2017 Australian Grand Prix - Melbourne, 24 - 26 March

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evered7
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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James Allen mentions that the decision to pit was Hamilton's. So Merc didn't really screw up. Hamilton just couldn't drive the same way and keep Vettel behind him on the same tires.

hichamo
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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dans79 wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:20 am
hichamo wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:13 am
Vettel was behind I agree, but ham was in front so your reasoning isn't right.
And when you say Vettel get close then back off, that means that he is fast enough to cash him whenever he needs to, meaning Ferrari was faster.
That's a good reasoning.
Actually no, a lot of it comes down to who is on a lap where they are harvestng more and who is deploying more.
Maybe ham lost the race because of a cat crossing in front of him , stop with the excuses, it's always ifs after the race is finished, even Toto says Ferrari were faster than us today, end of story

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dans79
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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evered7 wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:21 am
James Allen mentions that the decision to pit was Hamilton's. So Merc didn't really screw up. Hamilton just couldn't drive the same way and keep Vettel behind him on the same tires.
That's still a team screw up, the driver doesn't know the gap to every car, the engineers do. You tell the driver you must stay out, or you will come out out in traffic.
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evered7
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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dans79 wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:28 am
evered7 wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:21 am
James Allen mentions that the decision to pit was Hamilton's. So Merc didn't really screw up. Hamilton just couldn't drive the same way and keep Vettel behind him on the same tires.
That's still a team screw up, the driver doesn't know the gap to every car, the engineers do. You tell the driver you must stay out, or you will come out out in traffic.
Why? So when Hamilton slides on to the gravel or gets overtaken by Vettel on track, one can still blame the team? He starts off the very first lap by saying he has poor grip. Why would the team still hold him there with many laps put on the tire? Coming behind Verstappen being the only reason?

Also considering Verstappen was on pretty old tires and Merc have their own 'strat' modes, probably should have used that and gotten past him.

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dans79
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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hichamo wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:27 am
Maybe ham lost the race because of a cat crossing in front of him , stop with the excuses, it's always ifs after the race is finished, even Toto says Ferrari were faster than us today, end of story
Ferrari and Ferrari fans know all about ifs so............

You also seem to forget that in F1, the fastest car doesn't always win. Monaco last Year where Lewis help Ric back for most of the race is a perfect example. A tactical blunder is a tactical blunder.
Last edited by dans79 on Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:37 am, edited 1 time in total.
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dans79
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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evered7 wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:32 am
Also considering Verstappen was on pretty old tires and Merc have their own 'strat' modes, probably should have used that and gotten past him.
Buy he didn't did he.
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evered7
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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dans79 wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:33 am
evered7 wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:32 am
Also considering Verstappen was on pretty old tires and Merc have their own 'strat' modes, probably should have used that and gotten past him.
Buy he didn't did he.
So Mercedes were basically having a choice between fire and the frying pan. Ferrari matching their pace and their stint length or undercutting them with a faster tire.

If Hamilton couldn't overtake Verstappen who was on old tires, there wasn't a chance that he could take Vettel on same tires.

renatope
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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I would like to point out how great bottas was today. Many were thinking he would​ be crushed by Lewis however he kept up really well, maybe he won't be able to match Lewis' Qualy Pace but we can expect some fierce battles.
Also, I was impressed by how the three top teams where on another level, massa ended up around 20 seconds from being lapped, and he was the sixth car. Let's wait a few more races, but I think this can be a great year for us F1 fans.

GrizzleBoy
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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evered7 wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:21 am
James Allen mentions that the decision to pit was Hamilton's. So Merc didn't really screw up. Hamilton just couldn't drive the same way and keep Vettel behind him on the same tires.
If your driver says he is struggling for grip, and you agree to pit him into a train of traffic on a track/with cars not known for easy overtaking, that's not just the driver screwing up.

If just isn't.

hichamo
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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dans79 wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:32 am
hichamo wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 8:27 am
Maybe ham lost the race because of a cat crossing in front of him , stop with the excuses, it's always ifs after the race is finished, even Toto says Ferrari were faster than us today, end of story
Ferrari and Ferrari fans know all about ifs so............

You also seem to forget that in F1, the fastest car doesn't always win. Monaco last Year where Lewis help Ric back for most of the race is a perfect example. A tactical blunder is a tactical blunder.
Okay Mr strategy man,
Lauda says Ferrari was faster than us today and it wouldn't matter if Lewis pits before or after, they would have won the race anyway because Vettel was controlling his speed.
Lewis and bottas also said Ferrari was a lot faster, and Lewis said he was not worrying about seb, he was worrying about bottas,
Toto said same things , Ferrari was faster ,
And now you say the opposite,
Stop please ,the race has ended ,finger boy won , Ferrari was faster and kindly on tires , that would be the end of story for Melbourne.
We will see a better picture in China and Bahrain.

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dans79
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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hichamo wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 9:01 am
Okay Mr strategy man,
It's not strategy, its interpreting timing data and doing basic math.

hichamo wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 9:01 am
Lauda says Ferrari was faster than us today and it wouldn't matter if Lewis pits before or after, they would have won the race anyway because Vettel was controlling his speed.
Lewis and bottas also said Ferrari was a lot faster, and Lewis said he was not worrying about seb, he was worrying about bottas,
Toto said same things , Ferrari was faster ,
And now you say the opposite,
Stop please ,the race has ended ,finger boy won , Ferrari was faster and kindly on tires , that would be the end of story for Melbourne.
We will see a better picture in China and Bahrain.
O yes, Team executives and drivers always tell the truth, and never lie or talk out of their back sides..........


I'm doing an analasis at the moment and will post it when done.
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ripper
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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Well I don't think that VET could have passed HAM on track, even if he had more pace. Anyway it was a bad decision and the pit wall should have said to HAM that he was going to be behind VES

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Shrieker
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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Had Hamilton stayed 3-4 laps more they risked being undercut by Vettel, after it was certain that Vettel would come out ahead of Verstappen. So they were between the rock and a hard place. And what put them there in the first place was Ferrari and Vettel's pace .

Hindsight is wonderful... Imho what won Ferrari and Vettel the race was their legit speed over Merc/Hamilton. As I said tho, I except it to be different in other tracks.
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GrizzleBoy
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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ripper wrote:
Sun Mar 26, 2017 9:11 am
Well I don't think that VET could have passed HAM on track, even if he had more pace. Anyway it was a bad decision and the pit wall should have said to HAM that he was going to be behind VES
I don't think so either.

Seb had to back off even while running in DRS for a good couple of laps.

The only way Ham could pass VES was after VES ducked intonthte pit lane.

Ocon was in Also so DRS zone for about 25 laps or something and only got past once his car started to break down.

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SectorOne
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Re: 2017 FORMULA 1 ROLEX AUSTRALIAN GRAND PRIX Fri 24 – Sun 26 Mar 2017

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Great race, cars look great, battle in the beginning with Ham and Vet was interesting, shame it had to end with Ham getting stuck.

If this is whats to come i think we´re in for a damn good season between Mercedes and Ferrari. Going to a proper track will be nice too, let the 2017 cars stretch their legs properly.
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