Tech. regs. changes for 2008 (summary)

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modbaraban
modbaraban
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kimi wrote:yeah.They certainly need to change the whole gear set before Canada.And I guess in Monaco the engineers will go for a shorter power band as compared to Canada,due to the top speed range in the two tracks vary a lot.
timbo wrote:What "only gears can be changed" means? Counting wheels? So they can change gear ratios, then.
modbaraban wrote:
f1technical.net wrote:the gearboxes will be sealed by the FIA. Only the gears can be changed and the replacement parts must be identical. In addition, the teams will have to prove that these have been damaged to be able to put in new ones.
New gearbox challenge in 2008

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megz
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Joined: 14 Mar 2007, 09:57
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So each team will hire Nigel Stepney and he'll sprinkle a pinch of sand in each teams gearbox?

Belatti
Belatti
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Whats wrong with you people? Don´t you understand? Please read well my post, again.

I made those assumptions supposing that GEAR RATIOS CAN´T BE CHANGED FROM RACE TO RACE.

If that happens, 4 races gearbox must be setup and there is a compromise there. Of course, maybe you will have to sacrice acceleration in one track to perform better in the other 3 tracks.

Its like tyre selection in Rally, you have 5km in gravel and 13km in asphalt, so, what tyre construction and compound will you choose??
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modbaraban
modbaraban
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2 Belatti

I got your point :wink: It's just some people countiue discussing the possibility to replace the gears as if that would change the ratios, though I marked the word "identical" :?

Jersey Tom
Jersey Tom
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Interesting stuff.

I like TC going away. I like slicks. With almost 1000bhp/ton throttle control is a big deal even with a little more mechanical grip.

Getting rid of tire warmers I'm not sure on. Going out on cold tires really sucks. But it could make things interesting with pit strategy, and how you drive on your outlap with how the fronts and rears come in. Could be particularly interesting on drying tracks.

Mass distribution I could see changing a bit, same with roll stiffness distribution, suspension design, etc. But all those are based off specific tire properties, none of which we have insight to. With more tendency for the car to "step out" with cold tires and lack of TC I could see the radius of gyration and some other things being changed to make the yaw response a little more damped or controllable.

Keel layout.. eh. Changes your kinematic suspension rates a bit, but I don't think its a huge deal.
Grip is a four letter word. All opinions are my own and not those of current or previous employers.

scarbs
scarbs
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Joined: 08 Oct 2003, 09:47

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Teams CAN switch ratio's in two situations

1) Between races for more suitable but not identical ratios

2) During a race weekend if the ratios are damaged and the failures are not repeated frequently

Dont forget the single ECU will affect corner entry stability more than Tc on the exit will. Cars will no doubt be struggling on the way into corners, something for which they cannot control.

bizadfar
bizadfar
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Joined: 03 Jan 2007, 15:51

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scarbs wrote:Teams CAN switch ratio's in two situations

1) Between races for more suitable but not identical ratios

2) During a race weekend if the ratios are damaged and the failures are not repeated frequently

Dont forget the single ECU will affect corner entry stability more than Tc on the exit will. Cars will no doubt be struggling on the way into corners, something for which they cannot control.
You can definitely control that with a combination of braking technique and mechanical setup.

A bit confused here on the gear ratios, So I"ll just wait and see what happens I guess. Keeping the same ratios and forced to replace identical ones sounds absurd to me. Not a surprise with the rule implementation of the FIA.

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checkered
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scarbs wrote:Dont forget the single ECU will affect corner entry stability more than Tc on the exit will.
bizadfar wrote:You can definitely control that with a combination of braking technique and mechanical setup.
Bizadfar, I think braking

technique and mechanical setup are a bit beside the point considering what's been lost. TC is a bit of a misnomer given what was achieved with the combination of components, software and functions; it became an integral way of consciously controlling the car in its entirety. Sam Michael indicated a while ago that if you divided the effects of losing TC between traction and controlled braking, the ratio would be around 40/60.

Since engine braking as such will not go anywhere, the driver will have to be much more conscious of the engine's torque curve. I'll be interested to see whether it'll become common practice for the drivers to blip the throttle in hard braking points as the rear begins to feel lively/restless. I could be wrong about this, but I believe teams began to seriously apply TC controlled engine braking around 2002-03 after which most cars have been remarkably stable in deceleration. Of course the car needs to be controllable in 2008 too, otherwise the races would be short lived, but I don't think merely modulating the pressure applied on the brake pedal in a specific way can compensate for TC to the same effect. But the teams will devote some time investigating what might achieve that.

The "spygate" shed light on mechanically variable dynamic DF corresponding brake bias devices, those will help somewhat. And no doubt Ferrari's and McLaren's principle will be copied sooner rather than later all around, if not even improved on. I didn't think I'd be saying this so soon, but I miss TC already. There, it's out in the open. I have a suspicion that the "ban" has much more to do with the unidimensional economising drive and pandering to an imaginary popular will, rather than the technological, skills or racing quality of F1. I know there are differences of opinion about this, but I don't see TC as taking anything away from the driver.

In 2000, an automotine engineer by the delightful name of William ("Bill") Shoebotham from the U.S of A wrote a piece about the prospect of traction control in Formula One. If you care to read Comprehensive Traction Control in F1 (link), I believe you'll find his insight and perception of the future, as it was in 2007 or so, pretty much spot on.

bizadfar
bizadfar
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Joined: 03 Jan 2007, 15:51

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watch nick heidfield onboard (look for the tv overlays).

The driver's will manage, as I said with technique as well as setup.

It's not like we are going to see cars going in backwards or with the rear stepping out turning in to a corner every 2nd corner.

scarbs
scarbs
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You can definitely control that with a combination of braking technique and mechanical setup.
I think we will all remember how Villenueve struggled with the Saubers Ferrari-inspired control systems on corner entry. Its not somethign you can drive around. Its down to the teams to make the engien and chassis easier to cope with. I have spoken to the teams TDs and they agree the loss of diff and engine overun control on corner entry is a greater loss than TC on corner exit. theres a lot more Engine\chassis management going on than most of us realise.