2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

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Sieper
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Sieper » Wed Aug 08, 2018 10:32 am

Well, I was expecting him to announce an STR seat per 2019 (and Gas to replace Ric at RBR for 2019), then I read (and timing of his announcement) it could even be immediately but since I have read he apparently doesn't have enough points to be allowed a F1 seat so now I am back to him going to STR per 2019.

Sieper
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Sieper » Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:56 am

Nathan, indeed Dennis not back to single seaters, the Dennis news, goes to drive for Audi in Japan

https://twitter.com/JakeDennis19/status ... 0473379846

The Hartley surprise move to STR must have shifted what is reasonable to expect a bit too far in my brain! What Are your expectations for the RBR and STR seats for 2019?

Zynerji
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Zynerji » Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:28 pm

"There is always a reason but you can’t foresee what it will be when they are 14-15. They all had potential but there was always a reason – with the exception of Buemi who was wrong time, wrong place. If it was now I think he would have made it at Red Bull.” -Marko

https://www.motorsportmagazine.com/arch ... lmut-marko

Good read. I wonder if Buemi might get a call back?

Phil
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Phil » Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:52 pm

Sadly, for Buemi,I think it's a little too late. He has been out of F1 too long. Now he is driving for WEC and Formula-E. Even if he might have been one of the most promising RB drivers after Vettel, it's just been a little too long.

I think Hartley got the nod to join Torro-Rosso last year, not because they wanted him over Buemi, but because Buemi declined the prospect of sitting in for a short undisclosed time while he has other racing series to compete in. Back at the time, it was discussed that it may be a very risky thing to do and could potentially be damaging to your career.
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marmer
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by marmer » Wed Aug 08, 2018 2:36 pm

Phil wrote:
Wed Aug 08, 2018 1:52 pm
Sadly, for Buemi,I think it's a little too late. He has been out of F1 too long. Now he is driving for WEC and Formula-E. Even if he might have been one of the most promising RB drivers after Vettel, it's just been a little too long.

I think Hartley got the nod to join Torro-Rosso last year, not because they wanted him over Buemi, but because Buemi declined the prospect of sitting in for a short undisclosed time while he has other racing series to compete in. Back at the time, it was discussed that it may be a very risky thing to do and could potentially be damaging to your career.
Off topic but just read your signature.
Top stuff had a good belly laugh at that

NathanOlder
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by NathanOlder » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:13 pm

Sieper wrote:
Wed Aug 08, 2018 11:56 am
Nathan, indeed Dennis not back to single seaters, the Dennis news, goes to drive for Audi in Japan

https://twitter.com/JakeDennis19/status ... 0473379846

The Hartley surprise move to STR must have shifted what is reasonable to expect a bit too far in my brain! What Are your expectations for the RBR and STR seats for 2019?
I cant see any other outcome other than Gasly to RedBull, and Sainz will go back to ToroRosso if he doesn't get a seat at Mclaren alongside Stoffel as Fernando goes to IndyCar. If Sainz goes to Mclaren (because Fernando stays for some crazy reason) , then Torro Rosso will have to employ someone outside of the RedBull family, and with James Key going to Mclaren, they will let Toro Rosso borrow Lando Norris for a year to keep both teams happy. Win win situation for Norris, Key, Mclaren & Toro Rosso.

Red Bull - Max & Gasly
Toro Rosso - Norris & Hartley
Mclaren Vandoorne & Sainz
GoLandoGo
Lewis v2.0

Sieper
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Sieper » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:35 pm

I expect the same, Norris included. Only thing that I still doubt if Hartley will keep his seat, Honda wants a Japanese driver in the second STR seat I believe. So if one is allowed into F1 next year (enough points) He might replace Hartley. Vandoorne will have to step up his game as well. Alo really seems to have had enough of it. It is a shame for him, I believe him still on the very top level of F1 drivers.

Big Tea
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Big Tea » Wed Aug 08, 2018 3:54 pm

I would love to see Norris get a drive (anywhere really) but I have a gut feeling it will not be at any of the Red bull stable cars.
If they bring in a driver who was not in their development path, someone is going to have egg on their face, and if its the same person who seems to have the decision on drivers, I think it unlikely

I know they seem to be without anyone ready, but if they resorted to bringing in Hartley when there are drivers hanging about the pit lane, they are squirming.
I think they missed the call by not using Kvyat, but I think he is gone now.
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apexcontrol
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by apexcontrol » Wed Aug 08, 2018 8:46 pm

https://www.formula1.com/en/latest/feat ... iardo.html

horner about allot of thing and also ricardo departing to renault

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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Morteza » Thu Aug 09, 2018 2:55 am

"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

AngusF1
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by AngusF1 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:03 am

Some quotes from the above video here: https://www.news.com.au/sport/motorspor ... 2fb25f3a33

Quite an insightful interview. Horner claims Red Bull offered a one-year deal and that money wasn't an issue. He makes some reasonable criticisms to establish the "Red Bull authorised version", however also adds some comments which reveal more about Red Bull's attitude and motives than they do about Ricciardo.

Firstly
"it’s kind of been like trying to convince a girl to go out with you that’s been pretty reticent. It’s felt like that"
which is unprofessional and just plain rude. It also comes across as if Horner believes in this analogy that he's the most attractive man around, while the reality is that he runs only the third-most attractive F1 team.

Further, in reference to Webber-Vettel,
"It was potentially where Ricciardo-Verstappen could have ended up over the next couple of years ... if he (Webber) looked back at it now with perspective and honesty, Sebastian was just quicker".
The self-serving slipperiness of this framing is significant as while Vettel was quicker he wasn't just quicker; it fails to acknowledge Red Bull's rampant favouritism towards Vettel, despite Webber never being hired as a number 2 driver.

Horner's acknowledgement that Ricciardo could have been treated similarly to Webber is all we need to know to understand Ricciardo's motivation for leaving. For a driver widely acknowledged as a top 5 in the sport, and arguably as good as 2nd or 3rd, to have such a role envisaged for him is a real shame. Ricciardo has always stated his goal in the sport is to win titles, and it's now clear that the opportunity to do so was blocked at Red Bull. Consequently with Renault he's chosen the best team available.

Pany
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by Pany » Thu Aug 09, 2018 8:07 am

Ricciardo not a rookie anymore. Is talented and a top driver. It's time to for him to get topo driver money even without being champion; and Renault did offer what he wanted. That'sit

GhostF1
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by GhostF1 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 8:11 am

AngusF1 wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 5:03 am
Some quotes from the above video here: https://www.news.com.au/sport/motorspor ... 2fb25f3a33

Quite an insightful interview. Horner claims Red Bull offered a one-year deal and that money wasn't an issue. He makes some reasonable criticisms to establish the "Red Bull authorised version", however also adds some comments which reveal more about Red Bull's attitude and motives than they do about Ricciardo.

Firstly
"it’s kind of been like trying to convince a girl to go out with you that’s been pretty reticent. It’s felt like that"
which is unprofessional and just plain rude. It also comes across as if Horner believes in this analogy that he's the most attractive man around, while the reality is that he runs only the third-most attractive F1 team.

Further, in reference to Webber-Vettel,
"It was potentially where Ricciardo-Verstappen could have ended up over the next couple of years ... if he (Webber) looked back at it now with perspective and honesty, Sebastian was just quicker".
The self-serving slipperiness of this framing is significant as while Vettel was quicker he wasn't just quicker; it fails to acknowledge Red Bull's rampant favouritism towards Vettel, despite Webber never being hired as a number 2 driver.

Horner's acknowledgement that Ricciardo could have been treated similarly to Webber is all we need to know to understand Ricciardo's motivation for leaving. For a driver widely acknowledged as a top 5 in the sport, and arguably as good as 2nd or 3rd, to have such a role envisaged for him is a real shame. Ricciardo has always stated his goal in the sport is to win titles, and it's now clear that the opportunity to do so was blocked at Red Bull. Consequently with Renault he's chosen the best team available.
That is an absolute reach... I've seen a side to Ricciardo this season that I haven't really seen before. He is obsessed with this 1st/2nd driver business and will not tolerate the idea of NOT being labelled as "1st driver".. I've seen him be childish on track and cause issue and when Horner says he has been reticent during the negotiations, it is likely 1000% true. He phoned Marko the Thursday prior to announcing the Renault deal that he is going to Renault, it's all been very shady and he's been extremely coy to media as well.
It's all premeditated and I agree with a couple people here, it's a money motivated move.. how can McLaren claim to of been close to signing him, but suddenly Renault is in the picture... It was a money play that's it, not this "I see potential in Renault" crap.. that's something he's spinning now he's signed with them. That's not to say the Renault move won't be fruitful, it may well be a great one, but let's not pretend he did this because RBR were poisoning him or it's there fault at all. That's rubbish. I'm Australian, and I love Dan, but I'll be among the first to admit his attitude as of late has been less than noble..
Last edited by GhostF1 on Thu Aug 09, 2018 8:21 am, edited 2 times in total.

GhostF1
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by GhostF1 » Thu Aug 09, 2018 8:17 am

Pany wrote:
Thu Aug 09, 2018 8:07 am
Ricciardo not a rookie anymore. Is talented and a top driver. It's time to for him to get topo driver money even without being champion; and Renault did offer what he wanted. That'sit
$35 million though?? It's a leap, an emotional one and I think Renault was strong armed into doing it to get him. Which fine, the dude took advantage of the situation, good on him, but that's a disgustingly large sum... especially compared to Hulk's salary.. and if true, that's also a larger base salary than Alonso or even Hamilton which is madness.

roon
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Re: 2018 Aston Martin Red Bull Racing - Tag Heuer (Renault)

Post by roon » Thu Aug 09, 2018 9:01 am

Was this a strategic disruption of RB by Renault? RB are all that stands between Renault and third place, next year. Those extra dollars spent on Ricciardo's salary may well buy them enough points for it to make sense/break even.