The hiring of Susie Wolff to Williams

[Jersey Tom]

I still think the premise of this thread is... let's call it silly.

Some points to consider:
1. As stated, it's not just about driving talent. Not by a long shot. In the case of Danica, she's an immense asset to a team just in bringing in sponsors. Sponsors = money. Money = more development. More development = more success.

2. Just because someone is the very best race driver, does not necessarily make them a good test driver. Let that sink in. And the corollary, you don't need to be Michael Schumacher to be a big asset to a team for development. In some ways it is a very different skill set.

3. Married to a Williams investor, did I read? Ok. So what? What bearing does that have on anything? If you fit the job description and do what's needed - that's all there is to it.

4. Still may have potential as a race driver anyway.

To assume that Susie was brought on SOLELY because of some tie in with an investor, and/or that because she's a woman she's incapable of getting the job done... is childish and naive. THAT is what's disgraceful.

[Websta]

Guys, it's just a coincidence that her husband is on the board of directors of the team which hired her!

[Jersey Tom]

I just don't see why it makes a difference. If she does what's requested and needed... that's all there is to it. Who cares?

Just irks me when folks make a big fuss over dumb crap.

[Websta]

Yeah, the original poster calling it a disgrace to F1 was quite over the top.

[wesley123]

Be careful with those stats. From wiki:

In 2006 .... achieved 6 wins out of the 2004-spec cars.

She led her class in 6 races out of 10, but got no points. Of course I don't know how many people were in her class

I know that. And how many teams drove the 2004 car? I suspect max 6 drivers. Now you're celebrating that she was the best of the worst, that still isnt good, that is like giving Caterham a huge throphy as they were 'best of the worst too'.

And a few other things. In her entire career she has yet to win a single race(karting excluded), the likes of Karthikeyan at least won a race in their career.

We are not calling her a disgrace because she is a woman, no we calling her a disgrace because the only reason she is test driver at Williams is because her husband is shareholder there. You honestly think she would have been signed if her husband wasnt shareholder at williams?

[Racer_D]

I still think the premise of this thread is... let's call it silly.

Silly eh?

1. As stated, it's not just about driving talent. Not by a long shot. In the case of Danica, she's an immense asset to a team just in bringing in sponsors. Sponsors = money. Money = more development. More development = more success.

Sure. But Danica has actually achieved stuff in her racing career. Susie Stoddart? Meh.

2. Just because someone is the very best race driver, does not necessarily make them a good test driver. Let that sink in. And the corollary, you don't need to be Michael Schumacher to be a big asset to a team for development. In some ways it is a very different skill set.

I'd say you need to be able to take a car to the limit. If you take a car to the limit, you achieve stuff in your career. Name me one test driver for succesful F1 teams that have not achieved winning races or even championships.

3. Married to a Williams investor, did I read? Ok. So what? What bearing does that have on anything? If you fit the job description and do what's needed - that's all there is to it.

Now that is a silly remark.
Out of all drivers available on the market, this not-even-mediocre one was chosen. Are we talking F1 here?

4. Still may have potential as a race driver anyway.

Maybe she just needs another decade to show that potential? Because in the previous one she couldn't.

To assume that Susie was brought on SOLELY because of some tie in with an investor, and/or that because she's a woman she's incapable of getting the job done... is childish and naive. THAT is what's disgraceful.

This would be another discussion but on average women can't do in sports what men do. Women athletes don't run as fast, women tennisers never hit as hard etc. So unless there's a female F1 championship, I think - based on historical facts - that women on average won't cut it in F1 as it is now. But Danica seems to hold her ground, maybe others will too.

Nevertheless, it seems you actually agree it would be a disgrace that if Susie was brought on SOLELY because of a tie-in with an investor.

[kris]

I'd say you need to be able to take a car to the limit. If you take a car to the limit, you achieve stuff in your career. Name me one test driver for succesful F1 teams that have not achieved winning races or even championships.

Wouldn't Luca Badoer (ferrari's longest serving F1 test driver) qualify as one (If we ignore his F3000 results)

For comparison when Luca finished first in 1992 in F3000, barrichelo was 3rd and DC 9th. We remember how each of their F1 carrrers spanned out. So much for comparison between drivers and their performance in other series.

[raymondu999]

I think as a test driver you either need to be sensitive; or consistent. If you're dead consistent; then the engineers will know that any improvement in laptime was the upgrade and not you. This was often said of Kimi back in his McLaren days. Otherwise, you could be sensitive; and tell the team, "oh the car is lacking stability in the slow speed," or "it's washing out into Turn 3" or whatever.

[Racer_D]

Wouldn't Luca Badoer (ferrari's longest serving F1 test driver) qualify as one (If we ignore his F3000 results)

For comparison when Luca finished first in 1992 in F3000, barrichelo was 3rd and DC 9th. We remember how each of their F1 carrrers spanned out. So much for comparison between drivers and their performance in other series.

I actually had Luca in mind when I wrote that. Luca Badoer is a rather good driver, I'd say. Why ignore F3000 or F3 results? He actually won a strong championship against good drivers.
De La Rosa, Marc Gene etc. They all won stuff, proving that they can go fast (which you need to do if you want to help develop a fast race car).
More than you can say of Susie. Her ability is limited to wearing the right ring around her finger.

[Websta]

I'd say you need to be able to take a car to the limit. If you take a car to the limit, you achieve stuff in your career. Name me one test driver for succesful F1 teams that have not achieved winning races or even championships.

Wouldn't Luca Badoer (ferrari's longest serving F1 test driver) qualify as one (If we ignore his F3000 results)

For comparison when Luca finished first in 1992 in F3000, barrichelo was 3rd and DC 9th. We remember how each of their F1 carrrers spanned out. So much for comparison between drivers and their performance in other series.

He won the Italian karting championship and won many races in Italian Formula 3 (before being disqualified on a technicality), then walked away with the International F3000 title beating many other future F1 drivers, then competed in 50 F1 races, outpacing many of his team mates. If we forget all that, then yeah he hasn't achieved much in his racing career and Ferrari shouldn't have recruited him.

[Lycoming]

F1 is not that physical of a sport. You need to be very fit, yes, but being more fit than somebody who can easily handle a grand prix distance does not give you much of an advantage. F1 is not like other sports. I don't think thats a legitimate reason to say women can't cut it in F1.

kris, I think he's referring to people who have won something at some point in their careers prior to F1; ie. Rosberg, who was GP2 champion, etc.

As to the rest of the thread, the situation is what it is. To call it a disgrace and go on an such an impassioned tirade is a bit heavy handed. So she hasn't won any big championships or whatever; big whoop.

Besides, I've seen worse. Much, much worse than 2 points finishes in DTM and a handful of podiums in formula renault. Ever heard of Chanoch Nissany?

[bhall]

Silly eh?

Sure. But Danica has actually achieved stuff in her racing career. Susie Stoddart? Meh.

I'd say you need to be able to take a car to the limit. If you take a car to the limit, you achieve stuff in your career. Name me one test driver for succesful F1 teams that have not achieved winning races or even championships.

Now that is a silly remark.
Out of all drivers available on the market, this not-even-mediocre one was chosen. Are we talking F1 here?

Maybe she just needs another decade to show that potential? Because in the previous one she couldn't.

This would be another discussion but on average women can't do in sports what men do. Women athletes don't run as fast, women tennisers never hit as hard etc. So unless there's a female F1 championship, I think - based on historical facts - that women on average won't cut it in F1 as it is now. But Danica seems to hold her ground, maybe others will too.

Nevertheless, it seems you actually agree it would be a disgrace that if Susie was brought on SOLELY because of a tie-in with an investor.

Most of these points have already been addressed.

The logic applied with these statements simply does not hold water.

For those interested in the male vs female relationship to racing, I suggest this. (That was a fun discussion.)

[Racer_D]

Besides, I've seen worse. Much, much worse than 2 points finishes in DTM and a handful of podiums in formula renault. Ever heard of Chanoch Nissany?

Yeah I have. That wasn't pretty either - but this was Minardi though. You could expect things like that from Minardi. They also had Lavaggi as a driver back in the 90s.
Now Williams is doing it, and it's actually doing it in a worse way. Nissany wasn't married to a board member.
As someone said, it shows the decline of Williams.

[kris]

Wouldn't Luca Badoer (ferrari's longest serving F1 test driver) qualify as one (If we ignore his F3000 results)

For comparison when Luca finished first in 1992 in F3000, barrichelo was 3rd and DC 9th. We remember how each of their F1 carrrers spanned out. So much for comparison between drivers and their performance in other series.

I actually had Luca in mind when I wrote that. Luca Badoer is a rather good driver, I'd say. Why ignore F3000 or F3 results? He actually won a strong championship against good drivers.
De La Rosa, Marc Gene etc. They all won stuff, proving that they can go fast (which you need to do if you want to help develop a fast race car).
More than you can say of Susie. Her ability is limited to wearing the right ring around her finger.

I understand what you are trying to say, but all of the drivers you mention are in the same league, outstanding in one mediocre in another.

So unless you put a driver in the car one really doesn't know how good/bad one is.

Giving the benefit of the doubt to williams team, they probably wouldn't have gone into a management meeting saying the Boss's wife want to race, let us give her a chance. I believe they would have discussed more names than one, and tried to find a candidate they thought would be the best or one they could afford.

Or probably they do not want to replace their current drivers in the next 1-2 years. So, why cant they just go with her in the new drivers race to test how good or bad she is and test their car as mercedes did last year.

If she turns out good, good luck else thanks for trying (and we get a new/upgraded simulator for free ).

[Racer_D]

I understand what you are trying to say, but all of the drivers you mention are in the same league, outstanding in one mediocre in another.

You sure have the right to an opinion there but to call Badoer, De La Rosa and Gene mediocre... wow

So unless you put a driver in the car one really doesn't know how good/bad one is.

Actually you can.
Why waste precious track testing time, of which they have so little, on the board member's wife?