How much power was Vettel missing in brazil?

[Formula one fan]

Anyone know or care to guess how much power his engine lost from first lap wreck that damaged his exhaust in brazil??

[raymondu999]

Are you talking direct power loss - ie loss of power due to the creased piping, or the effective loss - ie that loss, added to the loss effected by him needing to turn the engine down?

[PlatinumZealot]

Anyone know or care to guess how much power his engine lost from first lap wreck that damaged his exhaust in brazil??

With rain it is not so much through the turns. BEcause usually the engine is turned down in rain. However on the straight he could have lost up to 30 hp. The exhaust was not blocked but you could see a big dent at the end of the pipe.

Very likely Loss of downforce hurt him more.

[raymondu999]

With rain it is not so much through the turns. BEcause usually the engine is turned down in rain. However on the straight he could have lost up to 30 hp. The exhaust was not blocked but you could see a big dent at the end of the pipe.

Very likely Loss of downforce hurt him more.

Yes - but he's not asking how much it hurt Vettel. He's just asking, with that damaged exhaust, how much power did Vettel lose? It was a simple engine question, not an aero question.

[WhiteBlue]

The answer would be: Not much. His performance in the dry suffered for two reasons.
1. his rear tyres were over heating due to the damage
2. his aerodynamics were not working correctly
So his real piece of luck was the turn of the weather. In the dry Alonso had become champion, of that I'm convinced. When it started to rain the damaged RB8 became much more competitive, which sealed the WDC for Vettel.

[CHT]

The answer would be: Not much. His performance in the dry suffered for two reasons.
1. his rear tyres were over heating due to the damage
2. his aerodynamics were not working correctly
So his real piece of luck was the turn of the weather. In the dry Alonso had become champion, of that I'm convinced. When it started to rain the damaged RB8 became much more competitive, which sealed the WDC for Vettel.

I thought the wet weather didnt really help Alonso too. under dry weather condition, I think Vettel will struggle to recover from the back. Under dry condition, Vettel will most likely suffer over heating issue.

Having said that, its glad that the new alternator is actually trouble free.

[snoop1050]

I thought the wet weather didnt really help Alonso too. under dry weather condition, I think Vettel will struggle to recover from the back. Under dry condition, Vettel will most likely suffer over heating issue.

Having said that, its glad that the new alternator is actually trouble free.

The ferrari did well in every wet session and race, there were races where ferrari had no pace but in the wet they always did well

[raymondu999]

snoop - the point is not about how much the wet helps Ferrari, it's about how much it helps Alonso vs how much it helps Vettel. If the Ferrari becomes more competitive, but Vettel becomes dominant, then it's useless.

[WhiteBlue]

Yeah, this was a particular situation that was brought up by the OP. It has no relevance to other races. You simply had to watch live timing to immediately realize that Vettel was doomed had the dry weather continued. The race had all elements of a classic Brazil finale on par with Reikkönen's and Hamilton's championship finals.

[mbvinnie]

Yeah, this was a particular situation that was brought up by the OP. It has no relevance to other races. You simply had to watch live timing to immediately realize that Vettel was doomed had the dry weather continued. The race had all elements of a classic Brazil finale on par with Reikkönen's and Hamilton's championship finals.

How was VET doomed if the dry weather continued? Surely he was in a decent position?
Or am I remembering it wrong?

VET was comfortably in 6th when it was still dry, ALO was in 4th and a decent amount behind the top 3.
VET also had teammate WEB behind him.

With ALO in 4th, the championship for VET was safe. ALO wasn't gaining on the leaders until HUL/HAM had the coming together, and that happened only when it started to rain and HUL started catching HAM.

VET needed to make a pitstop for new slicks, but weren't the others also starting to struggle on tyres?
And even if VET needed a pitstop and the others didn't, he only needed 9th if ALO somehow got up to 3rd, and it didn't matter where he finished if ALO remained 4th.

The crash between HUL and HAM (once it started raining) is what really put the championship in danger, not the dry weather continuing.

[strad]

On topic...
It looked slightly larger than a golf ball..it was confined to the larger collector...I doubt it cost 30,,probably more like 10-15 HP I'd think...more than HP I suggest it may have altered the torque curve on that side of the engine,,Probably lost more top end than mid range don't ya think?

[jamsbong]

I can think of lower rev limit and weaker torque curve. But I do not have the exact numbers, my best guess would be 100hp off.
The weaker torque curve is probably what everyone was using during the wet part of the race. So in terms of Vettel's disadvantage, it is only his broken aero bits that hurt him.

Newey said the bad aero damaged the tire life. I think it is to do with lack of balance.

When it was dry, others could use high power setting which Vettel was not able to. Thus, he was slow. Luckily that didn't stayed long.

So in the end, it could have been worse if it was a dry race. But then will he had crashed if it was dry?? These are the what ifs which I think is pointless. The only thing I was able to see from the race is that Vettel drove magnificently and he thoroughly belonged to the greats.

[the user]

Yeah, this was a particular situation that was brought up by the OP. It has no relevance to other races. You simply had to watch live timing to immediately realize that Vettel was doomed had the dry weather continued. The race had all elements of a classic Brazil finale on par with Reikkönen's and Hamilton's championship finals.

How was VET doomed if the dry weather continued? Surely he was in a decent position?
Or am I remembering it wrong?

Because maybe the rain helped to cool the exhaust and prevent it from cracking. If it had cracked, the bodywork would have probably caught fire resulting in retirement from the race. Also, the floor was badly messed up which badly affected aero performance. I guess this was masked by the wet weather conditions.

[aral]

Yeah, this was a particular situation that was brought up by the OP. It has no relevance to other races. You simply had to watch live timing to immediately realize that Vettel was doomed had the dry weather continued. The race had all elements of a classic Brazil finale on par with Reikkönen's and Hamilton's championship finals.

How was VET doomed if the dry weather continued? Surely he was in a decent position?
Or am I remembering it wrong?

Because maybe the rain helped to cool the exhaust and prevent it from cracking. If it had cracked, the bodywork would have probably caught fire resulting in retirement from the race. Also, the floor was badly messed up which badly affected aero performance. I guess this was masked by the wet weather conditions.

I seriously doubt that rain could have cooled the exhaust. It is air that cools it, and the exhaust, damaged or not, would not be exposed to rain, particularly at 200mph!

[turbof1]

I seriously doubt that rain could have cooled the exhaust. It is air that cools it, and the exhaust, damaged or not, would not be exposed to rain, particularly at 200mph!

It wasn't so much the rain itself, but due the spray. That spray flows along the airflow and that does comes along the exhaust.