2019 Renault F1 Team

[Mclarensenna]

Hmm, it does seem troubling that the other teams can find sponsors yet Renault cannot.

Agree! Renault should have sold a lot more advertising space since 2016. Year after year that extra budget could have been used to slowly push Renault towards the front and be in a much better position now.

You are assuming that they haven’t been able to find sponsors... They may very well not be getting what they think that space is worth or simply have decided that they much rather have their own brand in the rear wing... Reality is that you are just guessing without having any actual piece of information on the decisions that may be going on inside the team.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I have been very clear that my reasoning is based on the current winning and proven strategy in F1. I am not guessing i am stating how poor Renault business model has been since 2016 and why they are still struggling with an extremely slow chassis and extremely slow and unreliable PU.
The F1 strategy that works in 2019 is as follows, Raise incredible sums of money and spend that money in an efficient way to win. Mercedes have followed this sell alot of advertising strategy including the rear wing since 2010 and are now at the top.

It is a tool (lets call it that) you need to win. It is like an F1 team not using a wind tunnel just CFD when every top team is using a wind tunnel plus CFD. Well you basically got no chance of winning handicapped in this way.
You need to use every single tool the top teams have available, to even think of competing with them.

Look at the top 6 teams in the constructors in 2019.
Mercedes, Ferrari, Redbull, Mclaren,Racing point, Alfa
Notice what they all have in common?
They all have sold the rear wing to advertisers to raise further funds which in turn they use to spend on the cars.
Even racing point managed to do this in a few short months. So yes Cyril and management are completely incompetent if they have not worked this strategy out or been able to find a sponsor or any other excuse. i do not care about the excuse. The point is Renault has failed for 4 years now to do this simple task racing point managed in a few months. Pathetic! All the top 6 teams have succeeded in 2019 with this task. All except Renault.
It is the only way to win in F1 in 2019 which is why Renault will never win unless they completely overhaul their management strategy.

[bucker]

Agree! Renault should have sold a lot more advertising space since 2016. Year after year that extra budget could have been used to slowly push Renault towards the front and be in a much better position now.

You are assuming that they haven’t been able to find sponsors... They may very well not be getting what they think that space is worth or simply have decided that they much rather have their own brand in the rear wing... Reality is that you are just guessing without having any actual piece of information on the decisions that may be going on inside the team.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I have been very clear that my reasoning is based on the current winning and proven strategy in F1. I am not guessing i am stating how poor Renault business model has been since 2016 and why they are still struggling with an extremely slow chassis and extremely slow and unreliable PU.
The F1 strategy that works in 2019 is as follows, Raise incredible sums of money and spend that money in an efficient way to win. Mercedes have followed this sell alot of advertising strategy including the rear wing since 2010 and are now at the top.

It is a tool (lets call it that) you need to win. It is like an F1 team not using a wind tunnel just CFD when every top team is using a wind tunnel plus CFD. Well you basically got no chance of winning handicapped in this way.
You need to use every single tool the top teams have available, to even think of competing with them.

Look at the top 6 teams in the constructors in 2019.
Mercedes, Ferrari, Redbull, Mclaren,Racing point, Alfa
Notice what they all have in common?
They all have sold the rear wing to advertisers to raise further funds which in turn they use to spend on the cars.
Even racing point managed to do this in a few short months. So yes Cyril and management are completely incompetent if they have not worked this strategy out or been able to find a sponsor or any other excuse. i do not care about the excuse. The point is Renault has failed for 4 years now to do this simple task racing point managed in a few months. Pathetic! All the top 6 teams have succeeded in 2019 with this task. All except Renault.
It is the only way to win in F1 in 2019 which is why Renault will never win unless they completely overhaul their management strategy.

You still dont understand. Most of the stickers from different companies are not paid. They are technical partners which means, that they help the team with their knowledge.

Usually the agreements are yearly. For example Mercedes wants Petronas to developt new fuel all year through the season. Petronas will spent 5 mio for delevoping new fuels and lubricants for Mercedes F1 team for whole season. Petronas then charge Mercedes 5 mio, which was the cost of development and Mercedes send bill to Petronas for same amount of 5 mio for letting them have their sticker on the car. All details are of course published in contract before.

So again, it is not like Petronas or Mobil, or other techical partners are throwing money to the teams. They help them with their knowledge.

[Mclarensenna]

You are assuming that they haven’t been able to find sponsors... They may very well not be getting what they think that space is worth or simply have decided that they much rather have their own brand in the rear wing... Reality is that you are just guessing without having any actual piece of information on the decisions that may be going on inside the team.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

I have been very clear that my reasoning is based on the current winning and proven strategy in F1. I am not guessing i am stating how poor Renault business model has been since 2016 and why they are still struggling with an extremely slow chassis and extremely slow and unreliable PU.
The F1 strategy that works in 2019 is as follows, Raise incredible sums of money and spend that money in an efficient way to win. Mercedes have followed this sell alot of advertising strategy including the rear wing since 2010 and are now at the top.

It is a tool (lets call it that) you need to win. It is like an F1 team not using a wind tunnel just CFD when every top team is using a wind tunnel plus CFD. Well you basically got no chance of winning handicapped in this way.
You need to use every single tool the top teams have available, to even think of competing with them.

Look at the top 6 teams in the constructors in 2019.
Mercedes, Ferrari, Redbull, Mclaren,Racing point, Alfa
Notice what they all have in common?
They all have sold the rear wing to advertisers to raise further funds which in turn they use to spend on the cars.
Even racing point managed to do this in a few short months. So yes Cyril and management are completely incompetent if they have not worked this strategy out or been able to find a sponsor or any other excuse. i do not care about the excuse. The point is Renault has failed for 4 years now to do this simple task racing point managed in a few months. Pathetic! All the top 6 teams have succeeded in 2019 with this task. All except Renault.
It is the only way to win in F1 in 2019 which is why Renault will never win unless they completely overhaul their management strategy.

You still dont understand. Most of the stickers from different companies are not paid. They are technical partners which means, that they help the team with their knowledge.

Usually the agreements are yearly. For example Mercedes wants Petronas to developt new fuel all year through the season. Petronas will spent 5 mio for delevoping new fuels and lubricants for Mercedes F1 team for whole season. Petronas then charge Mercedes 5 mio, which was the cost of development and Mercedes send bill to Petronas for same amount of 5 mio for letting them have their sticker on the car. All details are of course published in contract before.

So again, it is not like Petronas or Mobil, or other techical partners are throwing money to the teams. They help them with their knowledge.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... p/3217719/
€30 million per season sponsorship for the 2010 season. Article from way back in 2009
Nothing like the 5 you mentioned. Speaking of which where are you sourcing your information from please?

[bucker]

I have been very clear that my reasoning is based on the current winning and proven strategy in F1. I am not guessing i am stating how poor Renault business model has been since 2016 and why they are still struggling with an extremely slow chassis and extremely slow and unreliable PU.
The F1 strategy that works in 2019 is as follows, Raise incredible sums of money and spend that money in an efficient way to win. Mercedes have followed this sell alot of advertising strategy including the rear wing since 2010 and are now at the top.

It is a tool (lets call it that) you need to win. It is like an F1 team not using a wind tunnel just CFD when every top team is using a wind tunnel plus CFD. Well you basically got no chance of winning handicapped in this way.
You need to use every single tool the top teams have available, to even think of competing with them.

Look at the top 6 teams in the constructors in 2019.
Mercedes, Ferrari, Redbull, Mclaren,Racing point, Alfa
Notice what they all have in common?
They all have sold the rear wing to advertisers to raise further funds which in turn they use to spend on the cars.
Even racing point managed to do this in a few short months. So yes Cyril and management are completely incompetent if they have not worked this strategy out or been able to find a sponsor or any other excuse. i do not care about the excuse. The point is Renault has failed for 4 years now to do this simple task racing point managed in a few months. Pathetic! All the top 6 teams have succeeded in 2019 with this task. All except Renault.
It is the only way to win in F1 in 2019 which is why Renault will never win unless they completely overhaul their management strategy.

You still dont understand. Most of the stickers from different companies are not paid. They are technical partners which means, that they help the team with their knowledge.

Usually the agreements are yearly. For example Mercedes wants Petronas to developt new fuel all year through the season. Petronas will spent 5 mio for delevoping new fuels and lubricants for Mercedes F1 team for whole season. Petronas then charge Mercedes 5 mio, which was the cost of development and Mercedes send bill to Petronas for same amount of 5 mio for letting them have their sticker on the car. All details are of course published in contract before.

So again, it is not like Petronas or Mobil, or other techical partners are throwing money to the teams. They help them with their knowledge.

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... p/3217719/
€30 million per season sponsorship for the 2010 season. Article from way back in 2009
Nothing like the 5 you mentioned. Speaking of which where are you sourcing your information from please?

I gave 5 mio as an example. I don't know what real numbers are.

So you got yourself an answer with that link. Fuel and lubricant development per season for winning team cost 30 mio, which are then not charged to Mercedes.

Techical partnership works like that because company near me works with top teams in moto and autosport and they said that this is bussines model for sport division. They also have been in F1 long time ago, but Brackley based team didn't allowed them to put their sticker on the car at that time

[PowerandtheGlory]

https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/merc ... p/3217719/
€30 million per season sponsorship for the 2010 season. Article from way back in 2009
Nothing like the 5 you mentioned. Speaking of which where are you sourcing your information from please?

I gave 5 mio as an example. I don't know what real numbers are.

So you got yourself an answer with that link. Fuel and lubricant development per season for winning team cost 30 mio, which are then not charged to Mercedes.

Techical partnership works like that because company near me works with top teams in moto and autosport and they said that this is bussines model for sport division. They also have been in F1 long time ago, but Brackley based team didn't allowed them to put their sticker on the car at that time

So you just made the 5 million quote up. Nice one!

Bringing this back on track slightly.. i don't think that failing to sell advertizing is automatically an indicator for failure on the part of the team or principal here's why; It is indicitive of F1's struggles to attract marque sponsors in a post Tobacco sponsorship era..
The main sponsors that almost all teams have are Petroleum/ IT / Computer / Banking or financial services... with only a few other from different areas.

Whilst its easy for a company like Ferrari or Merc to attract a sponsor given the strength of their brand, ferrari continue to receive money from P. Morris who is effectively a tobacco company.
Mercedes have a great global brand and can also attract sponsors or partners.
Other teams will struggle. Look at teams like Williams, Mclaren and Renault and RP. They do not have an immediate international brand despite relative fame in their own circles, Mclaren especially.
But there are also other considerations.
Renault is a state owned car company - therefore the Renault team has links to the french government in one way or another. Renault as a car maker would struggle to justify being sponsored by a dodgy South American Oil Company - or equally a Russian bank with links to the Russian state.
It's not just what you can sell - but who your allowed to sell to. Also other sponsors have considerations as to who they can appear with as well. So its all very difficult.
As an example 'Heineken' beer pay around £80m or so to appear in James Bond films as the drink that James bond drinks. Imagine is they could be persuaded to join F1.. oh no wait... Driving and Drinking.. no can do

Sometimes you will see a team with 1 main sponsor and few others as the others have been veto'd by having the main sponsor. If you imagine the Renault ING days.. they were a huge bank - so you couldn't have the current RCA renault commerical services on the same car.
So Yes renault may have 30 sponsors but they all work in harmony...
Mclaren have sold space to Coca-Cola - but even they were reluctant to join a sport so entrenched in perceived 'old' technologies and wealth and glamour.. they could have gone to FE..
Renault have an operating budget of approx £400 or Euro's or whatever.
Surely the Principals job is to make sure they spend this money wisely. So investment in infrastructure, hiring key personnel, etc.
Mclaren realised this last year. It couldn't pay Alonso what they were paying him, and justify this. you could probably hire 10 Norris's for the salary of 1 Alonso. Zak brown had the bravery and skill to facilitate Alonso's sabbatical or dummy retirement - so he could spend the money elsewhere and its working.

Cyril isnt doing a 'bad' job, he has Re-invested in facilities, new Wind tunnel Etc, hired personnel, and got a top driver. It all makes sense. That's why he has the support of the board. He is doing it the right way.
Time will tell if this long term re-building job will get Renault to where they are - but they must continue to show incremental improvement, that is the key.

[Espresso]

...
As an example 'Heineken' beer pay around £80m or so to appear in James Bond films as the drink that James bond drinks. Imagine is they could be persuaded to join F1.. oh no wait... Driving and Drinking.. no can do

Let us grab a bear and let us all get back on Renault Team as topic.

Renault Group is their own biggest sponsor. And sadly, year-in year-out, they develop a (new concept) engine and chassis every year....promise the sky and in reality not gain a penny.

Look how similar to 'Williams' they act, they stubbornly keep steering the same course. I don't expect any improvement without change (of management).
They'd better take a good look at McLaren as an example. Clean the ship and turn direction.

Off-topic: In advertising 'NO' doesn't exist. It's a 'WINNOW' challenge

[PowerandtheGlory]

...
As an example 'Heineken' beer pay around £80m or so to appear in James Bond films as the drink that James bond drinks. Imagine is they could be persuaded to join F1.. oh no wait... Driving and Drinking.. no can do

Let us grab a bear and let us all get back on Renault Team as topic.

Renault Group is their own biggest sponsor. And sadly, year-in year-out, they develop a (new concept) engine and chassis every year....promise the sky and in reality not gain a penny.

Look how similar to 'Williams' they act, they stubbornly keep steering the same course. I don't expect any improvement without change (of management).
They'd better take a good look at McLaren as an example. Clean the ship and turn direction.

Off-topic: In advertising 'NO' doesn't exist. It's a 'WINNOW' challenge

https://www.theheinekencompany.com/-/me ... 8F4ACC04B0

Yes Renault are its own biggest sponsor, technically they don't need an Engine Deal like most other midfield teams.

I wouldn't say they develop a new concept every year, but they are definitely a team chasing others, like RB, so they will always 'talk up' their chances and try to aim high.

Sadly it hasn't worked yet. But i dont think cleaning the ship would help much as this stage. only probably set them back another 12 months.

I think Renault are completely different to Williams, in prev years Williams have had to employ 'pay' drivers in order to make ends meet.

Renault do not employ pay drivers. they are in a different position completely to Williams at the moment.

[Morteza]

Renault F1 Team evolves its organisation

Renault Sport Racing is bringing changes to its organisational structures in France and the UK to reinforce its management and strengthen its Technical departments. Beyond their impact on the 2019 and 2020 seasons, these changes are a significant step towards preparing both organisations to the challenges of the 2021 season and meeting the objectives of the roadmap set in 2016.

At Viry-Châtillon, two new management positions have been created: Christophe Mary has been named Director of Engineering and will arrive on August 1st, while Stéphane Rodriguez has been appointed Project and Purchasing Director within the Technical Department. Both will report to the Engine Technical Director, Rémi Taffin.

At Enstone, current Deputy Chief Designer Matt Harman has been appointed Engineering Director within the Technical Department and will report to Chassis Technical Director, Nick Chester.

All three will sit on Renault F1 Team’s Management Board. These reinforcements will allow Nick and Rémi to increase their focus on the performance of the chassis and engine while overseeing the entire technical program with internal and external stakeholders.

Previously, Christophe Mary held technical responsibilities for 14 years at Ferrari F1 and for four years at Mercedes HPE. Most recently, he held the position of Chief Systems and Powertrain Engineer at PSA Motorsport.

Stéphane Rodriguez has held various positions since joining Renault Sport Racing in 2001, from Head of Reliability to Head of Testing. He is currently Project Manager, responsible for the latest generations of V8 engines and hybrid PUs.

Matt Harman joined Renault F1 Team in 2018 as Deputy Chief Designer after 11 years at Mercedes AMG HPP and more than seven years at Mercedes AMG F1 as Head of Powertrain Integration and Transmission design.

[Mattchu]

Bringing this back on track slightly.. i don't think that failing to sell advertizing is automatically an indicator for failure on the part of the team or principal here's why; It is indicitive of F1's struggles to attract marque sponsors in a post Tobacco sponsorship era..
The main sponsors that almost all teams have are Petroleum/ IT / Computer / Banking or financial services... with only a few other from different areas.

Whilst its easy for a company like Ferrari or Merc to attract a sponsor given the strength of their brand, ferrari continue to receive money from P. Morris who is effectively a tobacco company.
Mercedes have a great global brand and can also attract sponsors or partners.
Other teams will struggle. Look at teams like Williams, Mclaren and Renault and RP. They do not have an immediate international brand despite relative fame in their own circles, Mclaren especially.
But there are also other considerations.
Renault is a state owned car company - therefore the Renault team has links to the french government in one way or another. Renault as a car maker would struggle to justify being sponsored by a dodgy South American Oil Company - or equally a Russian bank with links to the Russian state.
It's not just what you can sell - but who your allowed to sell to. Also other sponsors have considerations as to who they can appear with as well. So its all very difficult.
As an example 'Heineken' beer pay around £80m or so to appear in James Bond films as the drink that James bond drinks. Imagine is they could be persuaded to join F1.. oh no wait... Driving and Drinking.. no can do

Sometimes you will see a team with 1 main sponsor and few others as the others have been veto'd by having the main sponsor. If you imagine the Renault ING days.. they were a huge bank - so you couldn't have the current RCA renault commerical services on the same car.
So Yes renault may have 30 sponsors but they all work in harmony...
Mclaren have sold space to Coca-Cola - but even they were reluctant to join a sport so entrenched in perceived 'old' technologies and wealth and glamour.. they could have gone to FE..
Renault have an operating budget of approx £400 or Euro's or whatever.
Surely the Principals job is to make sure they spend this money wisely. So investment in infrastructure, hiring key personnel, etc.
Mclaren realised this last year. It couldn't pay Alonso what they were paying him, and justify this. you could probably hire 10 Norris's for the salary of 1 Alonso. Zak brown had the bravery and skill to facilitate Alonso's sabbatical or dummy retirement - so he could spend the money elsewhere and its working.

Cyril isnt doing a 'bad' job, he has Re-invested in facilities, new Wind tunnel Etc, hired personnel, and got a top driver. It all makes sense. That's why he has the support of the board. He is doing it the right way.
Time will tell if this long term re-building job will get Renault to where they are - but they must continue to show incremental improvement, that is the key.

I know this was a typo/missed out the million, but it made me laugh Don`t think you`re far off though...

[JordanMugen]

At Viry-Châtillon, two new management positions have been created: Christophe Mary has been named Director of Engineering and will arrive on August 1st, while Stéphane Rodriguez has been appointed Project and Purchasing Director within the Technical Department. Both will report to the Engine Technical Director, Rémi Taffin.

At Enstone, current Deputy Chief Designer Matt Harman has been appointed Engineering Director within the Technical Department and will report to Chassis Technical Director, Nick Chester.

All three will sit on Renault F1 Team’s Management Board. These reinforcements will allow Nick and Rémi to increase their focus on the performance of the chassis and engine while overseeing the entire technical program with internal and external stakeholders.

Previously, Christophe Mary held technical responsibilities for 14 years at Ferrari F1 and for four years at Mercedes HPE. Most recently, he held the position of Chief Systems and Powertrain Engineer at PSA Motorsport.

Superb stuff!

Mary sounds like a very wise signing as engineering director for the PU team, while Harman will surely perform well as chassis engineering director.

[JordanMugen]

Pleasing to see new Dupont sponsorship on the Renault cars.

[JordanMugen]

Cyril Abeitoul says:

Do you know how much we spend here? We operate with the budget of Toro Rosso. And we do not believe that putting more money makes the difference. No, because we are at the doors of 2021, when there will be a budgetary ceiling. Instead of wasting a lot of resources, we can take a look at McLaren, because I know their numbers and I can tell you they have a few hundred people more than us. How far are they from us? Makes sense? Not for now. Start to have it when there is a budget ceiling, which is when the way you invest your resources will matter much more than the resources you have.

https://soymotor.com/articulos/cyril-ab ... sso-963788
via Google translate

Explosive stuff! If they have the (chassis?) budget like Toro Rosso, how are Renault ever going to win anything!?

Our budget is at 350 million. Mercedes is in more than 500 million. We will never put 150 million more, because it does not make any sense. It does not correspond to the value of Formula 1 for us.

I don't think that even selling sponsorship can make up this 150m Euro difference.

[Jambier]

Renault have a low budget like Alfa, Racing point.

They are now fighting witch Alfa, just ahead of Williams

Regarding budget it make sense. But they are supposed to be a works team....

I don't get why they came back in 2016 if there goal is I don't know 2023?

Because 2021 cars with big rules change will be developed without budget ceiling.
Big teams will spend a lot, an enormous budget to prepare this year.

Renault will not so obviously they will fail again in 2021

[Mclarensenna]

Renault in 2019 has a GP2 engine, with a GP2 chassis and now on top GP2 strategies which cost them points.
How does Cyril still keep his job when Torro Rosso a team with 1/3 the budget are faster?

[Jaisonas]

Maybe they shouldn't have spent 30 mil on a driver. Just saying