Rapid Brake Bias Adjuster

[hardingfv32]

o.k. Brian let's see if we can salvage something from this thread

You are not going to get far using your present understanding of my statements. I think something is clear and you don't. No one is at fault. I do not understand your consternation over these miss understandings or the fact that I add details to the parameters when I detect their need. If you need a more specific specification at the beginning, I will be happy to work with you on it.

1) "Some others commented about some of the details of the Ferrari system, mentioned during Spygate."

What due these details have to do with a rapid brake bias adjuster? I am sorry, your discussion, while interesting, was off point. Was I being rude to keep the thread on point?

2) "Now, this point is perhaps open to debate, but I accept that you were mainly interested in mechanical solution which only alters the balance bar setting, or the effects this has on brake bias ( discrete change from one fixed ratio to another) , but this has perhaps nothing to do with the systems, that are in use in F1, unless you can show photos or mentioning of such a specific system."

It is commonly stated that the F1 driver's hand movement of a level at the side of the cockpit is for 'rapid brake bias adjustment'. I have no facts confirming this, so yes, your are free to doubt purpose of the lever and driver's hand motion.

3) ".... Losing 'part of the force coming from the pedal' is not acceptable with the forces required to stop a F1 car.
This is not acceptable to F1 designers or in my personal applications...."

I base this statement on details of F1 brake systems that we are aware of: Why the concern over the caliper's strength? Why Ferrari's use of dual stage master cylinders? I think those both are an indication of the requirement for high efficiency in F1 brake systems.

4) I have had a bias towards a solution located at the tradition bar locating. The rare views of the lever mechanisms I have seen seemed to show a simple lever similar to a sway bar adjustment, but your drawing of a dual adjustment at the lever location could very well be the solution. In the below photo you can almost make out the the fine adjustment knob that you propose. Thanks for hanging in.



Brian

[Jersey Tom]

So. What more is left to answer here?

[gixxer_drew]

You wouldn't happen to have a higher res version? It's too low for me to read some of the characters.

[flynfrog]

[gato azul]

sorry for another off topic post, but it´s not worth starting a new thread.

[riff_raff]

With the effect of a typical F/R brake bias balance bar, you need to consider the entire hydrostatic conditions within the brake system. The P/A relationship between the master cylinders and caliper pistons is important.

[gato azul]

1) "Some others commented about some of the details of the Ferrari system, mentioned during Spygate."

What due these details have to do with a rapid brake bias adjuster? I am sorry, your discussion, while interesting, was off point. Was I being rude to keep the thread on point?

It's just another posible way to change the BRAKE BIAS, you may don't like it, that's fine, but it was not "off topic" in relation to your thread title.

I accept, that you only wanted to discuss a very narrow and specific application, therefore I proposed to change the title of the thread and have ask you early on, nicely, what your definition of "BRAKE BIAS" is.
BRAKE BIAS, for a lot of people, is more then just "BALANCE BAR POSITION".
Yes balance bar position will change Brake Bias (as in the brake line pressure ratio front vs. rear), but there are many other solutions to achieve this too, and all can be considered "Brake Bias Adjuster´s"

Your style to ask questions and respond to other posters seems to be fine & accepted around here - so never mind, I´m sure it will encourage more people to come out an try to help you.

Based on the info of the document Piast9 linked, I just showed, what varying the delay of rear pressure build up, would do to brake bias.
You may not like it, you may thing it's wrong or not useful, but as you can see via the thick green,blue & orange lines and the scale on the right, BRAKE BIAS does change if you change the gap before the rear axle pressure starts to build up
(the graphic below is showing 3 possible positions = different gaps before engagement, and by how much brake bias would change due to this) - that was the whole point.



BTW, another possible way to do what you want to do, move the balance bar at two different speeds, could also be achieved by using a epicyclic gearbox to drive the one balance bar shaft from two inputs.
But as this is autogyros field of expertise, I will leave it to him, explaining the details.