Mercedes Power Unit Hardware & Software

All that has to do with the power train, gearbox, clutch, fuels and lubricants, etc. Generally the mechanical side of Formula One.
roon
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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ringo wrote:
Sun Jan 14, 2018 7:41 pm
Is there enough meat in the cylinder head between the valves for routing to the centre chamber, or is it plainly in the at the side as illustrated in the honda engine article?
If there is, it would be a good way to heat the fuel.

Mudflap wrote:
Sun Jan 14, 2018 10:42 am
Correct, it's the angle of the spray holes that matter, not the angle of the injector itself.
And location within the chamber. My understanding of the prechamber is that the spark plug is within it. But the video suggests there's a potential 40mm gap between a side-located injector and the central spark plug. Perhaps Merc don't use this and only rely on jet design/sequence and spark.

It could also be that this is simply where the fuel lines enter. The injector, it's springs/needle/solenoid could still be central, paired with the spark plug, with a side entry fuel line. If fuel heating is beneficial, routing fuel through a channel near/within the exhaust port web could do this.

Tommy Cookers
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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solenoid ?

surely they are using piezoelectric-actuation type injectors ?

they can't get this very high frequency of multiple precise injection events in this tiny time window with springs and solenoids ?

roon
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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I've read they use piezo as well. My mistake.

roon
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Image
Mercedes' 2018 F1 engine will be "pretty much all new"

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... ew-993605/

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ringo
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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Mercedes F1 pre-chamber unveiled! :P

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8uTuk1RZRjk

:mrgreen:

May be possible that the injectors go in the side of the block, and spark plugs go in the pre chamber perpendicularly as the video is showing with the old diesel engines.
Image
For Sure!!

roon
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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Cross-posting this here. The 2017 Honda and Mercedes power units have quite different camshaft centerline spacing. The Honda I measure at approximately 95mm.

Image

The Merc I have at approximately 62mm.

Image

Which is less than the prescribed cylinder bore diameter of 80mm. Could indicate cam rockers, low valve inclination angles, or more exotic arrangements.

roon wrote:
Thu Feb 08, 2018 10:41 pm
...

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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Mercedes definitely made space for something by having the cams so close. They likely have roller rockers up top, and space for TJI or whatever running between the valve springs. It agrees with the injectors being on the side of the engine near to the exhaust ports.

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Mudflap
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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It's a simple explanation and unfortunately it does not involve vortex micro black holes nor oil plasma injectors.

Honda has the finger pivot axes inboard of the cam axes while merc's are outboard.
How much TQ does it make though?

gruntguru
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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You mean the other way around?
je suis charlie

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Mudflap
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gruntguru wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:41 am
You mean the other way around?
Nope, if merc inlet cams rotate clockwise they would contact the follower on the outboard side. The follower then swings CCW to open the valve.

Honda inlet cam rotates CCW, drives on the inboard side and the follower swings CW.

Edit: After some more thought the finger pivot position can't account for such a large difference assuming that the fingers are in compression only (cam more or less right above the valve). The other possibility is that honda uses a finger in bending with outboard pivots. This would be fairly unusual as all F1 pics published so far appear to show only fingers in compression - which make more sense from a stiffness perspective.
Last edited by Mudflap on Fri Feb 09, 2018 10:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
How much TQ does it make though?

seezung
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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Mercedes 2018 fireup;



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loner
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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seezung wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 6:37 pm
Mercedes 2018 fireup;

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BiqIN10k7NQ
thnx .. what this long metal rod job exactly ?.. in the first second of video
para bellum.

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Mudflap
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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starter motor
How much TQ does it make though?

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loner
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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Mudflap wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 9:33 pm
starter motor
thnx i looked it up and i understand it now
para bellum.

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PlatinumZealot
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Re: Mercedes Power Unit

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gruntguru wrote:
Fri Feb 09, 2018 2:41 am
You mean the other way around?
Hmm. Actaully yes. Looking at the photo there is not much space above the cams. The rockers must be underneath the cams.