

Just another sponsor. For the moment anyway?

[donskar]

So . . . Did Autosport get it all wrong? =
"Japanese car-maker Infiniti is to enter Formula 1 as a major sponsor of the Red Bull Racing team in 2011, although the move will not extend to a rebranding of the outfit's Renault engines."

BTW: "Lexus" = Luxury Export US"