2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

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GPR -A
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by GPR -A » Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:24 pm

GrandAxe wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:04 pm
Bill_Kar wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:57 am
They only thing that is somewhat worrying is the instability in the back which is clearly visible.
But I think that Mercedes will be close, nothing like 3 or 5 tenths adrift.
Fuel load?
Tyres are the only and BIG factor in all this. If the tyres don't come alive, the car is naturally going to struggle for grip. The test in Barcelona was all done in way less than ambient temperatures and they massively struggled with cold graining. Given the fact that, their car was barely 2 to 2 and half days old (Spec 2), it is not entirely surprising that the tyres are not in ideal window. We will see when the car hits a track with more ambient temperatures and with more time for Mercedes to go back to the factory and analyze the data.

Despite those limiting factors, their race sim looked close to Ferrari, which should be encouraging. When they get better understanding of the setup, specifically as they kept experimenting with different types of front suspensions, they should be in better position to compete.

Many people are trying to play down that S3 performance and that surely is one thing to watch for! If anyone had read a report motorsport italia, which I had posted after the conclusion of first test and later heard the comments from Toto and Bottas about the performance of Spec 2 on slow corners, then that is really something that need to watched for!

Bill_Kar
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Bill_Kar » Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:09 pm

GrandAxe wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:04 pm
Bill_Kar wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:57 am
They only thing that is somewhat worrying is the instability in the back which is clearly visible.
But I think that Mercedes will be close, nothing like 3 or 5 tenths adrift.
Fuel load?
Is it enough to justify this? Ferrari ran fuel-heavy as well in various stints but it wasn't unstable.
But I don't know of course, I'm merely pointing out what the naked eye can catch.

Bill_Kar
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Bill_Kar » Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:14 pm

GPR -A wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:24 pm
GrandAxe wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:04 pm
Bill_Kar wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:57 am
They only thing that is somewhat worrying is the instability in the back which is clearly visible.
But I think that Mercedes will be close, nothing like 3 or 5 tenths adrift.
Fuel load?
Tyres are the only and BIG factor in all this. If the tyres don't come alive, the car is naturally going to struggle for grip. The test in Barcelona was all done in way less than ambient temperatures and they massively struggled with cold graining. Given the fact that, their car was barely 2 to 2 and half days old (Spec 2), it is not entirely surprising that the tyres are not in ideal window. We will see when the car hits a track with more ambient temperatures and with more time for Mercedes to go back to the factory and analyze the data.

Despite those limiting factors, their race sim looked close to Ferrari, which should be encouraging. When they get better understanding of the setup, specifically as they kept experimenting with different types of front suspensions, they should be in better position to compete.

Many people are trying to play down that S3 performance and that surely is one thing to watch for! If anyone had read a report motorsport italia, which I had posted after the conclusion of first test and later heard the comments from Toto and Bottas about the performance of Spec 2 on slow corners, then that is really something that need to watched for!
Conceptually Mercedes spec 2 car is similar to ferrari right? I mean the front wing outwash thing.
Can you direct me to the motorsport italia report please?

LM10
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by LM10 » Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:22 pm

Bill_Kar wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:14 pm
GPR -A wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:24 pm
GrandAxe wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 4:04 pm


Fuel load?
Tyres are the only and BIG factor in all this. If the tyres don't come alive, the car is naturally going to struggle for grip. The test in Barcelona was all done in way less than ambient temperatures and they massively struggled with cold graining. Given the fact that, their car was barely 2 to 2 and half days old (Spec 2), it is not entirely surprising that the tyres are not in ideal window. We will see when the car hits a track with more ambient temperatures and with more time for Mercedes to go back to the factory and analyze the data.

Despite those limiting factors, their race sim looked close to Ferrari, which should be encouraging. When they get better understanding of the setup, specifically as they kept experimenting with different types of front suspensions, they should be in better position to compete.

Many people are trying to play down that S3 performance and that surely is one thing to watch for! If anyone had read a report motorsport italia, which I had posted after the conclusion of first test and later heard the comments from Toto and Bottas about the performance of Spec 2 on slow corners, then that is really something that need to watched for!
Conceptually Mercedes spec 2 car is similar to ferrari right? I mean the front wing outwash thing.
Can you direct me to the motorsport italia report please?
No, it isn't. The outboard section is still high. The endplate changed, so now it's even more similar to Redbull's concept.
Ferrari's FW is in the opposite group. Inboard high, outboard low.

GPR -A
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by GPR -A » Fri Mar 08, 2019 3:05 am

Bill_Kar wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:14 pm
Conceptually Mercedes spec 2 car is similar to ferrari right? I mean the front wing outwash thing.
Can you direct me to the motorsport italia report please?
This was a report published on Motorsport italia on 23rd February, after the first test was completed. That was at a time when no one had any of idea of an upgrade that Mercedes was about to bring to second test.

https://it.motorsport.com/f1/news/quant ... i/4342684/

Morteza
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Morteza » Fri Mar 08, 2019 6:00 pm

Bottas gets Hamilton engineer for 2019
What is new is that I have a new race engineer. Tony Ross has gone to Mercedes’ Formula E project and now I have Riccardo Musconi, who was a performance engineer on Lewis Hamilton’s car," Bottas added.
"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

GPR -A
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by GPR -A » Fri Mar 08, 2019 7:38 pm

An interesting article - Interview with James Allison.

Why Mercedes faces F1 'jeopardy' - Autosport.com

Excerpts here.
"This is a new year, so we go in with very little true expectation of being at the front," he notes. "We hope we've done enough, but there are no guarantees. Although the recovery in performance has felt steep, we don't yet know whether it will be steep enough.

"I'd say 2019 presents quite a chunky regulation change. Look at the detail on the front wing of last year's car," he adds, pointing to the left edge of Hamilton's title-winning W09. "That's not there for a laugh. Those tiny wings set the conditions for where the low-energy wake of the tyre goes. If that crappy air gets too involved in the rest of the car, it doesn't produce enough downforce. So you have to re-invent the front wing, plus the brake duct and barge board and, together, this threesome creates this favourable behaviour.

"We've been pretty good at getting this right over the past few years and so in terms of the new regulations, the better your aero concept, the bigger the hit. Getting the 2019 car back up the performance slope has been exhilarating for the aerodynamicists, who are used to fractional gains and are suddenly finding big chunks, but there is no knowledge of how big the hit has been for our competitors. This feels like a year laden with excitement and opportunity - but jeopardy too. The emotions are heightened on this occasion by the regulation change."

siskue2005
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by siskue2005 » Sat Mar 09, 2019 5:37 am

Bill_Kar wrote:
Thu Mar 07, 2019 11:14 pm

Conceptually Mercedes spec 2 car is similar to ferrari right? I mean the front wing outwash thing.
Can you direct me to the motorsport italia report please?
Their Spec 1 wing was also outwash....they just tried to create a vortex with a inward curve of endplate to aid outwash
Scarbs explains it here

as they were the team who made the outwash popular in 2009, i dont think they could ever look for anything other than that

Morteza
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Morteza » Sun Mar 10, 2019 7:28 pm

"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

zibby43
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by zibby43 » Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:45 pm

Toto doesn't seem confident for the opening rounds of the season.

Morteza
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by Morteza » Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:21 am

zibby43 wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:45 pm
Toto doesn't seem confident for the opening rounds of the season.
That's how I feel about it too. He specifically mentions the first three races
"A fool thinks himself to be wise, but a wise man knows himself to be a fool."~William Shakespeare

zibby43
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by zibby43 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:31 am

Morteza wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 3:21 am
zibby43 wrote:
Sun Mar 10, 2019 10:45 pm
Toto doesn't seem confident for the opening rounds of the season.
That's how I feel about it too. He specifically mentions the first three races
Yep. James Allison looked like he hadn't slept since testing. :lol: Bet he has been burning the candle at both ends.

The good news is, for the sake of the championship battle, if Merc is off the pace, it can't go much worse than it did for them last year in the opening rounds. And Mercedes started last year with the advantage Ferrari has *this* year.

You never truly know what's going to happen in this sport, race-to-race. One of the reasons I love it.

siskue2005
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by siskue2005 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 5:10 am

Multi million budget and they don't have a large conference hall? :lol:

siskue2005
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by siskue2005 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 5:22 am

zibby43 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:31 am

And Mercedes started last year with the advantage Ferrari has *this* year.
Vettel had 3 poles out of the first 4 races in 2018
and won 2 of them, and could have easily won all 4 (team screw up in China and Him screwing up in Baku)
Except for Spain/France (with special tyres) they were the fastest car until Singapore GP

i think they are on a similar position in 2019 also....the Ferrari was also the better in 2018 initially, after the summer break Ferrari dirver and team usually fall apart.

If we had similar situations to 2018 then we are on for a great season
The difference to 2018 season and now is that back then Mercedes were very close behind Ferrari in most races....but i have doubts this season.

zibby43
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Re: 2019 Mercedes AMG Petronas Formula One Team

Post by zibby43 » Mon Mar 11, 2019 7:09 am

siskue2005 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 5:22 am
zibby43 wrote:
Mon Mar 11, 2019 4:31 am

And Mercedes started last year with the advantage Ferrari has *this* year.
Vettel had 3 poles out of the first 4 races in 2018
and won 2 of them, and could have easily won all 4 (team screw up in China and Him screwing up in Baku)
Except for Spain/France (with special tyres) they were the fastest car until Singapore GP

i think they are on a similar position in 2019 also....the Ferrari was also the better in 2018 initially, after the summer break Ferrari dirver and team usually fall apart.

If we had similar situations to 2018 then we are on for a great season
The difference to 2018 season and now is that back then Mercedes were very close behind Ferrari in most races....but i have doubts this season.
Mercedes supposedly had a sizeable margin over Ferrari to begin the season last year. While that margin did secure Hamilton a dominant pole in Melbourne, Mercedes lost the race (strategy software error) after Hamilton put a significant gap on Vettel.

Mercedes did not win until Azerbaijan.

Ferrari did bring a massive floor update to Bahrain, last year, however.