Are the ARW rules fair?

[Ciro Pabón]

Let's give the floor to Rubens Barrichello, who speaks in his condition of GPDA President. Does he (that is, the drivers!) think this is unfair?

"Now it's basically working like the F-duct - you're pressing it every corner and it's becoming a nightmare.

I think it should be used, but in a way that should help promote overtaking.

But people will be tempted to do flat corners with that down. We're going to see crashes going on. That's not the purpose. You're going to gamble.

Last year we had to raise the knee to make [the F-duct] work, and I went through Eau Rouge with one leg, and that's not the purpose. It shouldn't be this way.

With KERS you need to look at the steering wheel to see the number going down to save as much as you want and to use it in the right place. So we're not looking straight ahead all the time.

I don't want to wait for someone to run into another driver for something to be done. Among the drivers, Charlie [Whiting] and Jean Todt, we're talking about it and hopefully we can manage something better."

He also thinks that the system designers can work out these problems.

"I'm all ears. I don't want to put a big thing on how we should sort that out. I have something in my mind. We heard some good ways of solving that."

Oh, surprise. He doesn't think it's unfair.

So, I salute Byronrhys, marcush, raymondu99, feynman, McG and my man JET. They are echoing the drivers. Good symptom.

I propose something: let's watch again Monza 1969 (0.08 seconds, total unfairness as the driver in the back had the advantage of slipstream).

Monza, 1969: AND IT'S ALMOST A DEAD HEAT! ITS JACKIE STEWART, RINDT, BELTOISE, AND MCLAREN! NOBODY HAS EVER SEEN THE FINISH OF A MOTOR RACE LIKE THIS! (sorry for the caps, but Murray was yelling!). I cannot believe my uncle took me to the movies to see this finish (in the old spanish NODO newsreel) and after we saw it we left the theater. Time flies.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cQURylYN13w[/youtube]

This is NOT the closest finish in history (do not believe everything you hear)
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cik0_Aq_ysc[/youtube]

This is it. Unfair? My bollocks. On the contrary, this is racing. Slipstream to the max. I present you Monza 1971.
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bY_sHKRnaeo[/youtube]

Yeah, I'm not finished. This, one of my favorites (tradition, tradition, always tradition!) goes for DaveW. I love it because I saw it on the old Jarama. Those days my favorite was Alan Jones. It was the first time I went to pits and the first time I saw King Juan Carlos in person, I'll never forget this day..
[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NiVyLEM-0wE[/youtube]

[vall]

this thread is a good place for those who say "if he was faster from the guy in front, he should be able to make the pass"

[Ciro Pabón]

... and EVEN for those who say: if the car in the back has the advantage, don't you worry for being overtaken. Now the advantage is YOURS.

[Sean H]

What does fair have to do with racing?

[kalinka]

Ciro, I agree with you, but Rubens meant something else when he worries about it... He likes the opportunity ( me too ), but he's concerned about safety issues ( me too ). These old examples you provided are beatiful, but it's a huge difference now : now you have to push one or two buttons, nad you have to watch some signaling too. Back then you just have to wait for slipstream effect, and the physics is doing all. Either you have slipstream or not,you doesn't have to watch any signal, doesn't have to press any buttons...etc. And you get slipstream at any part of track where you're close enough...and not by any FIA dictate.

[raymondu999]

Not to mention the slipstreaming effect was a part and parcel of the physics of racing. DRS is trying to adjust those physics

[donskar]

Unfair. The trailing car is given a clear aerodynamic advantage. Period.

Is there any other racing series in which a performance variable is allocated to one car but not another? I can not think of one. (Eg: In IndyCar racing, the "push to pass" button is available to all drivers.)

[xpensive]

The entire concept is so bizarre, what's next, install proximity sensors so that as soon as someone behind is close enough, your throttle is automatically off in order to let the guy pass?

[segedunum]

I think we've touched on this on another thread.

While the adjustable wing is fine in my book this is just artificial nonsense because the idiots directing these things couldn't work out how to create enough variables with it. I don't believe you need this nonsense that perhaps predictably is only going to be applied to the start/finish straight.

[kalinka]

+1 , But it's not good even if it would be free to use anywhere, because then one can hit the button accidentally in the middle of the high speed corner. The result would be disastrous. It would be too dangerous to enable it.
But again, even under current rules, who can guarantee that the control electronics is 100% error proof? It could go on anytime around the lap, and activate the wing...
In case of F-Duct it was very hard to close the hole accidentaly, so it was somewhat safer.

[Giblet]

Imagine if last year Alonso won the championship by getting around Petrov and Rosberg in Abu Dhabi.

How would that sit with fans of the world?

For me the wing leaves open too much room for controversy. Even if the wing is fair on paper, it won't viewed that was unless looking at the race as a whole when it is over.

[JohnsonsEvilTwin]

I think its unfair a faster driver can on certain tracks do nothing about a slower car in front of him.

Mull it for a little longer and you see why this rule is, at the very least, a step in the right direction for F1.

[Ciro Pabón]

Imagine if last year Alonso won the championship by getting around Petrov and Rosberg in Abu Dhabi.

How would that sit with fans of the world?
...

It depends. Are we talking of the Spanish world or the British world?

[Giblet]

I think its unfair a faster driver can on certain tracks do nothing about a slower car in front of him.

Mull it for a little longer and you see why this rule is, at the very least, a step in the right direction for F1.

It takes no mulling for me. I don't see the lack of passing as a problem like most others. To me it is not the gauge of a good race.

It's artificial, and unfair to me. My opinions mileage may vary.

@ Ciro - I should have worded it "fans of the sport", which is what I meant. The global average at the end of the day without allegiances.

Even if Alonso had won it with a DRS, the Alonso die hards I am sure would prefer her win it without assistance at the end of the day.

[Just_a_fan]

It takes no mulling for me. I don't see the lack of passing as a problem like most others. To me it is not the gauge of a good race.

It's artificial, and unfair to me. My opinions mileage may vary.

I agree. A lack of passing can be very exciting if you have two drivers dicing with each other corner by. It's the "will he, won't he" that makes it exciting.

I can't help but wonder if those who most want it are those who are only interested in racing for the result (their favourite winning the race and then the title). Those who see racing as being more than just "who finishes first" but also "how did they do it" will find the whole thing will leave a sour taste.

I'll give it the benefit of a trial, of course. If it helps to nullify the close running issue of the current breed of cars so that the good drivers can still shine through, then fine. If it just lets anyone pass anyone else then it will be a waste of time.

This last point is key - the best drivers must always be allowed to shine. The less good must not be helped artificially.

My own view is that we'll see the guys at the front not using the DRS benefit even when it's available in the last few laps. If you're P2 with 3 laps to go then you're better off staying there and having a go on the last lap assuming they set the thing up at the end of the main straight. This might, in effect, have the opposite effect to that desired.