General Honda F1 Topic

[MrPotatoHead]

If the Renault PU improves enough that Red Bull are legitimately fighting for wins in the second half of the season, I don't see why Red Bull would jump ship and change to Honda, as much as I'd like it. If the Honda is on par with the Renault, power and reliability wise, by midseason, Red Bull will have a hard choice to make. There are certainly benefits to working with a PU partner that can design parts to integrate into the overall car design. This is the last performance benefit that Red Bull is sorely missing relative to Mercedes and Ferrari.

I think if both come same level to decision time they will choose Honda.

If both are on the same power and reliability level then Renault is still the answer because of consistency.
Honda would have to be ahead for it to be logical in F1.
Especially if RB continue to do this well all season.

[MrPotatoHead]

If you look at the last 6 races - Red Bull Renault have won 2, Ferrari 2 and Mercedes 2...

[restless]

If you look at the last 6 races - Red Bull Renault have won 2, Ferrari 2 and Mclaren 2...

Good stuff, yours. Easy to find?

[MrPotatoHead]

If you look at the last 6 races - Red Bull Renault have won 2, Ferrari 2 and Mclaren 2...

Good stuff, yours. Easy to find?

Hahahaha whoops! Damn spell check got me there.
Fixed

[loner]

If both are on the same power and reliability level then Renault is still the answer because of consistency.
Honda would have to be ahead for it to be logical in F1.
Especially if RB continue to do this well all season.

again you are totaly wrong
Renault promising performance since day 1 back in 2014 did they ever deliver in the hybrid era ?
Renault can blabing as much they want but the fact is they are lacking from day one
and guess what ? Prost said it lately Renault won't pour money into its f1 project like Mercedes
now Honda entered one year later in 2015 and they are already at Renault power level despite change the layout completely.
Honda evaluated her ex partner and found it impossible to challenge for titles due to their mediocrity in building great chassis..
they approached RBR and its as good as reality

BTW

MrPotatoHead wrote: ↑24 Apr 2018, 20:19
If you look at the last 6 races - Red Bull Renault have won 2, Ferrari 2 and Mclaren 2...

[etusch]

If the Renault PU improves enough that Red Bull are legitimately fighting for wins in the second half of the season, I don't see why Red Bull would jump ship and change to Honda, as much as I'd like it. If the Honda is on par with the Renault, power and reliability wise, by midseason, Red Bull will have a hard choice to make. There are certainly benefits to working with a PU partner that can design parts to integrate into the overall car design. This is the last performance benefit that Red Bull is sorely missing relative to Mercedes and Ferrari.

I think if both come same level to decision time they will choose Honda.

If both are on the same power and reliability level then Renault is still the answer because of consistency.
Honda would have to be ahead for it to be logical in F1.
Especially if RB continue to do this well all season.

Decision time is midseason. We are waiting for 27 hp from Honda. Of course renault will not stop where it is. when we get that time if both were at same performance level then there is any reason to stay with renault. Because expecting honda to be ahead of renault at season end is logical. Of course ferrari showed us that this layout also can do very good job but turbo era showed us that best layout is what merc did and it looks like Honda geting right it step by step.

[mrluke]

( I suppose the Honda could still carry AM branding, but I somehow do not see it. )

Aston Martin is not engine branding. Tag Heuer is. So why would Honda be branded as AM? Aston Martin is just a sponsor.

You think any of them (AM,Honda and Tag Heur) want an Aston Martin Red Bull Racing Honda Tag Heur running about?

It would be ridiculous. Someone would be dumped, which means contracts need broken or at least with Tag, re-negotiated to move to a general sponsor with maybe some cash back.

Infinity and Renault were the same company so that was fine but neither Aston or Honda will be happy with the branding being equal billing so likely you'd have to dump Aston Martin too.

For an engine that's similar at absolute best?

Mid-season is not happening and even 2019 won't be assured until the engine becomes worth the total arse ache getting them on board would create with their current title and major sponsors. We'll know it is when they announce it.

From a branding point of view the most sense would be for Aston Martin to have a Merc PU

[etusch]

Aston Martin Redbull
Redbull Toro Rosso
I think these two name tells enough.

[MrPotatoHead]

To those here that seem to think the Renault is barely ahead of Honda... Do you realize that Renault powered cars have scored more points than either Ferrari or Mercedes up to this point in the season?

Renault powered cars are sitting 3rd, 4th and 5th in the Constructors Championship.
With Mclaren Renault sitting 4th I might add...

[McMika98]

To those here that seem to think the Renault is barely ahead of Honda... Do you realize that Renault powered cars have scored more points than either Ferrari or Mercedes up to this point in the season?

Renault powered cars are sitting 3rd, 4th and 5th in the Constructors Championship.
With Mclaren Renault sitting 4th I might add...

Like that is an indication of engine power? Just amazing logical thinking there. Oh wait a minute to me the teams with most budget are standing on top of order. Wonder why that would be the case?
And btw Honda have more power than Renault if i follow your logical perspective.

[MrPotatoHead]

Because expecting honda to be ahead of renault at season end is logical.

Why?

[MrPotatoHead]

To those here that seem to think the Renault is barely ahead of Honda... Do you realize that Renault powered cars have scored more points than either Ferrari or Mercedes up to this point in the season?

Renault powered cars are sitting 3rd, 4th and 5th in the Constructors Championship.
With Mclaren Renault sitting 4th I might add...

Like that is an indication of engine power? Just amazing logical thinking there. Oh wait a minute to me the teams with most budget are standing on top of order. Wonder why that would be the case?
And btw Honda have more power than Renault if i follow your logical perspective.

I must have missed where you posted anything logical?

I want Honda to do well as much as anyone but there is some pure fantasy here about Red Bull and Honda.
When I see Red Bull Honda prints I'll let you know.

[McMika98]

Yes engine power = points. Stuff that would make einstein proud.
On serious note, the engine power from Honda has been decent this year. TR have similar sidepods and rear with a more advanced front wing and have better top speed than last year. To me Bahrain was more down to Honda than STR chassis, given the stop start nature of track. We know it left Mclaren in its wake. Baku will be interesting, the track isnt grippy so tyre temps will be an issue.

[etusch]

Because expecting honda to be ahead of renault at season end is logical.

Why?

Well. Maybe "logical" was not right word. I mean Honda's development rate was better than Renault last year and if they can go upper with coming update we will be able to say that(better development rate) for this season too. My other claim is because of Honda's architecture as I wrote last post.

[MrPotatoHead]

Because expecting honda to be ahead of renault at season end is logical.

Why?

Well. Maybe "logical" was not right word. I mean Honda's development rate was better than Renault last year and if they can go upper with coming update we will be able to say that(better development rate) for this season too. My other claim is because of Honda's architecture as I wrote last post.

Thanks for the clarification of your post - but I think in all likelihood Honda will start to run into diminishing returns.
They should catch up quickly because they started after and had the most to catch up - but things get harder and harder to find as they get closer to Mercedes and Ferrari levels.