Hmmm. Yet they were able to perform from well to outstandingly off the line at the start. Which should also be an indication about how the mechanical grip level is.Wazari wrote: Yes, you are correct. Two cars starting from a standstill can have different grip (traction) levels with the same tires. There is no DF at that point but suspension geometry and car rake play an important role in grip levels.
I wasn't specifically speaking about McLaren. Maybe poor wording or example on my part. I was just trying to say that two cars with the same DF don't necessarily have the same grip/traction or aero efficiency. Straight line grip where L to R weight distribution is relatively equal and static is not as difficult as in turns/corners where L to R weight distribution is constantly shifting and poses more challenges.Abarth wrote:Hmmm. Yet they were able to perform from well to outstandingly off the line at the start. Which should also be an indication about how the mechanical grip level is.Wazari wrote: Yes, you are correct. Two cars starting from a standstill can have different grip (traction) levels with the same tires. There is no DF at that point but suspension geometry and car rake play an important role in grip levels.
I'm still a bit confused.
Thanks for your contribution in this thread so far. You're very generous. Can you shed any light on if Mclaren made any progress on the suspension this year, either in developing new items or in general learning and understanding of the problem?Wazari wrote:I wasn't specifically speaking about McLaren. Maybe poor wording or example on my part. I was just trying to say that two cars with the same DF don't necessarily have the same grip/traction or aero efficiency. Straight line grip where L to R weight distribution is relatively equal and static is not as difficult as in turns/corners where L to R weight distribution is constantly shifting and poses more challenges.
#aerogollumturbof1 wrote: YOU SHALL NOT......STALLLLL!!!
ringo wrote:Its disappointing though, because mclaren always has the most sensors and gimmicks on their car during testing, and yet they weren't able to notice during the pirelli testing how bad a car they were going to make for those tyres.
Wazari wrote:To make changes to the basic suspension design is virtually impossible once the car is built. This would require at least 3 to 6 months lead time to implement changes to the chassis.
season is 8 months. so its not time. and if i get ringo right he did not mean only 2016 anyway.Andres125sx wrote:ringo wrote:Its disappointing though, because mclaren always has the most sensors and gimmicks on their car during testing, and yet they weren't able to notice during the pirelli testing how bad a car they were going to make for those tyres.Wazari wrote:To make changes to the basic suspension design is virtually impossible once the car is built. This would require at least 3 to 6 months lead time to implement changes to the chassis.
McLaren has hired an engineer from Mercedes that is an expert in this area but then Mercedes made counter in effort to keep this engineer.ClarkBT11 wrote:Does McLaren have adjustable rear suspension points like Mercedes have or does anyone think that will be something McLaren and other teams might adopt next season?
I'd seriously doubt that any of the teams are regularly adjusting their suspension geometry throughout the season. Firstly because you don't stand to gain very much and secondly because it's a ridiculous amount of work because changing one thing changes everything else. Not least the aero.mclaren111 wrote:McLaren has hired an engineer from Mercedes that is an expert in this area but then Mercedes made counter in effort to keep this engineer.ClarkBT11 wrote:Does McLaren have adjustable rear suspension points like Mercedes have or does anyone think that will be something McLaren and other teams might adopt next season?
I read in an article that legal actions are underway regarding McLaren's contract with this engineer.
Thus, it seems they will have it next year. Hope they find alternative expert / engineer soon !!!
They know what their setup is before they get to the track of their simulators. If you don't need to adjust the suspension why have the option to do so. I know gaining will always mean your loosing on other handling charistics but say one track is bumpy you can change the caster. Why would you not have different settings for different tracks?Muulka wrote:I'd seriously doubt that any of the teams are regularly adjusting their suspension geometry throughout the season. Firstly because you don't stand to gain very much and secondly because it's a ridiculous amount of work because changing one thing changes everything else. Not least the aero.mclaren111 wrote:McLaren has hired an engineer from Mercedes that is an expert in this area but then Mercedes made counter in effort to keep this engineer.ClarkBT11 wrote:Does McLaren have adjustable rear suspension points like Mercedes have or does anyone think that will be something McLaren and other teams might adopt next season?
I read in an article that legal actions are underway regarding McLaren's contract with this engineer.
Thus, it seems they will have it next year. Hope they find alternative expert / engineer soon !!!
It's just not feasible unless you have a really, really serious problem
I very much doubt they have the capacity built into their designs to change the geometry. But generally if you wanted to change the castor you'd have to pretty much move all of the suspension mounts. (Of course that is only really relevant on the front suspension, which is even harder to move. It's just a massive job, one which isn't often all that important, so you're better off just getting it right in the first olaceClarkBT11 wrote:They know what their setup is before they get to the track of their simulators. If you don't need to adjust the suspension why have the option to do so. I know gaining will always mean your loosing on other handling charistics but say one track is bumpy you can change the caster. Why would you not have different settings for different tracks?Muulka wrote:I'd seriously doubt that any of the teams are regularly adjusting their suspension geometry throughout the season. Firstly because you don't stand to gain very much and secondly because it's a ridiculous amount of work because changing one thing changes everything else. Not least the aero.mclaren111 wrote:
McLaren has hired an engineer from Mercedes that is an expert in this area but then Mercedes made counter in effort to keep this engineer.
I read in an article that legal actions are underway regarding McLaren's contract with this engineer.
Thus, it seems they will have it next year. Hope they find alternative expert / engineer soon !!!
It's just not feasible unless you have a really, really serious problem