Bernie vs Todt on engine

[Robbobnob]

^ fully agree, i remember seeing a few years back that an entire teams fuel usage for a whole season, including preseason testing was less than an transatlantic air flight. in fact it could have been the whole fields usage but that sounds a bit dubious to me.

Also i dont know if any1 has been watching the Current Rally Season, those new 1.6turbos are plenty noisy, fantastic sound especially on the overrun.... MrE is just stirring the pot on this 1

[WhiteBlue]

1. All of this is already under discussion in other threads like the 2013 engine thread.

And?

Surely the relationship between MrE and MrT with regards to the future engines to be used in F1 deserves a thread of its own? The engine thread is too general and is more about the technical aspects than this latest FIA versus CVC debacle.

That aspect is nicely covered in the thread about the new Concord agreement.

[WhiteBlue]

3. The FiA has the legitimate right to set a framework to the technical rules such as energy consumption. They own the championship. So there should not be a question about the need for more fuel efficient engines by the fans.

It would be quite arrogant of the FIA to impose rules the fans can't relate to. In the end, if they don't please their audience, they'll "own" a championship nobody wants to see. I think the attempts to go green(er) are an effort to relieve the fans' collective conscience about supporting such a fuel gobbling sport.

Your thoughts would be valid if the FiA was the organization of the motor racing fans, but that is not the truth. They represent the global motorists and automobile users in the international political arena. As such they are an important voice in energy, tax and traffic politics. They cannot afford to promote waste in automotive technology. Therefore the self set target by the FiA has long been to reduce fuel consumption of race cars by 50% until 2015. They are only executing their long time targets in a way that is now agreed with the other major stake holders in F1, the teams and engine makers. There will be no significant impact on fan interests from the new engine rules. Fans should not worry about the noise. The new engines will sound good.

[agip]

Answer me this:
Why in the world should any racing series, let alone F1, be concerned about being "green"? I don't understand. It's pure BS.

Because that is what current engine manufacturers consider to enter the sport. Unless you would be happy with just 4 of them as we have now.

[Pandamasque]

2. Bernie kicking up the noise issue again is most likeley a pure tactical move to split FOTA and FiA. It is best disregarded as such. The 2013 engines will be noisy as well. The sound will just be different and that will not do considerable detriment to the sport according to the experts (such as Renault's Rob White).

I disagree. They will be quieter (noticeably if you're at the track), but quite similar in terms of sound texture, albeit lower reving.

I'd rather listen to high-reving NA V6! Renault World Series... by Renault... already sounds nicer than F1, with the move to turbos it'll be louder than F1 too.

[bot6]

If they want to be green, they should say "do whatever you want, but you can only have a tank half the size of the current average one".

That would promote green technology!

[CHT]

^ fully agree, i remember seeing a few years back that an entire teams fuel usage for a whole season, including preseason testing was less than an transatlantic air flight. in fact it could have been the whole fields usage but that sounds a bit dubious to me.

Also i dont know if any1 has been watching the Current Rally Season, those new 1.6turbos are plenty noisy, fantastic sound especially on the overrun.... MrE is just stirring the pot on this 1

F1 being green is totally rubbish because no matter how small or efficient the engine we will still be burning millions of gallons of fuel per season transporting the teams and f1 fans around the world. If you have driven a V8, V10 or V12 road car, you will know that the engine sound characteristic will never be the same when running a 4 cylinders. It will be like comparing the barking sound of a german shepherd to a pomeranian. It might not make much of a difference for fans at home, but definitely will not be the same on track.

Having said that, for the sake of F1 future, i guess FIA will probably have no choice but to do its part in going "green". Oil is about US$130 now, when it hit the US$150 mark, everyone is going to start talking about green again.

[CHT]

If they want to be green, they should say "do whatever you want, but you can only have a tank half the size of the current average one".

That would promote green technology!

totally agree. It will be nice to see how the sports car and road car manufacturer wrestle it out on track.

[mx_tifoso]

Now that I think about it, what else should we expect from an ex-rally driver but turbo four bangers?

I'm just glad that F1 is returning to the US in 2012, and hopefully I will be able to attend and experience the V8's.

[Ashley]

But why don't they choose V6 engines instead of those 4 cyclinders???
Luca Di Motezemolo said that Ferrari would be keen on producing V6 engines.

[Ashley]

Todt wants more manufacturers in F1. But are new manufactures as efficient as established teams like williams, sauber and mclaren.
Maybe he wants a TATA F1 team...

[mx_tifoso]

As for your V6 question, I suggest reading through the technical discussion about the 2013 powertrain regulations:
Formula One 1.6l turbo engine formula as of 2013

[FW17]

Maybe he wants a TATA F1 team...

What is wrong with that?

[Ashley]

I ain't got anything against TATA...
But the problem with new teams is that they usually don't do well.
They are just not the spirit of F1...
Look at Red bull even though it is a very good team, it just kind of misses something. (Just like Jeremy Clarkson of Top gear use to describe some fast cars which miss something).
I don't know if you can understand.
Eccleston should fight to keep established teams like williams, sauber, mclaren, ferrari and renault.

[FW17]

I don't know if you can understand.

I definitely don't understand why TATA engine should not be allowed?

Just like Jeremy Clarkson of Top gear use to describe some fast cars which miss something

Jeremy Clarkson has an opinion on every car so what he says and doesn't say is irrelevant to a car. Top Gear is stand up comedy act with a car theme.