Ferrari's engines: in numbers

[Crucial_Xtreme]

Good riddance! I'm not sorry to see the 150 Italia go. Hopefully 2012 brings a much more competitive Scuderia Ferrari...

[Lorenzo_Bandini]

Alonso said in an interview that at Spain GP, they had to use some spare from the launch car, because of wind tunnel issue. All their updates failed badly on track.

[banibhusan]

I just read in an article that Ferrari ended up earning around $11.5mn more than RBR and around $20mn more than McLaren. These figures may not be accurate, but seems more like a close estimation to what they would be earning.

[timbo]

I just read in an article that Ferrari ended up earning around $11.5mn more than RBR and around $20mn more than McLaren. These figures may not be accurate, but seems more like a close estimation to what they would be earning.

This is not much relevant to the F150 thread. There are some topics in the General Chat section which might be more suitable to discuss this.

[Lorenzo_Bandini]

Ferrari have to build his own engines... While RBR and Mclaren didn't..

[raymondu999]

I'd think that would cancel itself out. McLaren/RBR don't pay for R&D of their engines, but I'm quite sure that Ferrari builds their F1 engines entirely separately (as an entity) from the Scuderia Ferrari racing team. Also, McLaren/RBR would have to pay for their engines - Ferrari gets theirs free.

Vertical integration of business operations, except for exceptional circumstances, would always lead to a net gain.

[DRCorsa]

I'd think that would cancel itself out. McLaren/RBR don't pay for R&D of their engines, but I'm quite sure that Ferrari builds their F1 engines entirely separately (as an entity) from the Scuderia Ferrari racing team. Also, McLaren/RBR would have to pay for their engines - Ferrari gets theirs free.

Vertical integration of business operations, except for exceptional circumstances, would always lead to a net gain.

I don't fully agree.
Design, production, R&D of engines are more expensive than just buying them.
If it was the other way around, we would see McLaren or even RedBull (after hiring the right people) building their own engines. It's a business thing after all.

[Richard]

I'm not sure about your analysis raymond.

The sale of customer engines is limited to £4m a year (link). So if Ferrari supply 2 teams, they'd get £8m external income. That means the break even point is £12m (2 customer teams plus their own team), if they spend more than that then they'd be worse off as a supplier.

You also have to factor in the loss of potential sponsorship, ie the McLaren-Merc deal when the engine supplier pays sponsorship money to the team.

Renault claim they spend E120m and only get E60m from 3 customer teams. http://www.jamesallenonf1.com/2011/11/t ... ing-in-f1/

I see the Cosworth Group's total income was £50m in 2010, and F1 is only a part of that total income. Puts their potential budget in perspective compared to Renault.

[banibhusan]

I was talking about the money that Ferrari got from the Team's prize money fund, which is coming from the total revenues earned by the F1 management. The money that manufacturers earn from customer teams for the engines(or any other technologies) is not included in the calculations.

The total amount that Ferrari got from the fund was around $104.6mn to RBR's $93.1mn. And according to the article, this is because of Ferrari's incredible history and constant participation in Formula1.

[Richard]

That was actually a Bernie bribe to get them to break up the old FISA unanimity. They then got special treatment too.

I thought that had all been phased out by now?

ps this is off topic. better move the discussion over to the proper thread for the Concrd agreement ... viewtopic.php?f=1&t=8738

[banibhusan]

That was actually a Bernie bribe to get them to break up the old FISA unanimity. They then got special treatment too.

I thought that had all been phased out by now?

Not sure about that, coz it happened in the early 80's and I was not even born then.

But first Ferrari gets its hand on 2.5% of the total prize money fund. Then the rest of the money is distributed between the teams in different phases.

[ell66]

I'd think that would cancel itself out. McLaren/RBR don't pay for R&D of their engines, but I'm quite sure that Ferrari builds their F1 engines entirely separately (as an entity) from the Scuderia Ferrari racing team. Also, McLaren/RBR would have to pay for their engines - Ferrari gets theirs free.

Vertical integration of business operations, except for exceptional circumstances, would always lead to a net gain.

pretty sure mclaren get there engines free atm, also a well known fact i thought that ferrari got more money.